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Old 02-08-2017, 12:37 AM   #1
PoolGuy
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Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

So, I was in a Survivor Pool that cost $250 to enter, we had approximately 400 entries for a prize pool of $88,000. It paid top 5, when we got down to 3 we did a chop with each of us taking $25,000 (or so we thought).

Today, I get an email from the guy running the pool that says;

Congrats on the 3 of you having such a great season!!! Job well done!!!

This is a difficult email for me to write because I do not (did not want to have to bring you into my current world).

I will be brief

As you all know - my father passed back in October. I am the executor of his estate. All routine and normal stuff. Unfortunately one of my siblings (the real life black sheep) is causing major problems and is contesting the will.

I have been dealing with this since the beginning of the new year and actually spent the last 4 hours in an office with the family attorney trying to resolve this issue.

The bottom line is that I am being strongly urged/advised not to move any money until this matter is resolved. This was actually advised by the court at a January 18th meeting.

I promise you that you will get every dollar of your winnings but I hope that you will understand and work with me on this. I am doing all in my power to resolve this issue ASAP but it could be 2 weeks and it could be 2 months. I promise that as soon as I know anything that I will contact you ASAP.

In the meantime I have no problem giving you checks as requested with the amounts - I would just ask that you hold them until I give the green light.

For those that have asked for cash - that is still possible but again must wait until I give the green light. So your option is I can send you the checks equaling the amount owed you and at time released you can either deposit or we can arrange at the point to meet you with cash.

Again I offer my deepest apology for putting you in the middle of this mess, but truly hope you will understand.



So my question to the forum is how would you handle this?
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Old 02-08-2017, 02:32 AM   #2
Da_Nit
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Damn what's your options? Play nice but stay in contact and be clear you expect this to resolve quickly.
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:05 AM   #3
Iowa!
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Request a check and cash it immediately. If he doesn't send then threaten to report him to the FBI.
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:24 AM   #4
overcast
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

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Request a check and cash it immediately. If he doesn't send then threaten to report him to the FBI.
Yep.


Story doesn't add up. Was the dad the pool manager? The son/executor's money shouldn't be at issue over the will contest - the only way I can see that is if the account he kept it in was a joint account with his dad that would somehow be subject to the will. But even in that case, the account would likely be with right of survivorship, meaning it passes to the joint account holder rather than through the will.

If you want to play nice, I'd ask for something from the court showing that he can't move his personal money around. If you want to be paid, follow Iowa!'s advice.
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Old 02-08-2017, 03:11 PM   #5
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

stop everything, take the check and go to the bank. wait until the money fully clears to spend it, but no doubt whatsoever you get the check and immediately deposit it. your chances of ever getting paid are plummeting day by day. It's likely one of two things here; either this guy is 1) incompetent and is going to be able to find a way to pay you all or any of your money, or 2) planning on never paying you out on purpose and pocketing the money. Any scenario outside of that (while possible) is remote.

If he doesnt ever pay out TBH you're not left with much recourse here depending on where you live (that is the risk of illegal gambling.) But I would follow-up constantly and and firmly (not aggressive or physical, just frequent and consistent) until he finally realizes he is going to pay you or you'll make his life all the harder. Dont threaten tho, that only stands to make him more reluctant to pay you.

If he wont do a check tell him you need partial payment as a good faith and try to get 50% or 25% at least. Take anything you can get though and keep following up for more. Trust me, I've been in this scenario a few times and time is working against you right now.

BOL OP, let us know how the situation unfolds.
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Old 02-08-2017, 03:31 PM   #6
PoolGuy
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Thanks for the feedback so far. I've made arrangements to meet-up and get checks this weekend. I have partners on the winning pick so we each will get a check.

Guy running pool wants to give us "undated" checks and have us hold them until he gives "the green light" to cash. Those were his words on phone and his email, which I put in initial post. (good news, he returned my phone call promptly, so not dodging us yet)

If he fails to pay, I'll definitely put his name out there. He has been running pool for 12 years and fellow poker player won a couple years back and got paid promptly for around 15k.

Some of my concerns include that the pool manager has two brothers both of whom have served prison time, one for embezzlement/insurance fraud and the other for assault on multiple occasions.

