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LeakBuster PLO discussion LeakBuster PLO discussion

04-04-2011 , 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leroy2DaBeroy
FD: the workshop videos sound pretty interesting (and are something else I haven't looked at, personally)... Is there a sample video available somewhere so that people can get a demonstration for the type of information/analysis LB can do?
If you go to step 1 and click on members area there's supplemental material. There's not as much for PLO yet. There's an audio module on tilt on a workshop on LB 3.0.
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04-04-2011 , 06:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
FreakDaddy, what I was saying is that it is very possible to be playing somewhat optimally according to the ranges that leakbuster suggests but still having massive fundamental flaws in your game that no program currently available would point out.
Yes, of course. You could have very ideal stats in a lot of areas, but then bet/fold in spots with high equity you should be calling. You'll still have leaks that will show up in stats though if you're not winning. But the main point of my response was that the stat ranges are only one part of LB. Leak Buster will help you locate areas that have nothing to do with stats. It's going to find leaks in your game using the filters and algorithms it does for the other steps. Those have nothing to do with stat ranges.

I completely understand your point about steps 2/3. Just trying to point out that there are other parts of the program that will locate leaks for you. And the new step 8 that is being implemented is pretty sick imho (a complete diagnostic on the biggest losing hands you've played). You can read about it on HM's website.
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04-04-2011 , 06:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGetaRealJob
I'd really be interested in seeing how other players with different/similar c-bet stats are faring.


^cbetting and not cbetting

mine is 54% cbet, but am only 1.6BB winner at small levels so it's best to take it with a grain of salt

cbetting is profitable! (although i do run better all in not cbetting )
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04-04-2011 , 07:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
GGARJ, no, I wasn't "trolling" at all, but the fact that you posted a graph filtered for when you cbet pretty much all but confirms for me where your leaks are in the game.
I posted the graph since my c-bet was called out, I'm still interested in looking at how different frequencies work out for people. Unless you're willing to share ur thoughts/graphs/numbers on the subject and stop insinuating, keep your comments to yourself.

Quote:
I am not here to point out where your leaks are, but I have no problem telling you that you actually have them.
Pretty much sums up your contribution to the thread IMO... but I'm biased for obv reasons.

EDIT: great chance to prove me wrong right now.
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04-04-2011 , 07:37 PM
FreakDaddy,

I play stack sizes from 20bb to 200bb and all my hands are mixed in together. My styles are wildly different depending on the stack size I play (vpip might vary by 10-15% and 3bet by 5-10%). Will the program work for me? Is there a way to filter for only hands with a certain stack size?
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04-05-2011 , 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy
FreakDaddy,

I play stack sizes from 20bb to 200bb and all my hands are mixed in together. My styles are wildly different depending on the stack size I play (vpip might vary by 10-15% and 3bet by 5-10%). Will the program work for me? Is there a way to filter for only hands with a certain stack size?
If you're playing a really wide range of stack sizes a lot, then steps 2/3 won't be accurate for you. You'll definitely be able to use an benefit from the other steps. We are adding another filter in the filters section so that you can just look at the last X number of hands. I can talk to the developer about adding a stack size filter (should be super simple), and then you could just exclude 80bb's and under and steps 2/3 will work fine.
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04-05-2011 , 01:18 PM
Just finished watching LFTV's 3-bet video (3-bet % of < 4% is a leak, LDO) and I thought it was the best resource for 3-betting I've come across. How's and why's and detail-wise. Probably second-nature to a lot of everyone else, but I'm pretty pumped about it.
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04-05-2011 , 01:23 PM
which one is that?
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04-05-2011 , 01:44 PM
It's exclusive to Leakbuster afaik.
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04-05-2011 , 01:48 PM
ah ok i thought it's part of the CR series
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04-05-2011 , 06:10 PM
I'm going to do an independent review of this program and post the findings in my blog in the coming week(s - depending on how long it gets).

