Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Politics political discourse

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-06-2011, 04:19 PM   #26
Wynton
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Wynton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Graphville
Posts: 15,188
Re: The GOP war on voting

Time for a universal retinal-scan system (like the kind that was ubiquitous in "Minority Report").

Personally, I think it would be cool never to have to carry ID around, even if Big Brother always knew where I was.
Wynton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:19 PM   #27
[Phill]
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
[Phill]'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 52,513
Re: The GOP war on voting

There has never, Ever, been shown to be a problem which ID solves.

IDing voters disenfranchises people, a proven fact, and yet there is no benefit from doing so. None.
[Phill] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:24 PM   #28
LastLife
Pooh-Bah
 
LastLife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,515
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by dinopoker View Post
Looks like in addition to trying to destroy the economy,
...
LastLife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:45 PM   #29
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
It's not overblown if they can tip a few districts and maybe even a state from dem to republican over this.
I'm sorry, but requiring people to show an appropriate ID is hardly worthy of the title 'War on Voting.'
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:49 PM   #30
Low Key
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Low Key's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Thank you, Florida
Posts: 33,331
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Hmmm, which banned poster are you? I'm going to guess the initials NVE
Yay! Someone else likes my game!
Low Key is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:51 PM   #31
Low Key
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Low Key's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Thank you, Florida
Posts: 33,331
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
I'm sorry, but requiring people to show an appropriate ID is hardly worthy of the title 'War on Voting.'
Given that evidence shows requiring an ID doesn't stop the non-existent boogeyman of voter fraud, and it is shown that the only thing it does stop is valid registered voters from voting, what choices do we have about the intentions of people who push this rubbish?

Are they either a.) ignorant, or b.) evil?
Low Key is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 04:56 PM   #32
suzzer99
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: on top of the bell curve
Posts: 80,770
Re: The GOP war on voting

Brilliant strategy by republicans. Pick something that every middle class white person has, and doesn't understand why it might be difficult for poor black people to get, then require that to vote. "Herp I don't see how requiring an ID is so bad. I have one derp."
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:02 PM   #33
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by DVaut1 View Post
The whole ****ing point is to come up with bizarre barriers to cross that are ostensibly not discriminatory but are. How are poll taxes discriminatory? Grandfather clauses? Literacy tests? Eight box laws? In each case, the law is superficially non discriminatory but overwhelmingly disenfranchised poor people and minorities.

How it's discriminatory:

- come up with a litany of documents required to procure government ID
- empower registers to arbitrarily enforce the requirements.

To wit:

http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/...eaucrat-tells/



"IDs are easy to acquire, and free!!!!" are nice cute GOP talking points to trot out, but yes, it's often a burden for 96 year old black people to get to an office and then produce the litany of documents a white Tennessee bureaucrat might require and approve of.

The GOP knows the type of people who are qualified voters are going to have a tough time meeting the ID requirements are poor and/or black. The GOP media machines know they can frighten their anger bears to agitate for voter ID laws by shouting ACORN and FRAUD and TONY ROMO MICKEY MOUSE in the same sentence enough. Strategy crafted and now implemented.
I don't see why a poor old white republican couldn't run into the same issues? Without more evidence, it seems quite a stretch to say this is some big GOP conspiracy to supress voting. Like it's just as plausible that they really could believe that voter fraud is still a problem despite so much evidence to the contrary. I mean these are people the majority of whom believe there is a all powerful being who they can talk to and will grant them wishes if they ask the right way and catch him on the right day, also they believe mmgw is a giant conspiracy mostly because that's their gut feeling in spite of mountains of scientific evidence pointing to the opposite conclusion.
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:03 PM   #34
Low Key
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Low Key's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Thank you, Florida
Posts: 33,331
Re: The GOP war on voting

Maybe we can require people to have bank accounts or cars to be able to vote. I mean, all Good Americans have bank accounts and cars, right? So only bad foreigners trying to impersonate a Good American will not have these things and thus be unable to vote.

