Not an online player so take my advice with a grain of salt:

How can a UTG raising range not have you beat on this board in hand 2? Only hands basically will contain 4 exact cards amongst [A Q J T] which is really unlikely. I feel like the pairs will also check their SDV, so basically you're looking at a bluffrange of exactly AQJT, QJT8, something like that. Very narrow.

On the other hand there should be a crapton of AKxx or AAxx combos in his range

Hello,

I have been googling and looking at different sites to see what % RB one earns at 25plo on pokerstars as a supernova. The two sites i came across were ...http://www.fpppro.com/pokerstars-rakeback.php and the other http://www.rakeback.com/pokerstars/rakeback-calculator/

the reason i am posting is the fpppro website gives a SN a 37% RB (i got SN last year w NLHE) but the later website gives me merely 28% rakeback... can someone clarify to me what is up

EDIT: I am trying to find out where to play. As I said i have SN on pokerstars but 50% ipoker RB... but realize ipoker rake is quite a bit higher

tyia

I believe there's some bug in the second calculator, probably it fails adjust the FPP earn rate according to the starting level. The correct figure is 37% for continuing SN.

Also, 50% on iPoker is ridiculously little for the SN-like volume. Look for public non-flat deals with a 65-70% longterm potential (i.e. exclude welcome bonuses from the calculations you'll be provided with, lol) in the Affiliates/Rakeback forum. I'd rather do it in the second half of June (or are you going to leave PS before the 100-billionth hand hits? ) because
It will define Paddy's rank among iPoker skins better. The introduction of annual VIP levels ('VIP Elite'), which can of course alter the comparison of skins once more, has been promised back in April but no player knows when it will happen. I expect them to appear on July 1st because, well, it's the middle of the year and I'm tired of waiting

The base rake doesn't differ that much because the caps are seldom hit at PLO20-50; 5% is almost as good as 4.5%. Minor problems with caps start at PLO100, and at PLO200+ PS caps are clearly superior, but without SNE, effective rake is still a bit higher.

Another reason to postpone the appearance on iPoker is the toughness of the field (until Ladbrokes join) and

Fwiw I once made an Excel sheet comparing table rake on euro networks (they all have the same structure) and PS (alas it's looking quite messy as I had included a couple of smaller sites and erased them not everywhere, so if many people wish to see the original sheet, I'll repair it), basing on the raw data from my own 11K PLO20 hands with 5-6 players dealt in.

I looked what rake would be taken from the entire table (a reg's WC 'rake' is about 1/8 of the table rake on average because fishes pay twice more) in the same hands with iPoker and PS rake percentages and caps at different stakes (it's relevant for stakes up to PLO50, maybe PLO100, because games are less fishy at the midstakes) and got the following figures (disclaimer: the games from which the data was taken were wilder than average , with 3+ fishes per table, including a fair share of maniacs; at PLO20 tables of average fishiness on iPoker the total rake is 125-150 bb/100):

Table rake	PLO10	PLO20-25	PLO50	PLO100
PS	154	141	112	85
iP	177	171	139	105
PS/iP	87%	82%	81%	81%

They show that at PLO20-100 PS rake is 81-82% of iPoker rake. So the cashback equivalent on a euro network needed to match the 37.4% of SN is 100%-0.82*(100%-37.4%)~49%. So continuing SN is slightly superior rake-wise to playing on Ongame (Essence cripples a nominally 60%-ish return, making it 40%-ish) but slightly inferior to playing on iPoker.

However, there are many other factors in comparing networks, such as game selection, that outweigh the difference in effective rake (that's not more than 2-3 bb/100 as we've seen).

thanks for the information ... sadly my 50% on ipoker is through an affiliate and i was ignorant to the fact that one could get a deal as high as 70%. the first few that PMed me were 50% so i figured that was good enough. I will go back to PS and try to meet the 6.5k vpps needed by the end of the month (already missed 2 months cause of traveling)

thanks again though

Don't forget that it's possible to have active accounts at multiple iPoker skins at once (but not log into more than one at once), so even though your current iPoker account is 'spoilt' by being tagged to a wrong affiliate (I made two such mistakes as well ), you still have a chance to create a new one under the right aff (But you'll get optimal %-ages only if you dedicate most of your volume to iPoker; raking $350 or whatever, treating it as merely an addon to PS, won't do the trick.)

