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OTR Call or Fold? OTR Call or Fold?

01-03-2017 , 10:26 AM
    Poker Stars, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Omaha Cash, 6 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37562730

    BTN: $16.06 (160.6 bb)
    SB: $21.97 (219.7 bb)
    BB: $10 (100 bb)
    UTG: $13.60 (136 bb)
    MP: $11.87 (118.7 bb) VPIP 28 / PFR 17 / 3B 1 445 hands
    Hero (CO): $36.86 (368.6 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with 5 5 A K
    UTG folds, MP raises to $0.35, Hero calls $0.35, 3 folds

    Flop: ($0.85) 8 9 6 (2 players)
    MP bets $0.60, Hero calls $0.60

    Turn: ($2.05) K (2 players)
    MP bets $1.10, Hero raises to $3.89, MP calls $2.79

    River: ($9.83) 8 (2 players)
    MP bets $7.03, Hero ???




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    I have no read to him
    My line is mostly A high Flush OTT
    I thought river is good to bluff and I have a K blocker
    What shoud I do OTR?
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 10:53 AM
    Fold. Not an expert here, but in my experience he has a boat 9 times out of 10.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 01:06 PM
    Loose peel pre in my opinion.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 01:29 PM
    easy fold pre, fold river as played.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 02:09 PM
    Fold pre

    call turn
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 04:23 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Loctus

    call turn
    To leave his bluffs in play and not to turn our hand face up? Or is there something I'm not seeing?
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 05:22 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wabomushroom
    To leave his bluffs in play and not to turn our hand face up? Or is there something I'm not seeing?
    Those things yes, but you also need to protect your calling range. If you never have a straight/flush in your calling range there (IE: you raise all nuts on turn) then when the river doesn't change the board texture (in this case it only changes 20% of the time) they can barrel and you can't do **** about it. They can't blindly barrel if you have flushes in your range including very strong ones. This doesn't mean never raise obviously but don't always raise.

    The way this hand plays out if the board texture doesn't change on the river, he likely barrels again, if he has to bluff or may even go for thin value, we get to raise a moderate amount and make his life hell. If he decides to check we can barrel and it also puts him in a very tough spot.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 06:03 PM
    Probably is a river fold vs a complete unknown. There are plenty of donkbetting terrible players at this level though, any kind of slight read in that direction and I like a call.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 06:45 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Darkfangs
    easy fold pre, fold river as played.
    because vs MP open range
    My hand only can call on BTN?

    Last edited by Janus947; 01-03-2017 at 07:12 PM.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 07:48 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wabomushroom
    To leave his bluffs in play and not to turn our hand face up? Or is there something I'm not seeing?
    ehh raising is fine, very fine if villain is a doofus ofc. It's just.. Hard.. To raise correctly there. I mean are you ever bluffing? Do you ever have anything but literally the nut flush? Calling leaves your range super wide and if villain is in the mood you'll probably get another bet out of him on the river. I jsut think it plays better range wise to call there.

    I mean, you could solve the raise problem by bluff raising A LOT there, but I would think that is suicide and I think most others including you would think so too. So calling it is I suppose. Sometimes you win more by not trying to win the entire stack when you have the nuts.
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Janus947
    because vs MP open range
    My hand only can call on BTN?
    AK55 suited is actually just not a very good omaha hand. Imagine if someone squeezes after you call, you're real proper ****ed then, I mean you gonna call and try to bink a five? Fold to the 3b (in omaha!?!?)? It's just hard to call and have it be profitable in the long run. Remember, poker isn't about making good hands (AK55 makes some very good hands, it does!), but about making money.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-03-2017 , 08:14 PM
    Fold. What calls on the turn that you can now beat?

    Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-06-2017 , 05:53 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Janus947
    I have no read to him
    This is a big problem, not a small one. And yet it seems like so many posters treat it like a side note. While I agree with the advice everyone is giving you to fold this hand pre, because it is a trouble hand so often, one reason you won't get a very helpful answer about the river play here is because without reads, there cannot be one.

    Against a nit, you muck every time. Against a maniac, you are usually calling, results be damned. Against someone in the middle, it's a close decision. Without even enough of a read to be able to vaguely categorize your opponent, you are taking a wild guess, and since you'll be wrong enough even with an informed decision, the last thing you want to mix in here is a wild guess.

    When you first sit down, and don't have reads on any one yet, you pretty much have to go by what seems standard in the game at your stakes. From what I've seen at micro plo, this river looks like a fold.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-10-2017 , 08:20 PM
    I am confused about villain's range. Is it standard to fire two barrels with a set on that board (a flop with possible straights and a turn that completes the flush). What's villain range on the turn?
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-11-2017 , 02:53 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PokerDisciple
    This is a big problem, not a small one. And yet it seems like so many posters treat it like a side note. While I agree with the advice everyone is giving you to fold this hand pre, because it is a trouble hand so often, one reason you won't get a very helpful answer about the river play here is because without reads, there cannot be one.

    Against a nit, you muck every time. Against a maniac, you are usually calling, results be damned. Against someone in the middle, it's a close decision. Without even enough of a read to be able to vaguely categorize your opponent, you are taking a wild guess, and since you'll be wrong enough even with an informed decision, the last thing you want to mix in here is a wild guess.

    When you first sit down, and don't have reads on any one yet, you pretty much have to go by what seems standard in the game at your stakes. From what I've seen at micro plo, this river looks like a fold.
    I often have zero reads on my opponents. I guess I am just taking wild guesses like a monkey throwing darts?
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-13-2017 , 06:55 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gay_on_tse
    I often have zero reads on my opponents. I guess I am just taking wild guesses like a monkey throwing darts?
    Actually I would guess that you are going by what seems to be standard to you in a given spot. I play a lot of micro PLO on anon tables at ignition, and, especially after first sitting down, I usually don't have a read either. But there are definitely tendencies that you can spot that the typical player in a game will exhibit.

    A draw completes and they lead into you on the river after cc'ing the other streets? They are rarely bluffing.

    Big c/r on the flop when no straight or flush is there yet? The vast majority of the time this will be a set. Most players at this level seem to prefer check-calling their draws, even the very big ones.

    And all that kind of thing. Obviously there is no genius in any of those thoughts, it's pretty straightforward stuff. And in most cases when I get involved in a large pot, I have a powerful enough hand to not need to worry about it too much.

    But my main point was that, in the long run, the closer decisions are going to be what really determines where we end up on the winner/loser spectrum, and we have to do anything and everything we can to use information to inform these decisions and not just make wild guesses.
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote
    01-17-2017 , 07:25 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gay_on_tse
    I often have zero reads on my opponents. I guess I am just taking wild guesses like a monkey throwing darts?
    confirmed monkey
    OTR Call or Fold? Quote

          
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