Kkq5s , 3way with shorty , and fd - Small Stakes Pot Limit Omaha

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy Omaha

Kkq5s , 3way with shorty , and fd

Post Reply Subscribe

...

09-11-2016 , 12:38 PM

Rorooen

enthusiast

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 61

sb: 58/22 flopdonk:25%
co: 54/40 15%b
I think i can open pre with my hand, but im not sure. ?
On the flop i think we dont want to pass against the shorty , but dont know which way is better , just call on the flop , but like this we give a good price for the co . , if we raise we commited to the pot...

$0.25/$0.50 Pot Limit Omaha Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

SB: $10.25 (20.5 bb)
BB: $27.93 (55.9 bb)
UTG: $52 (104 bb)
Hero (MP): $59.63 (119.3 bb)
CO: $64.83 (129.7 bb)
BTN: $74.71 (149.4 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 5

UTG folds, Hero raises to $1.75, CO calls $1.75, BTN folds, SB calls $1.50, BB calls $1.25

Flop: ($7) 4

(4 players)
SB bets $7, BB folds, Hero raises to $28, CO raises to $63.08 and is all-in, SB calls $1.50 and is all-in, Hero calls $29.88

Turn: ($131.26) 9

(3 players, 2 are all-in)
River: ($131.26) 9

(3 players, 2 are all-in)

Quote

09-12-2016 , 08:11 AM

AtomicSymphony

newbie

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 49

This is fine. I would also raise flop to isolate SB most of the time as it is impossible to play turns against CO.

Quote

09-12-2016 , 10:33 AM

thsheriff

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 199

Opening is standard but the flop is really tricky. Obviously we're happy to gii vs sb but when we gii with co we're going to be in bad shape. Without looking at numbers, I think this may be a fold.

Quote

09-13-2016 , 07:47 AM

SolarAU

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 1,795

No way it's a fold after we raise flop.

Quote

09-13-2016 , 10:03 AM

thsheriff

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 199

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolarAU

No way it's a fold after we raise flop.

That's not what I was saying.

Assuming CO always folds, EV of GII with SB is going to be positive but not by that much (I still haven't done any calculations here). But when you raise, CO is going to jam a fair amount. When this happens you're probably losing a lot more.

I don't know how often CO is going to jam but I'd suggest jamming is going to be slightly +EV at best and significantly -EV at worst.

So, I would opt to fold to SB's donk, I think. Though, I wouldn't be surprised if that's a mistake.

Quote

09-13-2016 , 06:34 PM

derjan

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,605

We have around 35% equity case villain holds a hand like A

xx or a set and we are trying to push out a hand like 5678 by raising which has around 35% vs our hand.

So if we are not really looking for variance we are pbb better of just calling the bet given that we are somewhere in the middle of the range that CO would give us action with.

Would have to calculate the likelihood that CO is holding a monster given his range and then we can calculate the EV from both calling and raising the flop but haven't done that in a while..

Quote

09-13-2016 , 06:36 PM

derjan

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by thsheriff

SB's pushing range is very wide and even if he has a set we are getting the right price to call. So we are not worried about him. With only CO to come we have to call the bet from SB. We are only worried about getting our money in as a 2:1 or less vs CO.

Quote

09-14-2016 , 01:33 AM

thsheriff

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 199

Quote:

Originally Posted by derjan

Calling plays so much worse than raising or folding. You're going to get raised immediately a lot, which you may actually have to fold to, and on turn you'll have to just call SB's shove and risk CO doing it on any card that doesn't improve your hand, and a lot that do.

There is a risk of playing a 200bb side pot, which we need >50% equity in to be able to GII on flop. When we raise, CO is likely folding anything we're doing well against and jamming when we're crushed.

Quote

09-14-2016 , 01:49 AM

AtomicSymphony

newbie

Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 49

Another note is CO might find a fold a naked NFD when we raise. I would in his shoes given the action.

Quote

09-14-2016 , 08:07 AM

#10

Rei Ayanami

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 11,685

Edit: never mind, this rule isn't always correct.

Last edited by Rei Ayanami; 09-14-2016 at 08:13 AM.

Quote

09-14-2016 , 08:15 AM

#11

thsheriff

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 199

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rei Ayanami

The minimum equity you need in a side pot is always <50% as long as you have >0% equity in the main pot. Additional odds are laid by your equity share in the main pot.

For example if the main pot after an AIPF with a very short stack is $15 and you have ~40% equity in that ($6), and the side pot ends up being $1000 on the flop of which you invest $500, you need to make back $494 from the side pot, so you need >49.4%.

Yeah, I didn't word that very well but kind of touched on it earlier: you're always losing money from the side pot when you GII with CO and i don't think enough money is being made from the main pot.

While we have you here, what do you think the best play is?

Quote

Post Reply Subscribe

...