Getting back into poker after a few years off (oh, the siren song is sweet)... This is hand from an underground room in NYC...

1-3, plays like 2-5, whatever..

Effective stacks $700ish

Im in BB with 88.

UTG makes it $10 UTG+1 calls, another caller, SB makes it $45 (bad, loose, splashy, fishy, doesn't understand relative hand values, etc.), I call, UTG folds, UTG+1 (bad player with $200 calls), all others fold.

3 to flop

Flop 855

Yay. I check UTG+1 shoves $105, SB makes it $220...

I thought about shoving and him thinking I was on a FD or that I had the pair just below his overpair because thats how they (bad players) think. Instead, I call, hoping he'll shove a non diamond turn...

Turn 4

SB checks (ugh)... I bet $100 with a bit over $400 behind (in retrospect i like $150-200 I think. This bet kinda sucks)

River 3

SB checks again. I hate this card because I think he hates this card...

Hero? ($320ish behind), VB? Shove?

Turn bet about 220 hope he calls/ shoves over. As played shove the river and hope he has something

Spr is 1 by the time we get to the turn. Splitting that bet between two streets doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me, but I guess against bad players divide it up however you like to get all the money in the middle.

Click it back on flop.

So what do you prefer? Just jamming flop?

Ok, can you tell me why?

Is it because if he has a real hand he's jamming over this or because when he calls theres so little left on turn, he's calling it off if he checks?

One thing I don't like about this line is that I think when I just flat call here, bad players are just like "oh he has a FD..." I think clicking it back looks stronger to them...

Live low stakes NL is newer community for us predominantly live cash players that we fought tooth and nail for. I received multiple infractions over the years for arguing with mods over need for said forum.

Would love to see you there!!!

I explained but then accidentally clicked back button oops.

They are bad players. They aren't raise/folding any value/draws here so it doesn't matter.

Regardless of stp ratio a bigger range would call a 200 bet rather than a shove thinking if they hit flush/ straight the rest are implied. Much prefer than a shove.

I agree with this 100%!

Problem is when he calls and folds river on missed draw.

To stop this happening we can CIB on the flop and shove turn cause he has to call.

I personally would not click it back here and would just flat and keep in their bluffs OTT.. what is gained by doing this OTF? If you flat you can be put on an overpair / 8x but re-raise and you have a lot of trips / FH.. Let them prepare their own funeral

I would go ahead and shove, if he has FD hes priced in to call, if he has over pair he's probably calling. Only hand I see him folding to a shove is under pair/Ak. I guess a flat isn't too bad, hope he makes his hand, but I think there's a lot more value in a shove here.

Not really. The flop is pretty dry for a 3bet pot and I think it makes it much easier to fold if you just jam the flop. Given you have position on the player I think calling the flop is by far the best move, clicking back is certainly viable against bad players.


In theory on the turn we'd be better off with our whole range by jamming when we are checked to.


Not really a huge issue because if we have half as many calls but bet twice as much it evens out in the long run.

Well he doesn't have any bluffs cause it's a dead pot....

I mispoke it would be better for our entire perceived range if we just shoved the turn, not necessarily for our actual range.