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Old 06-26-2012, 07:49 AM   #1
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100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Villain is a reg, but no meaningful stats nor history/dynamic. Is 3bet/call pretty bad? I think that this would be a +EV spot for me to 3bet with pretty much anything since I would imagine villain's raising range to be pretty bluff-heavy here, but if I get jammed on I don't really see how I can get the 35% equity needed to call with my hand since his raise/jam range would be pretty much top pairs + sets + nut flush draws. But I think 3bet/fold is totally gross of course so I hate thinking like that. Would calling the flop raise and making it up as we go along after seeing a turn and his sizing be the only viable option then?

Don't worry about preflop btw, I get that it could/should be an openfold, either way I think it's inconsequential.

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer
Hero ($178)
BB ($100)
UTG ($120)
UTG+1 ($126)
CO ($287)
BTN ($58.11)

Dealt to Hero J 3

fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $3, BB calls $2

FLOP ($6) 5 2 T

Hero bets $4, BB raises to $12, Hero raises to $27, BB raises to $97 (AI), Hero calls $70
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Old 06-26-2012, 07:57 AM   #2
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Holy chit, yeah I'd snap fold preflop to the 3bet but I like your open on SB.

As played, what can you do? You made a bad call preflop and hit a big flop. Yes, I'd go all in here. We have FD and some BSD outs plus possible but thin J as outs.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:15 AM   #3
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Yeah fold to the 3bet ainec! what the hell were you thinking

Ok, by 3betting the flop, you allow him to play perfectly. He's just going to fold bluffs and shove with hands that beats you.

Calling seems like a much better option, if we hit on the turn, he's likely to try and rep the flush with his bluffs. If we don't hit and he fires again, you can either check/shove or check/fold depending on how often you think he will keep bluffing.
Sometimes he's also going to fold the NFD to your check/shove on the turn depending on his sizing and what he thinks your range is.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:16 AM   #4
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Why do u want to get it in with J high? You do realise his draws highcard u?
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:20 AM   #5
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There was no 3b Pf
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:23 AM   #6
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Fold to 3bet Af, easy
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:25 AM   #7
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

We're the ones 3-betting the flop so we can't really fold to the 3-bet.

I would just call the raise on the flop fwiw.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:02 AM   #8
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

3b with your air. If he's polarized, then 3betting can't be terrible, but by flatting with a flush draw you'll be able to realize your equity vs the stronger parts of his range for a much cheaper price, while still having the chance to win unimproved by betting the river if the turn checks through.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:52 AM   #9
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Mm yeah, I realised too late that calling the raise is so much better - he bluffs spades and I don't mind check/jamming even a blank turn now looking at it.

My 3bet must've looked really bluffy though because villain jammed with 64 (not the flush draw one), really struggling to see the rationale behind that.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:00 PM   #10
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Who won the pot?
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:46 AM   #11
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

call otf and cf depending on his sizing ott...if he lets you in at a decent price you can peel ott and decide otr
getting it all in otf here seems pretty bad thou
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:46 AM   #12
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fifty1Fifty View Post
3b with your air. If he's polarized, then 3betting can't be terrible, but by flatting with a flush draw you'll be able to realize your equity vs the stronger parts of his range for a much cheaper price, while still having the chance to win unimproved by betting the river if the turn checks through.
what the *** are you talking about
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:54 AM   #13
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

I don't really see anything wrong in what he said. It is phrased kinda differently I guess but what is wrong about it?
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:34 AM   #14
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

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Originally Posted by ebet33 View Post
what the *** are you talking about
i don't get what's wrong, or what *** bleeped out.
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:54 AM   #15
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Re: 100nl - cbet raised BvB with flush draw

snap fold pre.

as played you can mix very seldom b/f OTF (which is the std move) with 3b/f. 3b/c is like giving money to Villain as a present, really terribad. always snap fold pre anyway.
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