Hero is SB

Stacks:
UTG ($200)
UTG+1 ($200)
CO ($200)
BTN ($207)
SB ($447.27)
BB ($263.20)


Pre-Flop: ($3, 6 players)

Dealt so SB A K
3 folds, BTN raises to $4, SB raises to $16, BB folds, BTN calls $16

Flop: 8 T 8 ($34, 2 players)
SB bets $16.15, BTN calls $16.15


Turn: Q ($66.30, 2 players)
SB bets $38, BTN calls $38

River: 8 ($142.30, 2 players)
SB bets $377.12(all in) BTN ?? ($136.85 behind)


I had a discussion with a friend about this hand, im really sorry if the hand format isnt great, its not a copied hand history

What would you do here with AK as played? In my opinion this river isnt a good card for the 3rd bullet in our bluffgun, in fact its a very bad card.

Let's the the whole board [88T] [Q] [8]
well he could call the flop with much hands, such as small pockets, any T, maybe JJ, of course TT and 88 (unlikely), 2 overcards (especially with a flushdraw in it such as QJ KJ KQ AJ AQ )

So he calls the flop and turn bet, i think IF he really called the turn with any T or JJ or the whole possible XQ combos, this isnt a river where he usually folds often enough, to make our stone cold potsize shove profitable.

There are no specific reads on villain

yeah 88 is definitely unlikely..

dunno why you are trying to bluff someone like this with no reads.

anyway i doubt he is calling the turn with small pockets. of all the hands you listed only KJ is going to fold. so yeah, I would just give this hand up.

Thanks for your answer, i didnt play this hand, a friend played it, and me and another friend had a discussion about it.

For me this river is a 100% give up situation, for my friend its a good 3 barrel situation and so well played

But for me after the turn call of villain and this terrible river for us the all in with pure air (without a great great read) is pure suicide

This is one of the worst flops to cbet OOP without any reads. In addition to that, the Q is one of the worst cards to barrel. On the river your burning money.

basically this. no street here is an obviously good bet, so it basically is, in sum, telescopingly awful spew.

I don't like flop cbet. You have very few equity, no great barrel opportunity, you are OOP and you have the obvious AK...

River is a very bad card to barrel. As a general rule, it's not very good to try to bluff a full house ...

To those saying turn is a bad barrel, can you elaborate?
It gives us equity and fold a pretty large part of his range: middle pair, weak draw, random float, ...

OP, do you have any data on Villain? steal % from BU, fold vs resteal %, history, ...

c/f flop. His range is not folding often on this board.

telescopically awful spew made my day...I hope it's ok if i use that sometime?

+1

+1 to everyone advising c/f flop imo

This is a board where it's hard to barrel confidently without any reads.

c/c > c/f imo

close though.

Why would we c/f flop? Isn't AK a favorite over the range that calls a 3bet from the button on this board?

I'd rather c/c than c/f to be honest. Am I way off here? (I defend like QJo+,T9s+,ATo+,ATs+, 99+, 4betting TT-AA and AK for value, and some random bluffs)


Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

85,140 games 0.052 secs 1,637,307 games/sec

Board: Ts 8s Th
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 58.259% 55.76% 02.50% 47473 2128.50 { AhKc }
Hand 1: 41.741% 39.24% 02.50% 33410 2128.50 { 99-88, AQs-ATs, KTs+, QTs+, J9s+, T9s, AQo-AJo, KJo+, QJo }

you gonna check / call to the river?

c/f everywhere.