LIBERTY SOLVED!
Low Key is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:04 PM   #35
Low Key
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Low Key's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Thank you, Florida
Posts: 33,331
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
I don't see why a poor old white republican couldn't run into the same issues?
Obviously this will cut into Republican votes, but I'm pretty certain they've looked at polling numbers and know exactly who this targets, and how little they'll be hurt compared to their opponents.
Low Key is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:05 PM   #36
suzzer99
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: on top of the bell curve
Posts: 80,770
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
I don't see why a poor old white republican couldn't run into the same issues? Without more evidence, it seems quite a stretch to say this is some big GOP conspiracy to supress voting. Like it's just as plausible that they really could believe that voter fraud is still a problem despite so much evidence to the contrary.
Yeah, that's why republicans are pushing this so hard (and why democrats are fighting it so hard). One imaginary case of voter fraud. Has nothing to do with demographics of voters.

Try to be more obtuse.
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:07 PM   #37
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Key View Post
Given that evidence shows requiring an ID doesn't stop the non-existent boogeyman of voter fraud, and it is shown that the only thing it does stop is valid registered voters from voting, what choices do we have about the intentions of people who push this rubbish?

Are they either a.) ignorant, or b.) evil?
Umm, considering an overwhelming percentage of these people are A) moderate to extremely religious

And/or B) willing to discount MMGW based largely on 'gut instinct' or their religious convictions then I'd say the chances of it being a are very high.
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:08 PM   #38
Morris King
banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: bad etiquette
Posts: 3,063
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by ogallalabob View Post
Everyone has a right to vote. No problem with them voting. Would also like them to be required to work for their check.
Single moms are already working for their welfare check IMO. Try taking care of a kid for a day & tell me that **** ain't work.
Morris King is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:08 PM   #39
MrWookie
Don't Call Me Shirley
 
MrWookie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Treating my drinking problem.
Posts: 83,585
Re: The GOP war on voting

If the GOP cared about duplicate voters, all they'd have to do would be to require people to do what they did in Iraq and/or Afghanistan after people voted there for the first time. They stuck their fingers in some blue dye that was hard to wash off. People with blue fingers had voted, and people without hadn't. This could be added to polling stations in areas that were paranoid about vote fraud, and it wouldn't discriminate against poor minorities in any way. Which is exactly why the GOP doesn't want to do it.
MrWookie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:10 PM   #40
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Key View Post
Obviously this will cut into Republican votes, but I'm pretty certain they've looked at polling numbers and know exactly who this targets, and how little they'll be hurt compared to their opponents.
What makes you so certain of this other than the fact that you're assuming their intentions are nefarious?
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:18 PM   #41
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Yeah, that's why republicans are pushing this so hard (and why democrats are fighting it so hard). One imaginary case of voter fraud. Has nothing to do with demographics of voters.

Try to be more obtuse.
Please explain how the problems DVaut enumerated couldn't also effect poor/old white Republican voters.

The fact that few cases of voter fraud have actually been found is not nearly as damning evidence of nefarious intent as you guys seem to think. People hold on to highly irrational beliefs and concerns in the face of contradictory evidence all the time, if not we could create AC-topia in like a few years.
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:21 PM   #42
suzzer99
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: on top of the bell curve
Posts: 80,770
Re: The GOP war on voting