I'm going into this with an open mind and a healthy dose of skepticism.
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04-05-2011 , 10:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leroy2DaBeroy
Just finished watching LFTV's 3-bet video (3-bet % of < 4% is a leak, LDO) and I thought it was the best resource for 3-betting I've come across. How's and why's and detail-wise. Probably second-nature to a lot of everyone else, but I'm pretty pumped about it.
Exact name?
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04-05-2011 , 10:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGetaRealJob
Exact name?
If you go to Step 2, at the top there's a rectangle called "Leakbuster Advice". At the bottom of that, there's a little rectangle with a movie reel. Click that and it will bring up the video content. I watched the one on 3-betting and the one on continuation betting. (The c-betting one was good, too, IMO.)
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04-05-2011 , 11:13 PM
found it, ty!
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04-06-2011 , 10:44 AM
FWIW, I figured out there wasn't as much difference in stats for my limits as I thought so I am working through LB PLO and documenting my progress here:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...keven-1013738/
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04-09-2011 , 07:27 PM
Are there more then the 4 videos in the trial? Just curious - I'm not a big video person but I watched the preflop one and liked that
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04-10-2011 , 08:32 AM
There are 7. I thought they were all pretty good with the exception of "Facing Limpers".
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04-11-2011 , 01:10 AM
And just like LB no-limit (which has 14 vids), we're going to be adding more to PLO fairly soon.
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05-01-2011 , 03:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakDaddy
And just like LB no-limit (which has 14 vids), we're going to be adding more to PLO fairly soon.
How many more videos are being planned beyond the first 7 and when will they be released?
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05-01-2011 , 12:53 PM
Scrolling through the pre-flop open-raising hand chart, I noticed some controversial ones. Connected rainbow mid-high pair (JJT9-TT76) should "always" be opened from SB. When there are limpers, I see little profit in that move. Also, if it's folded to you, a hand like TT76r doesn't play all that well HU oop and should only be raised against the worst type of nits who fold often pre. Overall, SB opening range seems a bit too wide in the chart. Is this based on winning player stats or general LB strat advice?
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05-01-2011 , 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ajloeffl
How many more videos are being planned beyond the first 7 and when will they be released?
We had planned on 3 more in the beginning of this month, but post black friday a lot of people's priorities have changed. We're still planning on having 1 or 2 more relatively soon (towards the end of this month). And once people get a little more settled we'll pursue content a little more aggressively.
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05-01-2011 , 02:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGetaRealJob
Scrolling through the pre-flop open-raising hand chart, I noticed some controversial ones. Connected rainbow mid-high pair (JJT9-TT76) should "always" be opened from SB. When there are limpers, I see little profit in that move. Also, if it's folded to you, a hand like TT76r doesn't play all that well HU oop and should only be raised against the worst type of nits who fold often pre. Overall, SB opening range seems a bit too wide in the chart. Is this based on winning player stats or general LB strat advice?
Charts are general guidelines and aren't absolutes. It's impossible to have any chart that would cover ever situation, or PLO would be solved. That being said I know Tom did a lot of research and looked at the profitability of hands based on several factors. I can see if he'll comment. As far as the specific hand you mentioned, if it's folded to you in the SB it's a profitable hand to open, but it will always be opponent dependent. You "should" always open it, but there will be some exceptions.

As a side note, when the charts were being put in Tom didn't have a SB open range and we asked him to add that. So I will try and get a hold of him and see if he can comment a little further. I know he's super thorough in his research and approach for what it's worth.
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05-04-2011 , 01:19 AM
If a "definite" leak according to LBO has a win-rate impact factor of 1 does this mean it is a smaller leak than another which has a higher win-rate impact factor?

I'm confused since some of my potential leaks have higher win-rate impact numbers than my "definite" leaks.
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05-04-2011 , 01:44 AM
Also my aggression in general seems to be too high. What are some ways to lower aggression factor and %? CB less?

I think trying to bet for value more as opposed to take the pot down will help? I find that people just fold so much at small stakes that betting to take it down is +ev

Last edited by Tyrannic; 05-04-2011 at 01:50 AM.
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05-04-2011 , 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrannic
Also my aggression in general seems to be too high. What are some ways to lower aggression factor and %? CB less?

I think trying to bet for value more as opposed to take the pot down will help? I find that people just fold so much at small stakes that betting to take it down is +ev
The optimal stats presented in the program are based on the averages of the biggest winners. FD, feel free to rephrase, but this is my understanding. IMO not abiding to those optimals is not necessarily a leak, but obv you need to know that the plays you make are +EV in different spots to prove otherwise.

Overall aggression is a really diverse stat for obv reasons, I think the best way to tone it down is to go over individual, street-by-street situations where you could be spewing. Does LB suggest you are c-betting too often? do you raise the flop too often? do you donk too often?
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