You graph will be meaningless at that sample size, except to post in BBV.

Look at VPIP/PFR in each position (UTG, MP, CO, BTN), 3bet in each position, fold flop to bet, bet and cbet flop, bet and cbet turn, flop raise, flop c/r. These stats are all useful to evaluate other players too.


Once you get bigger sample sizes, you might want to look at W$WSF and W$SD and seriously analyze tendencies (like your turn cbet in relation to flop cbet and such)

Anyone play PLO SNGS a notable amount?

Hey,

I'm a midstake hyper turbo grinder ($30-100 6m hypers)/mid-HSMTT grinder that has given up on SNE this yr as my $100 hypers aren't beatable pre RB atm, so I have a lot of extra time on my hands and am wanting to learn PLO cash. Few questions

1. Which sites would you rank in terms of softness/beat ability (so I guess rake comes into account here) from idk, 25PLO-100PLO. I have accounts on all major sites/networks. Is my RB deal on each site THAT big of a deciding factor? I've never put in volume at PLO cash before so I'm not sure if it's as important to have a good RB deal compared to hyper turbos. I have RB deals ranging from super good (team pro status rb deals) down to just "normal" that most people get between all the sites that I have accounts on

2. Any training sites that have good PLO vids? If so, which vids. Have never gotten into vids that much myself tbh, don't think it's the best (or even one of the best) ways to learn, but since I'm just starting out, watching some vids can't hurt.

Thanks

I think there was a consensus at some point that Supernova + PLO100 is a decent combo, and on Stars you should be able to table/seat select eventhough there's more regs compared to eurosites.

Cardrunners has a decent collection, check out LFTV's vids, good stuff in there.

I have a question regarding swings in plo. With variance being so high with the std deviation for my play being 227 bb I am looking at serious swings in the 50-60 buyins range. Even if I have an edge does it even matter with variance this high? Also I experimented with a more passive line preflop only limping with anything but monster aces. My std deviation was cut in half to about 119 bb. But I don't think it is as profitable. Also is it even possible to go from 2/4 cent plo 6 max to say even mid stakes in a year? Would it require more luck than skill?

I'm just wondering if it is worth not trying to go from micros to mid stakes in plo and play something like 9 max nlhe. But I like plo and I am willing to improve but not sure if its the right game to play.

Just wondering what peoples views on a good bankroll management system for omaha would be? now changing over from holdem and am unsure as to what the standard range of buyins would be? something between 30-50 buyins at your given stake?

thanks

Depending on your aggression and std deviation you could use between 100-300 buyins. If you just want to use 50 buyins but move up and down accordingly I think thats the way to go. Like for instance you have 5000 dollars and want to play 100 plo. If you drop down to 2500 then play 50 plo. If you win 5k and have 10k bankroll then move up to 1/2 plo etc. I think thats the way to go.

Yea, that's generally ok, but I'd prob wanna make it at least 100BI at PLO200+, cause you don't wanna just keep moving up and down taking shots

oki thanks i reckon ill use a 50 buyin approach and shot take when i reach 50 buyins at the stake above. I was hoping to join a study group or something to discuss hand histories etc any idea the best place to find people who are interested in setting these up?

thanks

So I've been playing 25NL PLO on and off again on stars for a year or so and I've finally decided that I really want to start taking it a lot more seriously and switch over to grinding 25NL PLO. I feel like I definitely have a good edge against most of the field, there's lots of weak tight players and the odd spewtard.

I've been reading a ton about how the micro stakes are not ideal on stars because the rake is high with no rake back deals, but is that just at like the 5-10NL stakes? What about at 25NL? I saw that GoGetaRealJob told someone else earlier that he should take a stab at 25NL with about $200 as long as it was okay if he went busto. I'm thinking of doing this on Stars. Comments? Suggestions?

You generally pay more rake at PLO compared to NLHE at the same stake. Stars is probably the worst choice for grinding at 25PLO given the minuscule RB. My rakeback on Ongame makes up for most of my winnings for 25PLO.

What about PLO mtt's, I really haven't heard much talk about them in this entire thread. Would the variance be lower for them than in cash? And perhaps the players much worse? I already grind hold'em Mtt's, perhaps playing PLO mtt's is a good idea too?

Also, in regards to finding a good site for rake back to grind 25PLO, I've heard iPoker thrown around a ton, but what alternative sites are really good for rakeback? Tell me more about OnGame. My friend keeps telling me Party is full of fish but I don't think they have rakeback, do they?

Rather than find a game with the lowest variance. Why not dabble in all the formats yourself and see for YOURSELF which format YOU enjoy.

