Brexit Referendum - Page 56 - Politics and Economics

I hope we brexit.

The topic is an emotive one and those saying that so-called "emotional arguments" are invalid need a reality check, not least because without fail those remainers that are leveling such assertions are at the minimum comfortable, white collar folk who are forming all their opinions and conducting all their analyses in a hypothetical and intellectual vacuum. Some of those with emotional arguments have been directly affected by real-life consequences of some of the issues around which this referendum debate circulates and I would say their perspective is plenty valid (google the bob geldof/fishing boat/thames fiasco for a fine example).

If you live in a slice of middle England where everybody you are exposed to on a day-to-day basis is a white, professional, English-speaking, jovial face then your opinions on "the immigration issue" are idealist, hypothetical, academic and ultimately vacuous. You can say anything you want so long as it looks good and conforms to a few social, economic and philosophical norms. If the area you live in, the schools your children attend, the hospital you go to etc. are gradually filling with foreign nationals who do not speak the language, do not understand the culture, do not make any attempt to integrate into the local area or the country in general; who have vastly different social norms from you and your family, you might stop and re-evaluate, for "emotional" reasons. And would your opinion suddenly then become that of a heathen? Should we still embrace unbridled movement of people through an unregulated border because it is "always good for the economy" or, even worse, because to speak out against such a thing is automatically branded as racist? For those that think that the only folk that come here, come here to work for low wages and "do jobs Brits wouldn't do", your eyes would be opened.

The strain on our public services is tremendous, and is not being felt in real terms by the comfortable classes so much as it is by the lower, welfare, working and lower-middle classes.

My main gripe with the EU however, by a long shot, remains the fact that they are a foreign, un-elected group of clipboard-grabbing bureaucrats with absolute final say-so over our affairs. This simply cannot be good for our country or our people, there is no more blunt way of putting it. They will not have the best interests of this country at heart, or the people of this country, and will almost certainly not even have a vague notion of what such a thing might be. Instead, like some of the voices on this forum, their only motivation and interest will be the proliferation of big business, the wealthy class who are involved in it, keeping a healthy set of figures on an Excel spreadsheet, and even worse, the proliferation of the EU itself in the name of self-preservation at all costs.

By brexiting we are at least allowing a glimmer of hope that the most vague whiff of a democratic process that operates in our ham-fisted political system might one day allow for a government that puts the concerns of the community, the family, the working man and the country before or on an equal par with those of corrupt FTSE100 organisations and their ilk. By remaining, we are f***ed.

06-24-2016 , 04:17 AM

#1378

tomdemaine

Just tries harder

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 20,065

Quote:

Originally Posted by MvdB

they've been told forever that all unpopular policies were dictated by the EU, so many people have now been sold the illusion that leaving the EU will change some of those policies for the better.

Maaaybe one bright side is that when thing go entirely to **** people might start blaming the right people now. They'll probably find some other scapegoat though, the rise of faciscm is just as likely an outcome if not more.

06-24-2016 , 04:18 AM

#1379

Elrazor

losing momentum

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 13,798

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomdemaine

£200B lost on the ftse opening. GG you racist pricks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomdemaine

At least we can get rid of all our foriegn nurses and teachers and cripple healthcare and education in one stroke.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomdemaine

I hope every racist old ****er who voted for this **** has to eat cat food when their pension craters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1

Im going to party likes its 1939.

It's nice to see some of the "progressive" views on the referendum result, by the completely non-racist and rational stayers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by diebitter

It will turn every news report into comedy gold tho

I had a sneaky feeling that Boris holding a fish might swing it.

06-24-2016 , 04:18 AM

#1380

the pleasure

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 6,093

damn so actual citizens voted for this.

hell of a campaign. cant really point blame on one person it seems

06-24-2016 , 04:19 AM

#1381

the pleasure

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 6,093

Quote:

Originally Posted by MvdB

they've been told forever that all unpopular policies were dictated by the EU, so many people have now been sold the illusion that leaving the EU will change some of those policies for the better.

I see. so they can be "on their own and make their own rules? didnt think EU had that much control on a nation and how it ran things. i didn't think the EU had THAT much power

06-24-2016 , 04:19 AM

#1382

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by Habsfan09

You mean something like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFEeS2OXpoI

All I'm saying is to invest in trenches.

But seriously, I don't follow Euro politics any more than what I see on the nightly news or perhaps an article here and there from The Atlantic, Slate, whatever, so maybe I'm just wrong but... is nationalism making a major comeback all across Europe (and Russia)? I certainly hope not.

Should HRC just launch a preemptive war to save the world from Europe imploding again?

