The Great ObamaCare Debate, Part 237: Back to Court - Page 109 - Politics and Economics

Yes they definitely can. Kids age 0-2 are more expensive to insure than adults under age ~30. Ages 3-18 should be less expensive but with guaranteed-issue rates they should still be around $125-200/mo. Most of the plans I sell now kids ages 3-18 cost around $70-120/mo.

05-28-2013 , 11:07 PM

#2702

Justin A

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 9,010

In 2014 all kids age 0-20 will have same rate, which will be about half of the 40 year old rate, and 63.5% of the 21 year old rate.

05-28-2013 , 11:47 PM

#2703

wj94

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Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 7,951

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin A

In 2014 all kids age 0-20 will have same rate, which will be about half of the 40 year old rate, and 63.5% of the 21 year old rate.

So $110-200/mo for a silver plan then. Multiply that by 2-3 children and your family rates can easily end up at $1000/mo or more.

05-29-2013 , 12:05 AM

#2704

Effen

CRAB

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 24,004

ya im just gonna eat whatever penalties there are until they're incredibly onerous.

paying 5k/yr or more for something you try desperately not to use seems dumb

05-29-2013 , 08:05 AM

#2705

Benholio

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Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 8,292

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effen

ya im just gonna eat whatever penalties there are until they're incredibly onerous.

paying 5k/yr or more for something you try desperately not to use seems dumb

Which of course means you are just freeloading on our dime for emergency services. Not that there's anything wrong with that, I suppose. It is legal and all.

05-29-2013 , 08:11 AM

#2706

FlyWf

It's the other way

Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 58,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effen

ya im just gonna eat whatever penalties there are until they're incredibly onerous.

paying 5k/yr or more for something you try desperately not to use seems dumb

Does your employer not offer health insurance?

05-29-2013 , 08:29 AM

#2707

neg3sd

banned

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 3,335

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benholio

Which of course means you are just freeloading on our dime for emergency services. Not that there's anything wrong with that, I suppose. It is legal and all.

What freeloading? I've consumed virtually no health services from 18 to 64 years. Emergency services are only free for those with no net worth and little annual salary.

05-29-2013 , 11:17 AM

#2708

Benholio

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 8,292

Quote:

Originally Posted by neg3sd

What freeloading? I've consumed virtually no health services from 18 to 64 years. Emergency services are only free for those with no net worth and little annual salary.

So if you got into an accident and had a $200,000 hospital bill, you'd be able to pay it?

05-29-2013 , 01:06 PM

#2709

neg3sd

banned

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 3,335

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benholio

So if you got into an accident and had a $200,000 hospital bill, you'd be able to pay it?

I'm on medicare. You guys will pay for it.

05-29-2013 , 01:43 PM

#2710

Benholio

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 8,292

Neg3sd, I think we got mixed up. I was replying to Effen, who I presume isn't covered by medicare and was talking about going without insurance and paying the penalty:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effen

ya im just gonna eat whatever penalties there are until they're incredibly onerous.

paying 5k/yr or more for something you try desperately not to use seems dumb

05-29-2013 , 03:22 PM

#2711

neg3sd

banned

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 3,335

A $200,000 hospital bill for an uninsured person is only $40,000 for an insurance company. The healthcare system is ripping off those who are uninsured.

05-29-2013 , 03:26 PM

#2712

Low Key

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Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 33,327

yeah, wouldn't having the health care industry be not-for-profit be awesome?

05-29-2013 , 03:29 PM

#2713

Riverman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 73,135

Well, kind of. That $200,000 effectively never gets paid. How many people do you know with $200k of net assets who are also uninsured? People just struggle along in misery for a year or two then file bankruptcy. Sweet system.

As of 2009, 60 percent of personal bankruptcies were due to medical bills. It's probably higher today.

05-29-2013 , 07:15 PM

#2714

neg3sd

banned

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 3,335

Even with a platinum plan you are only entitled to 100 days in a hospital or nursing facility. That should sent most families into personal bankruptcy.

05-29-2013 , 07:20 PM

#2715

Riverman

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Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 73,135

Of course if heirs are concerned about long term care eliminating their inheritance they can buy long term care insurance.

Lots of self-described free marketers start getting mighty pissed when uncle sam's refusal to pay for indefinite care cuts into the money they're counting. Like they literally spend their days railing against government spending and their nights complaining that the government won't pay enough bills to let them get **** for free.

05-29-2013 , 08:24 PM

#2716

Justin A

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 9,010

Quote:

Originally Posted by neg3sd

Even with a platinum plan you are only entitled to 100 days in a hospital or nursing facility. That should sent most families into personal bankruptcy.

What are you talking about?

