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PLO25 BTN vs 3bet PLO25 BTN vs 3bet

05-25-2017 , 07:36 PM
SB was hyper agro on 26 hands (77/77/7)
CO was on 57 hands (40/20/0)

Should I get in on the turn?


    Poker Stars, $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Omaha Cash, 6 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37738640

    Hero (BTN): $51.51 (206 bb)
    SB: $91.32 (365.3 bb)
    BB: $39.73 (158.9 bb)
    UTG: $76.72 (306.9 bb)
    MP: $115.49 (462 bb)
    CO: $31.28 (125.1 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is BTN with J Q 9 Q
    2 folds, CO raises to $0.50, Hero raises to $1.85, SB raises to $6.30, BB folds, CO calls $5.80, Hero calls $4.45

    Flop: ($19.15) 2 K 4 (3 players)
    SB checks, CO checks, Hero checks

    Turn: ($19.15) T (3 players)
    SB bets $18.34, 2 folds

    Spoiler:
    Results: $19.15 pot ($0.81 rake)
    Final Board: 2 K 4 T
    Hero mucked J Q 9 Q and lost (-$6.30 net)
    SB mucked and won $18.34 ($12.04 net)
    CO mucked and lost (-$6.30 net)



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    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-28-2017 , 04:36 PM
    well, we need 33% on the call here, (41.5% to stack off)

    let's say he sqz prflop is 4% ($3b4o)
    I'd exlude this from his flop range (as he checked) : KK!cc,AA:cc,AA:35
    OTT, he should be shoving something like this: AA: (3,5,Q,T,K,9J,J),KT+,K:cc,K:hh,TQJ+,Qcc+,Qhh+), Q9K: (cc,hh)

    so we have 35% here, looks break even call to me, if he's more likely to make mistacked with SPR 0.45 OTR, than you, then calling and playing river depending on the card (calling any flush and straight or shoving them yourself) seems like right play.


    but maybe, my turn delayed Cbet range is too ambitious
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-28-2017 , 06:54 PM
    You're ascribing preflop and postflop ranges to a 77/77 guy that look an awful lot like the pre and postflop ranges of a 27/17 guy.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-28-2017 , 06:55 PM
    lol that

    OP, I'd suggest playing around with PPT for a bit if you are ever considering folding a hand like this on the turn. In PLO you don't have to shove or fold when faced with a large bet for most of your stack. Draws are often flatted in spots like this.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-28-2017 , 07:44 PM
    You can't fold on the turn vs anyone. Vs. guys like this, you can't really fold QQ on any rivers getting better than 3-1. So it's either jam or call/call. The main in argument in favor of jamming is that I think he will have a check/folding range on some rivers when you hit your draw. The main argument in favor of call/call is that he will take a check/call river line with some hands better than QQ when a club hits. I think jamming is better here because you still have a ton of equity on the turn vs all of his T2/T4 type stuff, and allowing him the opportunity to check/fold a hand like 9764hh on an Ac river really sucks.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-29-2017 , 04:46 AM
    Even knowing opponent is very aggro this is not an easy spot, for example if we call can we really fold river unimproved vs this opponent, maybe he has txxx and our qq is good - is he bitting wide because everyone checked back and are likely weak or is he slowplaying a monster (or turned tt)

    Call seems standard, as does the expectation of positive implied odds, I don't think folding is horrible though (on the basis that villain should have range advantage and implied odds aren't amazing, we still pay off straights vs club flush, Made hands vs boats and bigger flushes)

    Like I said above the hard part of the hand is deciding if should call with just the qq on many rivers
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    05-31-2017 , 03:15 PM
    I definitely see merit in calling in spots like this a lot of the time. If you can be reasonably certain that you are beat and can fold happily unimproved then calling is perfectly fine. In this spot we have a tiny, tiny sample size but it seems somewhat likely hes a maniac. Sometimes maniacs do maniac things and sometimes they hit. Villain can have the naked nut flush draw, KKxx that he was looking to CRAI on flop, AAxxhh or some total spew. I have occasionally had people take this line (3bet or 4bet pre, check flop and pot turn looking commited) only to fold to a jam at $5 and $10 pl.

    I don't know if raising or folding is better in this spot. I really hate calling to fold river though. I also know that I personally wouldn't fold here but that's as much due to indiscipline as analysis
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    06-02-2017 , 03:47 PM
    Shove high five with the dealer,
    i mean he could have a lot of worst draws that we are beating with our QQxx, so shoving is std here. you might actually crush some Txhh.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    06-04-2017 , 09:40 AM
    Its really interesting spot.
    Preflop looseness doesnt necesssary extends on postflop, besides it seems he 3bet just once b4.

    I think we shouldnt assume he always checks AA:cc and we block a lot of those premuim KK:cc he might check.
    Thus if we can conclude we have FE vs wider range I think we should jam.
    Also our visibility will be poor vs wide range if we brick.
    We also fold out OR equity when we jam compared to just calling but this is minor consideration I guess.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote
    06-05-2017 , 12:47 AM
    Not often you see someone 3b this pre and fold to a bet on that turn.

    Call turn and reassess.
    PLO25 BTN vs 3bet Quote

          
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