06-24-2016 , 04:20 AM

#1383

DrawNone

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 5,023

I mean they ****ing shot a politician in a country without guns and it still passed wtf

06-24-2016 , 04:22 AM

#1384

O.A.F.K.1.1

Ted Patrick

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,952

Dear Osbourne, if you were so keen on winning maybe you should have explained a bit more about your headline policy of AUSTERITY.

I know one might make the mistake of thinking the clues in the name, but some people seem to have not got the memo on what AUSTERITY, IT DOES WHAT IT SAYS ON THE TIN actually entails.

Thus people have attributed a wholly predictable loss in security, wages and living standards to the wrong causes.

Maybe a few:

"LOL wat EU and Immigrants? Hell no its AUSTERITY, the clues in the name, cmon guvnor."

Might have helped people with this confusion.

06-24-2016 , 04:23 AM

#1385

seattlelou

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 31,584

Quote:

Originally Posted by Habsfan09

Well for the rest of the world which suffered under our economic power to agree to bad trade deals this might be the beginning of something better. If the rest of the EU stays strong and even manages some reforms for the better we will remain powerful enough. For the UK everything is uncertain.

If the lowskilled factory workers really think they will get much higher wages when factories can just relocate their production will be in for a rough awakening. An example: The crabs we fish in the North sea are shipped to Belarus or Marocco to get shelled. Its cheapier to transport them back and forth rather than keep the jobs here. Few pages ago I also mentioned that a lot of car manufacturers relocated their production to Slowakia. I wouldn't wonder if in the wake of the Brexit other EU countries want all the airbus manucturing moved to the continent.

BAE (and tons of other UK MNC's) are probably looking pretty attractive at the moment. Looks like a buying opportunity.

06-24-2016 , 04:23 AM

#1386

MvdB

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,562

Quote:

Originally Posted by the pleasure

I see. so they can be "on their own and make their own rules? didnt think EU had that much control on a nation and how it ran things. i didn't think the EU had THAT much power

The EU doesn't have that much power. It has as much power as its members grants it, with nearly all decisions taken with unanimous consent.

06-24-2016 , 04:24 AM

#1387

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by the pleasure

trump victory wont cause our economy to crash

It will cause the entire global economy to instantly collapse. Western Civilisation just straight up ends if USA follows this path. Like, I don't think it's that much hyperbole.

06-24-2016 , 04:28 AM

#1388

the pleasure

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 6,093

isn't this Democracy at its finest tho? in its purest form?

06-24-2016 , 04:34 AM

#1389

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Roughly how correct is this take: not as big of a deal in and of itself, more so for ripple effects across Europe & potential dissolution of the EU in the future. If the EU remains stable, this isn't much cause for alarm except if you live in UK...? Is the UK dead as well? Like, odds Scotland leaves, Northern Ireland?

06-24-2016 , 04:36 AM

#1390

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by the pleasure

isn't this Democracy at its finest tho? in its purest form?

It is democracy. At its finest? How does that follow?

06-24-2016 , 04:36 AM

#1391

thethethe

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 8,493

Excuses and lies starting early.

06-24-2016 , 04:39 AM

#1392

tomdemaine

Just tries harder

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 20,065

Quote:

Asked by ITV's Good Morning Britain whether he could guarantee that the £350m that was sent to the EU would now go the NHS, Mr Farage said: “No I can’t, I would never have made that claim.

"That was one of the mistakes made by the Leave campaign.”

Lol "mistake". When you endlessly repeat something for 3 months I'm not sure how much of a mistake it really is.

06-24-2016 , 04:43 AM

#1393

57 On Red

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 5,746

Boris, of course, lives in London, which did not vote Stupid, so when he left the house earlier this morning he was confronted by a large and very hostile crowd. I don't know what they shouted at him because the BBC says it's not fit to repeat on the air.

06-24-2016 , 04:44 AM

#1394

steelhouse

banned

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 6,109

Quote:

Originally Posted by daca

So the UK lost 10-15-20% of its wealth overnight? There should have been more fearmongering tbh.

They are going to be sending less money to EU.
They are going to get less poor immigrants coming in.

Wealth will be gained, it won't be going to Greece. They are going to have to flush their Obama ways and get to work and go to school (a school they pay for).

06-24-2016 , 04:45 AM

#1395

aoFrantic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 25,221

steelhouse is having a wet dream with the cognitive dissonance to not realize how wrong he is still.

06-24-2016 , 04:48 AM

#1396

BAIDS

2013 FA Cup winner

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 32,645

ftse down 4%?

lol easiest recession ever

06-24-2016 , 04:48 AM

#1397

the pleasure

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 6,093

its not like EU will penalize and try to **** over england since I assume england buys a lot of **** right?

**** wasn't England one of the main reasons the EU was strong? italy and Greeces economy is trash and so is spains