Israeli containment thread

[Bill Haywood]

Originally Posted by Hadis

Wait,wait what? Is Gamblor/Israel somehow responsible for U.S. crimes?

No, of course not. I said US crimes were worse than Israel's. He said the Arabs and various other villains are far worse than US or Israel. I gave stats on scale of US aggression to show that the knee jerk argument "my pile of bodies is lower than your pile" is not much of a defense.

the politicians are a barometer for the populace mood.

Sometimes. But if that were true in the U.S., we'd be out of Afghanistan, and heads would have rolled for the 2008 economic meltdown. Sometimes it's the politicians driving extremism.

[Hadis]

Originally Posted by Bill Haywood

Sometimes. But if that were true in the U.S., we'd be out of Afghanistan, and heads would have rolled for the 2008 economic meltdown. Sometimes it's the politicians driving extremism.

I think it is fair to say that it is true in Israel, because of more dynamic political system.

[Hadis]

Originally Posted by champstark

Aljazeera: In Israel, there is no word for refugee, and the government has deemed these Africans to be "infiltrators" or "economic migrants". Netanyahu listed "infiltrators" as a threat to the security and identity of a Jewish state. "This phenomenon is very grave and threatens the social fabric of society, our national security and our national identity," he said on May 29.

Originally Posted by Gamblor

By the way, you know how I know your al Jazeera article is complete and utter nonsense and unresearched Arabist propaganda?

The Hebrew word for "refugee" is "פליטים". Or "Plitim".

Oh missed it,yeah that is true.

[chisness]

Netanyahu's fb page uses the word infiltrators (example: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...8602075&type=1)

[champstark]

Originally Posted by Hadis

Oh missed it,yeah that is true.

found this from a few years ago that discusses the etymology of the word in Hebrew--was a pretty interesting read

http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/50635/refugees

[ShttsWeak]

same old same old

[Howard Beale]

I'm curious as to what Israelis think is going to happen when the Brotherhood takes over in Egypt and the Sunnis take over in Syria. Another 2-front war eventually?

[Hadis]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

I'm curious as to what Israelis think is going to happen when the Brotherhood takes over in Egypt and the Sunnis take over in Syria. Another 2-front war eventually?

Personally, I think the the area is moving toward more Democratic one.
And i expect the take over by the radicals to be a short one in the more long term view.

[Howard Beale]

Originally Posted by Hadis

Personally, I think the the area is moving toward more Democratic one.
And i expect the take over by the radicals to be a short one in the more long term view.

'Short one', heh, you've got that right apparently as far as Egypt is concerned if today's news is any indication. Generals gonna General, I suppose.

[champstark]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

I'm curious as to what Israelis think is going to happen when the Brotherhood takes over in Egypt and the Sunnis take over in Syria. Another 2-front war eventually?

Outright war between Israel and Egypt or Israel and Syria isn't super realistic any more simply because of Israel's flat out dominance militarily over those countries, not to mention US support, IMO. Egypt can make life extremely difficult for Israel, though.

[Gamblor]

Originally Posted by Hadis

Personally, I think the the area is moving toward more Democratic one.
And i expect the take over by the radicals to be a short one in the more long term view.

Personally, I disagree. I think we're going to get a classic, Middle East-style one-time election and (especially now that the Islamists are in power) a permanent state of "emergency government." So another 30 years before the next Arab spring.

Whatever marketer came up with that name was a genius. Convince everyone that the Arab world is coming out of the shadows and prepared to embrace liberalism, and boom Tunisia, Libya, Egypt (and soon Syria) all elect Islamist (or at least Islamist-inspired) parties. Back to the dark ages.

[Gamblor]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

I'm curious as to what Israelis think is going to happen when the Brotherhood takes over in Egypt and the Sunnis take over in Syria. Another 2-front war eventually?

Nope. Even they're not stupid to suddenly all-out attack Israel.

It'll be a 2-front war in a different sense

1) same old continuous low-level terror, military antagonism, arms and financial support for Hezbolla/Hamas, or whatever group they feel like supporting depending on ideology/religion/politics, etc etc.
2) same old continuous propaganda campaign to keep the people focused on Israel as the source of all of their problems and hijacking political fora to pressure israel into concessions.

The only real dangerous difference is a reduced US influence as a moderating factor. Egypt/Iran step in to fill the vacuum.

[Gamblor]

Originally Posted by chisness

Netanyahu's fb page uses the word infiltrators (example: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...8602075&type=1)

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-18/u...ement?_s=PM:US

Originally Posted by "CNN

Nearly 400,000 people were deported from the United States in the past fiscal year, the largest number in the history of the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency, the government announced Tuesday.

The year-end removal numbers "underscore the administration's focus on removing individuals ... that fall into priority areas" such as lawbreakers, threats to national security and repeat violators, the agency said in a news release.

Overall in fiscal year 2011, immigration officials said, 396,906 individuals were removed....

"All told, this administration has deported nearly 1.2 million people, leaving a wake of devastation in Latino communities across the nation," Joanne Lin, ACLU legislative counsel, said in a news release.

So a few thousand in Israel get tons of airplay, but 1.2 million forcibly deported under the supposedly liberal Obama administration?

Are you cacklers indignant at Obama? Or is there something about calling Israel "racist" that you just find irresistible?

[Gamblor]

Originally Posted by Bill Haywood

Well let's see. US death call is close to 3 million in Korea, two million in Vietnam, both countries that could not threaten our shores. We were also an essential part of what produced another two million dead in Cambodia. Hundreds of thousands in a series of Mideast wars against people who did not attack us.

And you say you others are worse. That's no defense.

This post is complete BS. Literally BS.

In none of those wars (save the Mideast), was the United States a primary belligerent, and the US entered both wars after the Soviet Union offered military support to an aggressor. I'm not American, but the lies that you peddle are ridiculous. To simply credit every single casualty (and your numbers are also off) caused by US allies to the United States, for the purposes of comparing the US to those that were more purposefully and directly slaughtering people for ideology, would be hilarious were it not so disturbing.

Also the only acceptable reason for going to war is a direct attack on US shores? Are you aware of how depedent the economy and security is on overseas interests? I can't believe the level of shortsightedness and BS in this post.

[champstark]

Originally Posted by Gamblor

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-18/u...ement?_s=PM:US



So a few thousand in Israel get tons of airplay, but 1.2 million forcibly deported under the supposedly liberal Obama administration?

Are you cacklers indignant at Obama? Or is there something about calling Israel "racist" that you just find irresistible?

I'm not happy with plenty of what Obama (and Bush, etc.) has done, especially with regard to immigration (although his recent executive order allowing children brought here illegally to stay is a step in the right direction). But no one in his administration has come out with blatantly racist statements about Latinos--in the US they would be fired instantly and their public life would pretty much be over.

****

I don't understand why you just assume people are OK with stuff going on in the US. This is the thread to discuss Israel-related stuff, and it seems like a pretty weak and off topic argument to keep bringing up US domestic policy and some supposed double standard that doesn't even exist (for me at least).

If anything I'm MORE upset about dumb racist **** in the US than in Israel AINEC.