Maybe someone could answer this question

If a really good player deposited $500 to play plo5 and used 100 BI rule to move up each limit playing around 15,000 hands per week how long would it roughly take him to get to plo100?

3 days.

2 with a case of redbull.

Estimate your win rate after rake and then do the math.

What would be some approximate win rates just a average to work it out? I don't own pt4 was asking because me and a friend were discussing it and thought I ask here?

Don't follow 100BI rule. That's way to risk averse. Especially for those stakes

PLO from scratch offers some guidelines, which i consider very reasonable:

$5PLO to $10PLO: Grind in 20 BI ($100) at $5PLO and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($350) for a shot at $10PLO.$10PLO to $25PLO: Grind in 40 BI ($400) at $10PLO and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($750) for a shot at $25PLO.$25PLO to $50PLO: Grind in 40 BI ($1000) at $25PLO and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($1750) for a shot at $50PLO.$50PLO to $100PLO: Grind in 35 BI ($1750) at $50PLO and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($3500) for a shot at $100PLO.

I did not use that strict of a guidelines, untill PLO 25, but it took almost 2 months, and 100 k hands (all hands at zoom tables), to reach the bankroll to give it a shot at PLO 50, with win AIEV of 4bb/100, and 2.5bb/100 actual win rate. From PLO 50, i would follow those rules quite strictly, but ofc it's a personal prefference.

Don't play with 100 BI on micros.

Startout on micros, learn the game, learn from your mistakes, take shots at PLO10/PLO25 asap.

thanks



What bankroll for these two stakes PLO10/PLO25?

There are no golden rules for BRM. It all depends on so many factors, particularly Heros risk aversion and winrate.

A full time player who cant really afford to go broke or move down should play with a huge bankroll, in particular if his edge is in the 4-7bb/100 interval after rb. 200 or maybe even 300 BI might be best.

A hobby player who is not dependent on any income from poker can have a much more lax BRM. It wont be an issue to move down, he might be able to juice his roll using income from a job. He might play in games where his wr post rb is significant, eg +10bb/100. 100 BI BRM for a decent hobby player at micros is ridiculously conservative, and will only hold him back. He should be much more aggressive to try and move up as fast as possible. 20BI is fine. 40 BI is more than enough.

+1 to oink and grethe
if you are a hobby player, there really is no point in grinding it out at plo5 with 500 bucks...

I disagree, there is nothing wrong with extremely conservative bankroll management. It's certainly better than taking too many risks.

But come on if you are playing 5plo with 100 buyins thats ridiculous

There is a Kelly rule (?) Regarding BR management that i heard from my friend which is (STD Dev)^2 / ev bb/100
So for example if you are a crusher on your limit its like 15std dev and 7bb/100 so 225/7= ~30 Normally you can multiply this Kelly number with 2 - 4 if you are a BR nit pro. The point of is that K number depends on std dev and bb/100

It's important to view your time at the micros as a learning opportunity. Our protagonist might not even be a winning player when he starts, which makes a more aggressive bankroll management strategy an absolute disaster.

Something I once read in a poker blog (not certain which one, but might have been Cardquant), was that in addition to building up your bankroll to play at the next stakes, it is also good practise to set a target winrate (over a large enough sample size) at the current stake. I think the point was that part of the goal shouldn't just be to grind out enough of a roll to move up, but also to improve skill to the point of being a proven winner, crushing the current stakes, before moving up.

First of to answer your question how long it will take: It's different for all players. If you are very good you will get there sooner, if you need to work on your game/are new it will take longer. Your win rate will tell you how long it will take. Take an average of 5bb/100 (this is average but it's pretty darn hard to actually get this, lot of hard work involved to get 5bb/100 consistently) and do the math. Factor in rakeback and theoretically it could be done in a few months. If you have good rakeback deal you can break even on all limits and still make it within 3 months imo (that's with 30BI rule though and all shots go right).

My advice if you were serious though: You don't need 100 BI's. 50 or even 30 should be enough. Take very aggressive shots of 5-10Bi's and if you fail INSTA MOVE BACK DOWN. I can't stress this enough, when you are taking shots with smaller amount of BI's, you need to be super disciplined and move up/down accordingly.

Speaking of winrates, different stakes need to be taken concern. Rakes are very different comparing PLO5 to PLO50 example which hugely effect your winrates especially at very lowstakes so 5bb/100 hands is not really the same in PLO5 as in PLO50.

This is interesting, but 15std dev? Standard deviation bb / 100 hands? What am I missing?

If we take me for example, I got 115 in std dev and 3.9bb/100 EV winrate. So... (115^2)/3.9 = 3391... Do you mean 115x2 not 115^2 ??

Thanks

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...-8-days-99166/

i wish i played poker back than... oh wait, i did and never acomplished anything big like that

I am mixing plo25 and pl50 with 4k br. That is like 100 buyin. It is working fine for me.

If you bum hunt HU or avoid regs at tables, probably 100 is way excessive. My routine is always the same, deposit 500, run it up, play tournaments, get bored and cash out. I've gotten into 5 figure cash outs multiple times doing this. I don't really care what people say I'm not trying to be the best so if people have certain tendencies HU, I'm not going to waste my time playing them if we are equal skill level. Rake would make me broke

who the hell grinds out low stakes plo these days??? you pay ridiculous rake and maybe the best are marginal winners....then you get up to plo 100, still pay insane rake and even the best don't make much money....f u plo

I make decent sums playing HU plo. You can really be a nit and just nut peddle and still win. 6max is a bit different, but you can accumulate stacks at a higher rate. Would agree that Rake is crazy if you are splashing around a ton and playing a lot wider range than you should. This has always been my style and my variance has always been low. I've only played up to 5/10 and that's when there are people playing above their level, but I will follow and play in those games just for certain players. If you are consistently sitting with regs or people who are decent, you are never going to make money in this ecosystem.

its still beatable. there are a lot bad players around. PLO is and that sounds maybe crazy for you a massiv skill game (even more than NLH imo), where you have to know how to play against some kind of opponents. Using Position as Advantage is one of the key..than more you play, more you get a feeling for the hand strength and you ranges that you can rep.

I totally agree. I had a huge ~60BI Downswing 3 weeks ago in 12k hands and just recovered after 56k hands.
Those swings are very rare, but once they occur, its better to stil have some BR to fight back.