On the other hand, you'd have a hard time getting used to iPoker's soft and lobby and it might tilt you hard, so staying at PS is a fine decision too. You have plenty of time to earn the needed 6.5K VPPs, GL with your grind!

In a tournament how do you calculate a pot bet when heads up?
sb / 25
bb /50

If you completed, the pot would become 100 (your 50 + bb 50), so you can raise by 100 more, the total bet amount (including the posted sb) is 50+100=150 (3 x bb, as always HU). In general, the total bet amount when you potraise is <to call>+<pot after call>. Other examples: the maximum openraise on the button with 3+ players is to 3.5 x bb (1 bb is your call, 2.5 bb = 1 bb + 0.5 bb + 1 bb is the pot after it); the potraise after an opponent bets 50%/75%/100% of the pot postflop is to 5x/4.33x/4x his bet.

you know you suck when after tanking and thinking you have the second nuts, you end up losing to the second nuts

nice

I'm planning on deposit europoker to grind the plo15 and plo25 limit. due to the deposit bonus of 500$ i get an effective rb of 36%, through the vip-system maybe a bit more %.

is that a good amount of rb to play at europoker (ongame) ?

PokerStars - $0.25 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $23.51
MP: $51.31
CO: $77.66
BTN: $31.84
Hero (SB): $25.95
BB: $25.33

Hero posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.25

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero has J Q Q 9

fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.75, BB calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.50, 2 players) 5 8 T
Hero bets $1.43, BB calls $1.43

Turn: ($4.36, 2 players) 5
Hero bets $4.16, BB calls $4.16

River: ($12.68, 2 players) J
Hero bets $12.11, BB calls $12.11

villain stats: hands 137, 20/15/4

what do you think about my postflop play and what is a betteror more "correct" way to play this ?

Well played imo.

On Ongame, Essence multiplies the RB% by about 55-70% for most good regs, i.e. it would turn nominal 36% into 20-25% (I haven't tested it for myself, though).

A good news that, if a deal is good enough, you'll get a little extra from rake races. Also, as you've mentioned there's skin's cashback (10-15% pre-Essence at low monthly levels) into which you have to opt manually at the skin's webpage; I'm not sure if it's compatible with the bonus for your affiliate, ask them (I know that for some affs cashback isn't paid during the bonus period, but e.g. mine was).

What aggregate RB% is sufficient to play on Ongame is a tough question as I almost haven't played there and don't know its current fishiness first-hand; but with pre-Essence 50-55% you're gonna have from just bonus+VIP you'll probably be better off getting Supernova or choosing another Euro network because of better game selection blah blah blah.

<rant>
Imho where Ongame shines is PLO100+ because of its superior rake caps, and it has more tables running than other euro networks at those limits. I mean, the 5-6 player cap is the same $3 as at many other sites but in essence Ongame's PLO100 is more like PLO133 ($2, not $1.5, is posted in a hand) so the cap is 2.25 'bb' as opposed to Stars' 2.8 bb cap at PLO$100 (euro tables with a 2.15 bb cap are less popular for some reason ) and other networks' 3 bb cap, and even despite a higher 5% base rate Ongame's PLO100 rake is even a bit lower than Stars' $100 as caps are hit often enough, and also a more competent RB% than 2-3x SN can be obtained via rake races. </rant>

why didnt u just hit the POT button instead typing in the near pot bets?

Why pot on the river?
i would have bet less on the river for 2 reasons:
-value bet: he could have been on a draw. he missed his draw but u want him to call incase he had a pair.
-boat: by betting less, u save $ if he had a boat

Stars allow to bet at most the pot minus the rake. He did hit the pot button, bet as much as he could.