As an aside, I created a new account to post this thread because, he knows who I am and many people in pool are also on 2+2. I'm trying to be discreet for now, as I do know that his Father did pass away, so that part of the story is true. Part that doesn't add up is how contesting will by sibling would effect this pool holdings.

So, if we cash our checks how do we know when they've "cleared". My concern, is he is using father passing/will/contested estate, as an excuse and may not have sufficient funds to cover our checks.

Is there a way to go to bank check is written on and see if there are sufficient funds to cover the checks???
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Old 02-08-2017, 05:02 PM   #7
Da_Nit
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

To me it seems clear he spent your money, probably gambling it. Was hoping he'd win or have gotten the inheritance by now. Until he gets the inheritance you're probably SOL.
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Old 02-09-2017, 08:04 AM   #8
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

GL, OP. I wouldn't expect that check to clear. If there was a chance it could, he wouldn't give it to you!
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Old 02-09-2017, 08:18 AM   #9
jh12547
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by Da_Nit View Post
To me it seems clear he spent your money, probably gambling it. Was hoping he'd win or have gotten the inheritance by now. Until he gets the inheritance you're probably SOL.
That would be my guess too. Years ago I did both a fantasy baseball and fantasy FB league with the same commish. There were no issues getting paid for the BB league but when it was time to get paid for FB it was a problem. Turns out he gambled all the baseball $$ away at the local casino and used the football buy in money to pay the baseball winnings. He was also waiting for an inheritance. Those of us that were owed money in FB got paid about 6 months later after his inheritance money came in.

GL OP
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Old 02-09-2017, 09:35 AM   #10
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Some Ponzi scheme hopefully he's got another fantasy baseball league so op can get paid.
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Old 02-09-2017, 11:05 AM   #11
overcast
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

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many people in pool are also on 2+2
Does he run other pools on here?
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Old 02-09-2017, 12:07 PM   #12
PoolGuy
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

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Does he run other pools on here?
He doesn't run the pools on here. He is located in NYC metro area. Several 2+2 participate. I'll post his name if he fails to pay-up. I've already been in touch with those that know about situation. All believe he will pay, as he has paid out over past 12 years running pool.

I'm not aware of any other pools that he runs. He has been returning calls and is planning to meet-up to give the "undated" checks. I will keep the thread informed of how things turn out.

Small chance he will use 2017 pool collections to pay-off this years winners, which then turns whole pool into a ponzi scheme.

I'm inclined to believe he is in some financial trouble and is buying time. He has a family, job, and no criminal record (despite both of his brothers serving prison time). He has lived in same home for over 10 years.

I'm trying to stay positive and optimistic. I'm avoiding threaten or hostile language for now, but agree time is NOT on my side. If he fails to pay my partners and I have a few ideas about how to make his life somewhat difficult.

It just sucks that what we were all celebrating is now turning into a sweat over whether we'll get paid. This could be become one of the worst bad beats of my life
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Old 02-09-2017, 01:13 PM   #13
DefNotRsigley
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

you're not getting paid
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Old 02-09-2017, 05:40 PM   #14
overcast
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoolGuy View Post
He doesn't run the pools on here. He is located in NYC metro area. Several 2+2 participate. I'll post his name if he fails to pay-up. I've already been in touch with those that know about situation. All believe he will pay, as he has paid out over past 12 years running pool.

I'm not aware of any other pools that he runs. He has been returning calls and is planning to meet-up to give the "undated" checks. I will keep the thread informed of how things turn out.

Small chance he will use 2017 pool collections to pay-off this years winners, which then turns whole pool into a ponzi scheme.

I'm inclined to believe he is in some financial trouble and is buying time. He has a family, job, and no criminal record (despite both of his brothers serving prison time). He has lived in same home for over 10 years.

I'm trying to stay positive and optimistic. I'm avoiding threaten or hostile language for now, but agree time is NOT on my side. If he fails to pay my partners and I have a few ideas about how to make his life somewhat difficult.

