Let us discuss the politics of the criminal justice system. Post examples of injustice at the hands of police or prosecutors that has a political angle. Then somebody will be along shortly to explain why this particular case is normal and not political. I suppose deeper discussion of the criminal justice system is OK too, if you must.

Talking about prison rape:

http://www.economist.com/node/186514...ry_id=18651484

For comparison, there were about 88,000 rapes reported to the FBI that year. Easily more than 80% of rapes happen in prison.

I didn't expect the staff to be the majority of the rapists.

Bonus material on prison guards:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...510530398.html

Why is this political?

In one sense it isn't. Political views about prison rape range from that's what they deserve to meaningless lip service. Nobody really cares. But prisoners are by definition under the control of the state. Complete indifference to the humanity of prisoners reflects horribly on our society. It's the sort of thing I think about when people talk about how uncivilized those other guys are.

if 80% of rapes happen in prison and the majority of those rapes are by guards does that mean >40% of all rapes in all of USA are committed by prison guards?
i find this hard to believe, and nonetheless disgusting.
i also wonder if the pseudoprivate prisons have more or less of a rape problem

The math seems correct, although you limit the conclusion to the United States when your assumptions are not explicity so limited.

There's a selection bias there. Prisoners are probably much more likely to report it when they are raped by guards than when they are raped by other inmates. The vast majority of prison rapes are probably still inmate on inmate imo.

There's also the issue that inmates don't really have the "right" to consent to sex, so all consensual sex between inmates and guards as well as consensual sex between inmates is considered rape.

Also, many times inmates will consent to sex with each other then due to "rep" issues will claim rape.

Not saying violent Oz type rapes don't occur in prison but it's not as often as those statistics show.

I'd be interested in hearing more from you. I friend of mine ran the gang unit in one of our max security prisons for a number of years and I have learned a lot about what prison life is like from him but any additional info is appreciated. Do you think that guys doing like 5 years or less will consent to being someone's bitch because of free choice? What about lifer's? Do inmates freely choose to be 'catchers' and not pitchers?

Wat?

Prisoners = 15yo girls? I'm missing something.

I placed the word "right" in quotation marks as I am referencing law, not natural rights.

In most states, having sexual relations with an inmate is rape, particularly if you're a staff member. Regardless of whether the inmate consented or not. Sex between inmates is also against prison rules. This is because of the large amounts of violence sex, or more specifically, couples, can create in a prison environment.

I think those rules make sense. It gives protection to the people who are raped and would be forced to claim it is consensual because they are afraid of worse punishments.

The situation w/r/t to rape in the current penal system is absolutely disgusting. I can't say that I have an actual pragmatic solution, I just wanna say that current attitudes toward it are insane.

That's absurd.

This, and I'd add that reporting a rape by another inmate would be considered "snitching" and could end up getting you killed.


I'd guess that the vast majority of the "sexual assaults" reportedly committed by guards were male guards on female prisoners. Some were legitimate rapes or use of coercion to obtain sex. Some were consensual sex that got reported as an assault when the relationship went pear-shaped. A lot were likely bull**** attempts to get even with a guard they didn't like.

I'm a little curious as to how you think the typical case plays out where an inmate accuses a guard of rape without rock solid evidence. I think what happens is some combination of nothing and guards retaliating against the prisoner.

Remember that even if there's not enough evidence to convict in a court of law, an accusation (or, even worse, multiple accusations) could easily trainwreck a career.



Part of that was going off one of the prison docs MSNBC is always running. Pretty blond girl admitted that she'd seduce male guards then blackmail them into doing favors. Another said she could sometimes do the same even when she hadn't fooled around with the guard (use the threat of an accusation to get her way). I'm guessing a very high percentage of women in prison have been prostitutes at some time, and an even higher percentage are accustomed to using their sexuality to game the system.

I can't speak to this specifically, and without revealing too much I know of a case where a prisoner accused a guard (and other guards) of misconduct. Due to circumstances that occured prior to him being incarcerated he won the case (he did some shiat to the guards). I know for a fact his story is bs and he won because he knew enought to know what would 'look good' on paper and would seem to give the guards clear motive to do stuff to him.

Kind of like a child molester showing up at a lawyers office all beat up and claiming that the father of the child he was convicted of molesting beat him up.... pfft.

Agreed.

Guys, sexual assault and rape are not the same thing. It's unlikely that male prisoners are being actually raped by prison guards, and far more likely that a lot of the "cavity searches" and other practices are being reported as sexual assault. And I say this not to defend guards in any way, but because it's important to get this stuff right when speaking to the general public. There's no need to sensationalize any of it, it's mind blowingly and heart breakingly horrific as is.

One thing worth mentioning: our system seems expressly designed to turn non-violent offenders who ****ed up once or twice into violent career felons unable to function on the outside. Everything about how prisoners have to act on the inside to simply survive makes it ever more difficult for them to assimilate once they get out.


I, for one, would like to see community service (legit community service, like digging ditches and cleaning garbage off Interstates; not the BS musicians and athletes end up doing) become the norm for first time non-violent offenders. Barring that, they should at least never ever be housed with violent felons.

Agreed big time. The system is whack. If I were to go to prison I would have to join a gang and do stuff for a gang. Im no angel but I don't do random violence. In prison it is a requirement.

How the hell is it possible for someone to be raped in prison? Don't you need some privacy or do the guards just turn a blind eye?

There aren't guards everywhere, and they especially can't keep an eye on every cell all day long.

post brings the lulz.

People in prison are not in their cells all the time. They do work, have some yard time, time in showers, etc.

So it actually turns out that males have a higher staff sexual victimization rate than females. Source, see table on page 13.

I think the idea that the big driver of guard sexual abuse is femmes fatales seducing guards is pretty ludicrous. Almost as ludicrous as the idea that prisoner-guard "relationships" going south is a big factor. How do you think these seductions and relationships go down? It seems to me like it would always have to involve a guard who is looking to use his power to take sexual advantage of women. It's not like they're going to bump into each other in the exercise yard and then discover that they're soulmates over a shared cafeteria meal and a nightcap of radiator hooch.

See my earlier post. Of course male inmates have a higher "staff victimization" rate, because under the parameters of the study, if a male inmate seduces a female guard and ends up having consensual sex with her, he's just been "victimized".

You really need to google "Prison Rape Elimination Act" and understand what you're reading before consuming the study in the OP.

When you read "Males are victimized by staff more than females" you don't understand what is meant by the word "victimized" in that sentence and your assumption is some closet homosexual guard violently raping some unwilling inmate, when in reality what you have is some dip**** female guard with a GED and self esteem issues listening to a bunch of convicts tell her how beautiful she is and she decides "Hey, I'll sleep with him". Then he gets tired of her, sends a letter to the Warden, she's prosecuted, and the inmate is chalked up as a "victim" in this study.

Some victim, right?