05-29-2013 , 09:49 PM

#2717

Howard Beale

Formerly red

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 22,190

I saw a small part of this Rand Paul speech:

highlight:

“Included among these codes,” the senator continued, “will be 312 new codes for injuries from animals; 72 new codes for injuries just from birds; 9 new codes for ‘injuries from the macaw.”‘

“The macaw?” he asked. “I’ve asked physicians all over the country, ‘Have you ever seen an injury from a macaw?”‘

He continued, adding that he had found “two new injury codes under Obamacare for ‘injuries sustained from a turtle.”‘

“Now, you might say, ‘Well, turtles are dangerous’ — but why do you have to have two codes?” he asked. “Your doctor has to inform the government whether you’ve been struck by a turtle or bitten by a turtle.”

He added: “There is a new code for … walking into a lamppost. There’s also a code for ‘walking into a lamppost, subsequent encounter.’”

“I guess that’s if you don’t learn,” he added. “[T]here is [also] a code … for ‘injuries sustained from burning water skis.”‘

That's damn hilarious, if true. Can anyone confirm?

05-29-2013 , 09:55 PM

#2718

Benholio

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 8,292

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

I saw a small part of this Rand Paul speech:

...

highlight:

“Included among these codes,” the senator continued, “will be 312 new codes for injuries from animals; 72 new codes for injuries just from birds; 9 new codes for ‘injuries from the macaw.”‘

“The macaw?” he asked. “I’ve asked physicians all over the country, ‘Have you ever seen an injury from a macaw?”‘

He continued, adding that he had found “two new injury codes under Obamacare for ‘injuries sustained from a turtle.”‘

“Now, you might say, ‘Well, turtles are dangerous’ — but why do you have to have two codes?” he asked. “Your doctor has to inform the government whether you’ve been struck by a turtle or bitten by a turtle.”

He added: “There is a new code for … walking into a lamppost. There’s also a code for ‘walking into a lamppost, subsequent encounter.’”

“I guess that’s if you don’t learn,” he added. “[T]here is [also] a code … for ‘injuries sustained from burning water skis.”‘

That's damn hilarious, if true. Can anyone confirm?

Those codes are real but they have nothing to do with Obamacare. They are part of an international document owned and published by the World Health Organization.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/polit...nt-1994/65663/

05-29-2013 , 10:08 PM

#2719

Howard Beale

Formerly red

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 22,190

Are they in the new law anyway?

Also: 'burning water skis?'

05-29-2013 , 11:01 PM

#2720

FlyWf

It's the other way

Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 58,097

Well, what do you mean "in" the new law? They will exist under Obamacare. But they would've existed without Obamacare. The coding thing is an entirely separate deal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The CDC

On January 16, 2009 HHS published a final rule adopting ICD-10-CM (and ICD-10-PCS) to replace ICD-9-CM in HIPAA transactions, effective implementation date of October 1, 2013. The implementation of ICD-10 was delayed from October 1, 2013 to October 1, 2014 by final rule CMS-0040-F issued on August 24, 2012.

05-29-2013 , 11:14 PM

#2721

goofball

Beat Nate Silver

Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 20,424

Upgrading to icd10 is, as far as I know, something the US is doing it's just separate from obamacare.

And yes there are some ridiculous sounding codes (actuaries like to joke about it, what's the code for alien abduction first second third encounter and does it deliniate by rectal probe vs. not. aren't actuaries a fun-loving bunch) but more complete coding is the first step to more compete information on how and what health care is being delivered and maybe - I dunno, identify places to improve / change / whatever.

05-29-2013 , 11:14 PM

#2722

goofball

Beat Nate Silver

Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 20,424

Oh, ponied but I definitely gave a more complete answer.

05-29-2013 , 11:20 PM

#2723

Howard Beale

Formerly red

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 22,190

Well, I have a follow-up cholesterol test in 3 months and I am going to ask the doctor how he bills for injuries resulting from burning water skis just for the lols. I'll segue into turtle bites. And, who knows, maybe they're in his computer.

Oh, btw, my doc says the new law is never going to work, fwiw.

05-29-2013 , 11:22 PM

#2724

goofball

Beat Nate Silver

Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 20,424

he might not be upgraded yet

05-29-2013 , 11:42 PM

#2725

Howard Beale

Formerly red

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 22,190

Quote:

Originally Posted by goofball

he might not be upgraded yet

If anybody is he is. I've got a great Internest. The problem for me, though, is that he's too good. Did you know that there are 5 kinds of cholesterol? I know this is a derail but it's for your health. Before I went to him I only knew about the HDL/LDL thing. So mine are ok and so are another 2. The 5th one sent him into a frenzy of pill prescribing. I objected '4 out of 5 seems ok to me' but he won't hear of it. So now I'm trying to lose weight, the damn kill-joy.

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