LOL QFT - against Doyle, I mean seriously??

Also the thread title really needs to be changed to whether DN is the worst PRO who's ever played on High Stakes. I don't think he is, but it's a far more interesting discussion since he sure seems to be trying to make a case for it lately

Guys first of all I'd like to say I think Galfond is one of the best online cash game players in the world, in both NLHE and PLO.

However if you're Billy Bob from Kentucky and only watch TV poker you'd think he was the worst player ever to appear on the show.

Season 4 he was lamentable but he's been even worse so far this season.

This sounds pretty accurate to me.

What I think is laughable is that so many 2+2 posters think they know anything really solid about any of the players on the show.

Think about it ... unless it's Farha or Jamie Gold or something (and even if it is), how many hands do we see an individual player play per episode? Maybe five or six, and often less if the player is pretty tight.

People are making ridiculous judgements on the abilities of these players based on watching them play what amounts to a tiny, irrelevant number of hands.

So Galfond came on in the earlier seasons and sat tight for ... what ... 20 or 30 hands? And people here reckon they have him pegged? Pull your heads out!

Same goes for Dwan. He's made a couple of ballsy moves that paid off on national TV and suddenly this kid is a mind-reader that can do no wrong. What happens if Eastgate or Barry flip over a full house? I don't think we'd have the Dwan-hype that we see currently.

The fact is that nobody here has seen enough hands from any of these guys to make any real judgement whatsoever on any of them. Add to that the fact that it's much easier to make judgments when you see the cards. If we examined every hand that you (or I) ever played, and we could see all our opponents cards, I'll bet it would look like all of us make much more ******ed plays than anyone on HSP.

I think it's a pretty good guesstimate that anyone, including Gold, Farha, or anyone else, that appears on that show is much better than anyone posting in this thread, so who are we to judge what they're doing or what they're thinking?

I've run bad for 5,000 hands, bro. By no means am I saying I'm better, and I don't think anyone else here is really saying they are better than DN. All we can really do is watch him on HSP and formulate an opinion based on that.

Pretty much DN has been the staple on the show, he's been on it every single season. He's one of the constants on a show where almost no one else is a constant except maybe Doyle. I think by this time we can formulate a pretty decent opinion of him. Its not like anyone is claiming they have 200k hands of data on Daniel.

We're just talking about our opinions of what we've seen. Don't take it personally. Like I said, I SUCK, I would never say I would play better than him.

Well looks like someone already beat me to the point (in my last post).

Apologies for the double-up ... I admit to not reading the whole 17 pages before posting!

I play mainly on stars these days but I find it quite ironic that because of Daniel Negreanu team Full Tilt ie PA, Ivey and Durrrr still end up with my rake.

I'd say DN is prolly top 20 player on HSP.
Some ppl I put above him are:

aba20
PI
PA
DB
durrr
galfond
greenstein
alaei

DN would be in the legue of:
Juanda, ilari, ferguson, doyle, etc...

The worst player ever on HSP is easily bob safai....
Dennis phillips was pretty bad this season too.

Yeah Juanda, Zigmund, Doyle really struggle in cash games don't they...

Ban!

wow, this thread is 3 pages?

the answer is no guys.

Level?

I agree with john voight except for Zigmund.

Great points - agree 100%

OP

Yes

I'm just watching S6 of poker after dark now, and to me it looks like DN is also sucking pretty hard at that.

His certainty that Dwan was not on pocket-6s against Helmuth was obviously totally wrong. And I think his continuing needling of Helmuth is a bit pathetic. PH got all his money in that hand as a clear favorite and then folded on the street where he was losing. Good play.

DN has to realise he's not such a great deep stacks cash game player himself. He should lay off Helmuth and concentrate on his own game. He's a good player but not in the same league as Dwan, Ivey, Antonious and Gus (it seems to me anyway - but wtf do I know?).

If I was DN I'd be just folding any hand with Dwan in it. Dwan seems to have his number in everything.

TBH I only watched Season 4, and Daniel is pretty bad there. He's playing too loose and chasing way too many draws.

I really like Barry Greenstein's play in HSP though

The thing about Elezra is he's an ultra-succesful ultra-rich business man who likes to gamble. Even though he does suck at poker it's hard to bash someone who is having fun with money that means little to him innthe big picture.

Eli is a better NL cash player than Daniel.

It's just ridiculous to say that Eli sucks at poker.

Negreanu is the most watchable poker player i've seen. I love his game and his table presence. tbh any game he's involved in I would watch for that reason alone

Schadenfreude amirite?

I honestly think Daniel is

a) beyond just occasionally second-guessing himself and now does it constantly

b) freaked out b/c he's psyched himself out and has internalized to himself that he's a dog in these games

c) taking all of the comments in NVG and all over 2+2 about himself to heart, and destroying his confidence in himself

d) preoccupied w/ his personal life, not least the fact that his mother died --
think of how great she was to him. who does he have now that looks out for him that way? no one

d) doesn't practice his 'skills', if you will, enough and has become complacent about his game

i DN just for the nice, awesome guy he seems to be, and for his attitude toward the game. i like the guy and hope he can see past his current situation and get focused once more. 'gg' dn, and gl.

He is one of those people who always preach the right moves and never follow them through themselves.

maybe he just makes more $$$ selling weed to friends

don't we all? (be it in life, or in poker)

Haha, nice image. Does kinda look that way!

no, he is the most unlucky player on HSP...