It just sucks that what we were all celebrating is now turning into a sweat over whether we'll get paid. This could be become one of the worst bad beats of my life
Sounds like N__h P___k? Runs it on yahoo, something about "for the kids"? Does a MM pool too?
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Old 02-09-2017, 06:03 PM   #15
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

The father thing is made up. He gambled whatever the 5th place money was and lost it hoping to win.
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Old 02-09-2017, 06:45 PM   #16
PoolGuy
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by overcast View Post
Sounds like N__h P___k? Runs it on yahoo, something about "for the kids"? Does a MM pool too?
It's not N__h P___k. Like I said if we don't get paid, I'll post his name, email address, and other contact info so no one else joins any of his pools.

If anyone out there has taken a "bad beat" on not getting paid on a pool and has advice guidance it will be much appreciated.

While I hate to agree with those folks who are simplistic and negative, I'm practical and it appears the money collected for the pool is gone.

The only hope I have is he is still communicating and responding to phone calls and emails. Once he stops communicating we see our only options left as making his life difficult which is really unpleasant for everyone and pretty much GUARANTEES we will never see any money.

As someone earlier in the thread recommended we are going to request some "good faith" money. IN other words, that he pays something, even it is only a couple of thousand.

Not sure how relevant this is but he It appears he paid 4th ($9,000) and 5th place ($3000).
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:09 AM   #17
DefNotRsigley
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

ask him to dig up the body and show it to you as proof
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:13 AM   #18
PoolGuy
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

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Originally Posted by DefNotRsigley View Post
ask him to dig up the body and show it to you as proof
Maybe I can hire your Uncle Darnell to do collection!
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:41 AM   #19
Da_Nit
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Need Moose and Rocco

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NO8zb5DG_gM
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Old 02-10-2017, 01:58 PM   #20
BrosefStalin75
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

It seems like these things are just commonplace anymore...I've always wondered what the best way is to handle this as I've been in these situations several times.

From my experience, odds are, you're getting conned here. Poor bastard likely spent/gambled the money away quickly and is in super-scramble mode to try to get as much money as possible to pay it off.

As some previous posters have detailed, don't threaten to harm him or send Rocco/Moose after him...you do that, he'll go dark Jimmy Hoffa-style or resort to some option that will be bad for you.

I found that just telling him clearly you know the money is gone and tell him you want your entry fee and 10% back immediately - so $2750. Then tell him you want multi-week payments of $900 until the debt is paid.

Unfortunately, going Soprano on this guy - unless you know some Haitians - is the wrong route to take. Something like this will work. Then advise the guy to retire from pool management.

Good luck OP
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Old 02-11-2017, 07:30 AM   #21
Mihkel05
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Remember when GoldenBears didn't pay out his full amount with some flimsy ass excuse?

Con men doing it.
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Old 02-11-2017, 10:15 AM   #22
DefNotRsigley
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

remember when he thought working as marketing manager for Dr. Bob and selectively reporting his results to paint Dr. Bob as a huge winner wasn't a scam either

not a similar situation, but i know of a guy who was on trial and what he did was he kidnapped the plantiff's daughter and tied her up in his Brooklyn basement. He ended up getting off not guilty (I guess that is how he stays filthy?), maybe try that?

Last edited by DefNotRsigley; 02-11-2017 at 10:21 AM.
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Old 02-11-2017, 11:54 AM   #23
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

Welcome Linda
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Old 02-11-2017, 11:59 AM   #24
Mihkel05
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Re: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay

He was really an amazingly dishonest person.
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Old 02-11-2017, 03:51 PM   #25
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UPDATE: Survivor Pool Manager Won't Pay 2/11/17

Saturday 2/11/17

Partner picked up 4 checks today for $6250 each. Two checks drawn on Wells Fargo, another on Chase, another on TD.

We promptly have our sister-in law who works at Wells Fargo, run checks and she says insufficient funds for either check. We high tail it over to Chase, where one of us has an account, teller says there are insufficient funds to cash that check (we didn't have a TD bank nearby).

One of the partners email guy running the pool and he responds within 10 minutes, saying basically money is tied up with his Father's estate and needs to get it released. He will be meeting with his lawyer on Tuesday 2/14 and will call with an update.

Our group believes he spent pool money and is counting on money that he was to inherit to pay back his "loan" from the pool.

Any suggestions on how to confront him when we talk on Tuesday?

In before "You ain't getting paid".
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