Who says Stars has worse rake?
PLO25 6m I'm raked 8.7 bb/100 @Stars and 13.5 bb/100 @Party.
Even with a 6x bonus Party is more expensive to play at.

Anyone have stats about Ipoker and Ongame, sure I'm interested.

I'm very interested in site comparison too, writing this to check my sanity, please correct me wherever I err.
Are you still not boycotting Ongame that has turned its *ssence on winning regs (people complain that it drops their rewards down by 1/4-1/3)? I don't blame you, I just want to know reasons why you prefer it.
I don't play on any of the networks in question, but analysis of Party's official Palladium rewards (there aren't any under-the-table deals on Party, are there?) shows that if you 4-table 25PLO 'like mad', i.e. 30/20 and full-time, you can get 30% back by exchanging player points. That's too little of course. Imo, if those fish don't give you +10bb/100 in winrate, it's not worth trying.
+1. However, from math point of view, MTT $-variance depends on prize structure more than on game type (NLHE, PLO(8), w/e). PLO MTTs may have a bit bigger variance for good regs because chip-EV variance reduces their ability to finish ITM more often than 'on average in the hospital'.
Could anyone share their Cake->Revolution experience (in PMs at least)?
Is it real life? Or are you tight? Personally, I'm such a spewmonkey that I can't imagine myself raked at less than 20bb/100 though my rake calcs are not precise. Also, I've heard that Stars PLO micros are massive nitrings, I believe it's the main reason why you're raked smaller there.

I'm quite tight for sure (why play very loose when you're raked a lot?) but that is not relevant here since we are comparing two sites, and all I'm saying Party rakes higher. I dont think they are looser there, maybe even vice versa often.

I always have great tables at Stars, with 70%+ vpip guys, while at Party I actually need to work some to find these guys.

What kind of std dev bb/100 do you guys have? Whats normal. Is 227 too high?

It doesn't make a huge difference, to me anyway. My RB is good enough that I make back plenty of my rake back from that. Given the skin I play on runs $25k - $50k rake race each month which I can at least make few hundred $ from too - makes it worth it. Oh and Ongame's player pool is probably the softest I've seen anywhere.

shhhh you

This thread is destined to be the front of subaffiliate wars, sorry. To make a dig at Kelvin, I'd say that 5-digit rake races are uberstd for Ongame and I'd hate it if my monthly rewards were unpredictable.
Because of money transfer problems, I won't decide whom to sell my soul until next weekend at least , sorry. I'll probably sell several shares of it, though.
You'd better give bb/100 rake/stddev figures for 6max, ppl are interested.

Hey SSPLO, live 1/2 NLHE reg here. I feel like I'm good enough to beat higher but I love craps too much and boring **** like paying the rent eats into my BR.

I may have the opportunity soon to play the biggest fish I've ever seen* heads up half NLHE/half PLO (planning to play NLHE my button, PLO his button) and could use some advice. For an idea of my experience level, I'm marginally familiar with some PLO concepts (value of nut blockers, looking out for overset/overfulls, playing 4 cards that work well together so you can flop wraps/NFDs that have a lot of equity, etc.) but I'm pretty sure I'd get destroyed at any table where less than 3 people believe AsKs7s4s and a board of QsXX makes them the nut flush.

However, I've only played HUPLO once (surprised at how well I held my own, expected to suck way worse than I actually did) and HUNLHE a few times. I have Moshman's HUNLHE book and both of Slowhabit's PLO books, so I plan to read those, but is there any standard list of HU-specific adjustments to make playing PLO, especially against a fish? Thanks, all.



*-regarding the fish, this guy is well known at our club/home game as the worst player any of us has ever seen. Calls down 2/3 PSBs and bigger with any piece, any draw (even a gutshot to the ass end of a straight), almost never bets for value without the near nuts and when he does it's a ridiculous overbet, super easy to read physically. This dude is 100% in it for the gamble and way, way overestimates his skills (even worse than I do); he's actually the one clamoring for PLO most of the time so I think I can get him to play me heads up half and half if the house can spare a dealer and give us half rake

I'm 100% rooting for the fish wanting to play PLO

One obv thing you need to know is that c-betting doesn't work as well in PLO, cause it's easier to have a piece of the flop. You should do a lot of delayed c-betting, he doesn't sound like a very tricky opponent and will like bet his strong hands into you OTT.

With that in mind, concentrate on thin valuebetting instead of bluffing, that's generally a good strategy vs a std fish

I'd try to get him to switch it up so that you get the button on PLO hands and he gets the button on NL hands.

This