Btw I'd start by betting less already on the turn (draws aren't that eager to call a potbet on a pairing turn, are they? I'd make my bluffs cheaper this way). As played, Villain called a potsize turn bet, which means he either has it or has made a decision to bluffcatch until the end and will call a potsize river bet with a worse hand, most likely trips or an over-two-pair (our straight is improbable, and we can use it to our benefit). Anyway it's not a spot for a small pricesetting bet: we set the price with hands that are too weak to c/c a bigger bet but too strong to c/f, but here our hand is stronger than just a bluffcatcher, we need to valuebet as Villain's calling range beats us less than half of the time, and we can pot because his calling range is quite indifferent to our sizing. (Only if we have a read that he folds to way too many potbets but calls for half the pot way more eagerly, which is btw true for many PLO25 grinders and is a leak, then we should bet less.)

Hi guys,

I am new to PL omaha but I have a couple of questions for winning microstakes players.

I am having trouble playing in such a way that it will be difficult to read. eg not passive

Is it needed or can I make money just playing passive and drawing to the nuts?

I am always raising good hands and playing on the button mostly or AA doublesuited with playable post flop AAxx hands out of position.

I am raising flops like JT2 double suited with top set, top two or air, air 3 bet, 3 bet sets, etc but at the same time raising strong A high flush draws and mixing calling ranges similarly. Eg. JT2 double suited, call with top set, two pair or A high flush draws

If the board pairs I'm betting air, house and quads

Am I thinking too high level? I just need a good microstakes pro who is making thousands from microstakes to tell me what I'm doing wrong. I know I can beat most players at this stakes playing that way but sometimes I get called/raised when I least want them to and I'm forced to fold.

Cheers for the help my bankroll seems to be yoyoing

You don't need to be balanced at micro-PLO, just play as exploitatively as possible, manipulate pot size as needed, maximize value.

Most villains are not paying attention

Btw, speaking about your 'Micro-PLO Bullets' from the PLO10 videos, you advocate delayed cbetting at the micros, how many bb/100 can delaying cbets (the syndrom of checking back with meh equity like a gutshot or a weak pair, or basically anything that can't stand a c/r but has a backdoor potential, resulting in dropping the flop cbet frequency from 60% to 40%) subtract from the winrate at PLO20? :'(

be honest now, u expect me to know the answer to that?

I doubt PLO20 is a whole lot different from PLO10, fwiw, slightly better regs, perhaps

I just lost 15% of my bankroll playing zoom 2plo and 5plo. Is it even beatable post rake at those limits? Would nitting it up compensate for the huge rake?

A fish leaves 25 bb/100 at the table. You'll face 4-5 fishes, splitting profits with at most one reg... if you try to select regular tables well, I mean Rake is 'merely' 25 bb/100. I can't see how it's not profitable in terms of bb, just the hourly winrate in $ is low, that's exactly why there are too few regs there. Don't even think about nitting up.

On a side note, Bovada has close to no rakeback but is still considered very beatable by Americans due to the increased fishiness caused exactly by the absence of RB. The poker ecosystem evens itself out, don't worry and concentrate on decisions.

So you would recommend playing normal table over Zoom?

Yeah, I always do it. The only week when I tried to play Rush (PLO25) intensively wasn't fun (too many regs and shorties). Masstabling semirobots don't have time to select tables properly, and at Zoom you lose this edge over them.

but from my little experience playing zoom it seems most of the players are uber maniac. getting it in with any piece on the flop.

If they play with 50 bb and always reset the stack to the minimum, it's quite explainable At regular shallow/cap tables, people are very all-in-happy too.

Your mileage may vary, I just don't know the quality of the field at Zoom/Rush PLO2-5 in particular.

I think it's just a matter of taste, some people feel better in fast-fold poker, some are more comfortable at regular tables where they have time to write extensive notes , some, like me, prefer sites where fast-fold PLO games don't run at all