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Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot

09-26-2015 , 04:48 AM
SB is a good reg (25/16, 3% 3bet (both ip and oop), and I have several relevant notes on him :
- Only 3 bets premium AA oop
- tight FOF vs me
- plays strong hands fast on flop, calls with most draws
At this point though he was a bit tilted it seems.

BTN is a very bad reg (81/51/25) and my notes indicate that :
- doesn't bluff much except as pf3b
- ridiculous bad flop calls gii with just weak backdoors vs pf3b (SPR 1.5)

Omaha Pot Limit €0.50/€1.00

Stacks:
UTG (92.62)
CO (36.13)
BTN (130.28)
SB (216.91)
BB - Hero (100)

Preflop: (1.5, 5 players) Hero is BB with K 6 7 K
2 folds, BTN raises to 2, SB raises to 7, Hero raises to 23, BTN calls 21, SB calls 16

Flop: J 2 8 (69, 3 players)
SB bets 64.50, Hero ?

I was confident i was ahead of SB's range pf, and I don't wanna play the hand with the worst relative position. OTF I think it's actually close I expect a lot of good FD+TP, but very few combos of JJ get to the flop (maybe JJQQ and the likes). BTN is likely to come along if he has any piece of the flop, including things like GS+BDFD.

1 - What do you do in this spot and why ? (FYI HU you got 32% vs AcJcQT, and 37% vs JT98 w/o clubs)
2 - I was planning on shipping if SB checks. everyone agrees with that?
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 10:18 AM
Opinions, anyone?
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 10:32 AM
If you didnt have the guy behind you I would consider it an easy stack off. With the guy behind its closer. I still get it in, but I havent done any PJ math. Gut feeling is that its close but a +EV gii
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 02:55 PM
OP is confusing: When you say he only 3b premium AA OOP does that mean he will 3b other stuff that isn't "weak" AA? Or that he actually only 3b premium AA (and maybe premium rundowns) cause if it's the latter I don't know why you are 4b pre-flop? NVM, I just noticed 3b%. Pretty lol @ villain being a good reg with that 3b%. Your 4b is bad.

I think flop is a fold anyway.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 03:09 PM
You have ~32% equity against the SB if he's jamming any half-decent piece (any eight-out draw or better, any Jx or better, any pair plus gutter) -- barely enough to get it in if the BTN always folded -- and 19% three-way if the BTN also stacks off with literally any board hit (any gutter or better, any pair). So pretty easy fold.

I gave the SB a 6% range but it doesn't change much if his range is 12%. I gave the BTN something like 30% of all hands, but similarly, things don't change much whether it's 15% or 50%.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 03:32 PM
If he only 3-bets AAxx PF OOP as your note states (and is consistent with his stats), then you're throwing away money by 4-betting.

On flop, you hand is a dry overpair, and there's no way that this guy is leading pot without a hand he really likes. Plus, with the guy behind you, I really think you're not going to have enough equity to justify continuing.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 03:37 PM
In that spot as I said I'm confident my KK are mostly good pre, that is not my question.

If we were HU, this would be an easy call OTF given those odds and that there are very few sets in his range and very few combos have me crushed.

But with the guy behind, that's very different. There are a lot of situations where he'll call, and one has 2pairs and the others clubs. that has me drawing pretty slim.

As you say oink, it"s probably close. i just think it's close on the - side Damn why is pokerjuice so expensive...
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 03:43 PM
You can't give a 3% 3betting range and a note that says villain only 3b premium AA OOP and then say you are confident your KK is good pre. Irregardless of it being your qn. Obv 4b here is standard most of time but you need to pay attention to the villains you are up against.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 03:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BendOverPlz
Damn why is pokerjuice so expensive...
Basically everything PokerJuice does can be done in OO, which is a lot cheaper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BendOverPlz
In that spot as I said I'm confident my KK are mostly good pre, that is not my question.
Define "mostly good". The 4b is still not good if villain's 3-bet width in that spot is 6-8%; you'll end up facing a 5b around 35-40% of the time, which is sort of a waste when flatting is so profitable.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-26-2015 , 04:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by F_Ivanovic
You can't give a 3% 3betting range and a note that says villain only 3b premium AA OOP and then say you are confident your KK is good pre. Irregardless of it being your qn. Obv 4b here is standard most of time but you need to pay attention to the villains you are up against.
This.

If you're confident your kings are good, then what's villain's preflop range? I can only assume ultra premium rundowns. I would even be a little hesitant to call playing heads up against his assumed range, although I'd probably make somewhat of a crying call. In my experience, most people lead in these spots with really good hands (which is generally bad play, IMO, but that's besides the point).

Last edited by DMoogle; 09-26-2015 at 04:18 PM.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-27-2015 , 05:59 AM
Once again I've played with him a lot, and i'm very fine with my pf4bet here. Unlike most people he has much more rundowns (even bad ones) than AA here. I actually thinks he's even more unlikely to have AA given that he would just call expecting me to 3 bet.

On a tight range here, I have 32% (probably a bit more since he would likely c/shove his monsters. Given he was tilted, i think we can wider this a bit.

All in all I think it's a fold with BTN and a call without him. In the actuall hand I did call, SB had AcJcQ7. BTN called with J2xx and I was at 20%.

What is this OO that replaces Poker Juice ?
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-27-2015 , 08:35 AM
Yeah it's a call w/o BTN, especially because the SB will then shove a wider range. Anyway, PJ is an extension to Odds Oracle (OO is a more advanced version of the free online version of ProPokerTools) that makes inputting ranges and sharing the results easier. You can still do the work without PJ, however.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote
09-27-2015 , 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BendOverPlz
SB is a good reg (25/16, 3% 3bet (both ip and oop), and I have several relevant notes on him :
- Only 3 bets premium AA oop
- tight FOF vs me
- plays strong hands fast on flop, calls with most draws
At this point though he was a bit tilted it seems.
If they're relevant, why aren't you following your read that he's a passive nutpeddling nit who won't get in without huge equity and this will likely be especially true 3 ways. If you think he's tilted, then typing out these "relevant" notes is irrelevant.
Plo 100: 3 way OTF in 4 bet pot Quote

      
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