Ugh obviously you have zero desire to try to see the truth behind this, even though it's painfully obvious to anyone with half a brain. Troll on...
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:21 PM   #43
Max Raker
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Max Raker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lebesgue Airlines
Posts: 15,738
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
What makes you so certain of this other than the fact that you're assuming their intentions are nefarious?
They can be ignorant and at the same time nefarious. They might think that illegal immigrants are actually voting in large numbers but they also don't mind doing things that make it hard for other poor people to vote.
Max Raker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:22 PM   #44
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWookie View Post
If the GOP cared about duplicate voters, all they'd have to do would be to require people to do what they did in Iraq and/or Afghanistan after people voted there for the first time. They stuck their fingers in some blue dye that was hard to wash off. People with blue fingers had voted, and people without hadn't. This could be added to polling stations in areas that were paranoid about vote fraud, and it wouldn't discriminate against poor minorities in any way. Which is exactly why the GOP doesn't want to do it.
This is a much more convincing argument. Has this ever been proposed and/or rejected? It seems like the perfect counter-strategy for Dems concerned about voter-suppression conspiracies. So, have any Dems proposed this as a counter-offer/compromise? If so, how did it go? If not, why not?
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:22 PM   #45
suzzer99
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: on top of the bell curve
Posts: 80,770
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
Please explain how the problems DVaut enumerated couldn't also effect poor/old white Republican voters.
There aren't as many of them. Seriously, you cannot be this out of it.
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:23 PM   #46
Max Raker
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Max Raker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lebesgue Airlines
Posts: 15,738
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
Please explain how the problems DVaut enumerated couldn't also effect poor/old white Republican voters.
Republicans would be better off if no poor people voted even though some of them vote republican.
Max Raker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:24 PM   #47
Max Raker
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Max Raker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lebesgue Airlines
Posts: 15,738
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWookie View Post
If the GOP cared about duplicate voters, all they'd have to do would be to require people to do what they did in Iraq and/or Afghanistan after people voted there for the first time. They stuck their fingers in some blue dye that was hard to wash off. People with blue fingers had voted, and people without hadn't. This could be added to polling stations in areas that were paranoid about vote fraud, and it wouldn't discriminate against poor minorities in any way. Which is exactly why the GOP doesn't want to do it.
I don't really like this. I don't vote and don't want people to know that because of their high horsed lectures I will be forced to hear...
Max Raker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:25 PM   #48
suzzer99
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: on top of the bell curve
Posts: 80,770
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
This is a much more convincing argument. Has this ever been proposed and/or rejected? It seems like the perfect counter-strategy for Dems concerned about voter-suppression conspiracies. So, have any Dems proposed this as a counter-offer/compromise? If so, how did it go? If not, why not?
Obviously anywhere this is happening the republicans have enough of a majority that they don't need to compromise. I think we all know how much republicans love to compromise anyway.
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:40 PM   #49
13ball
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
13ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: No Quarter is a Sandy Hook Truther
Posts: 12,328
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Money2Burn View Post
I don't see why a poor old white republican couldn't run into the same issues? Without more evidence, it seems quite a stretch to say this is some big GOP conspiracy to supress voting. Like it's just as plausible that they really could believe that voter fraud is still a problem despite so much evidence to the contrary. I mean these are people the majority of whom believe there is a all powerful being who they can talk to and will grant them wishes if they ask the right way and catch him on the right day, also they believe mmgw is a giant conspiracy mostly because that's their gut feeling in spite of mountains of scientific evidence pointing to the opposite conclusion.
A couple things:

1) As noted upthread by ifucankeepit, the Texas law allows gun licenses but not Texas University IDs to be used for voting. That's pretty obvious bias.

2) The Tennessee law that Dvaut had a post on allows absentee voter ballots. So a determined fraudster is just going to go the EZ absentee vote route, while a person who can't get an ID might not even know about the absentee ballot option or just might never get an ID at all. Many probably don't even know the law has changed.
13ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2011, 05:44 PM   #50
Money2Burn
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Misreading your post.
Posts: 10,861
Re: The GOP war on voting

Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Obviously anywhere this is happening the republicans have enough of a majority that they don't need to compromise. I think we all know how much republicans love to compromise anyway.
So the democrats thought of it, but didn't bother trying because what's the point? Really? No, I guess it's a much better strategy to not attempt to do anything that could possibly ruin the one conspiracy narrative that can be used time and again to energize your base and get the vote out. Let's keep demonizing the enemy by focusing on contrived narratives that create greater divisiveness and keep our constituents distracted from the fact that we are quite possibly just as evil as them if not slightly less ignorant.
Money2Burn is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v2.0.33 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ę 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online