From what Losev said, he clearly had no intention of string betting and had no idea whatsoever what was going on.

Fortunately, you bumped this thread.

Having read the responses from matt Savage & ColaradoSkibum I think the following becomes apparent.

1) Colarado's version of events is true to the rules of the WSOP 100% so therefore in this instance correct.

2) Matt's version probably suits the ethical understanding of the game better and would result in fewer disputes of this nature and/or severity.

the question I would put to both of you guy's based on that hand is this;

the player who was not involved in the hand asks the Floorman "if I move my whole stack around the table but do not release, that's ok?" To which the floor says "no, that's not OK" but does not explain why...

Does this mean that under the WSOP's interpretation of the rules this particular ruling is stack size dependent? It gave the impression that it's OK to do this with a certain number of chips, but not all your chips.... surely that cannot possibly be right? A rule has to be a rule regardless of the quantity of chips involved.

One thing I want to know is, why didn't the Tournament director take the dealer away upstairs and view the footage?

I mean, who cares about what any of the players at the table say. Take the dealer, get this thoughts. Watch the footage (we're in a casino people), and make a facts based decision

WSOP isn't a $5 SnG.

First off, I'm sorry to bump this thread. I just saw this again on the WSOP replays and just found this thread. I've read all of the posts in this thread, and there are some good arguments on both sides of the coin. Personally, I think it was a string bet and the $3 million should have counted. But to the quoted post, Cantu was right to just call. Think about it this way, Cantu has thrown a fit over an additional $1.5 needing to be tacked into the pot. He gets a ruling from one director, then the Head WSOP Official. They both rule in favor of Losev. Now, what does Cantu have to gain by raising? He's given away the strength of his hand completely. He's not going to do that with an A. Heck, I wouldn't even do that with AK. If Cantu raises, there are only two things that can happen. Cantu will be called by a superior boat or Losev, now knowing Cantu is incredibly strong, will just muck his hand. There's no way in hell that Losev is calling anything else after the spectacle Cantu made regarding the hand.

flatting was a big mistake

Caught this hand earlier today as ESPN2 was re-airing last year's ME pretty much back to back (probably still is, who knows).

When I first saw it I wanted to say Losev made a mistake, but iirc the rules are that until you let your chips go - until you release them by contact and are no longer actually touching them - they're not actually a bet.

While I'll get flamed for saying this, because primarily it's a fictional event, but in the movie "Rounders" there's that point where Damon's character sortakinda pushes a stack towards the outer edge of the table, not forward towards the center of the table directly, and hangs onto the chips for dear life almost as he contemplates, then makes that fateful look at KGB and finally realizes the tell he's giving off.

Yes, it's fictional, that's a given, but in all the games I've ever played live (not as many as most of the people around here so...) the unspoken but accepted rule of thumb is they're your chips and not part of the pot till you physically release 'em, just as in chess where a move isn't 100% committed as long as the player maintains contact with the piece.

Break that contact, and they're not your chips any longer and part of the pot. As long as you're touching 'em, they're still yours...

i'm sure this was said countless times in this thread, but what ever happened to the idea of forward motion? hasn't that always been the policy at the wsop or does the rio have different rules?

I wonder if Cantu pump-faked his way through the Omaha tourney the other day, where he won his second bracelet.

SIDEBAR COMMENT: If you like the idea of pump faking, play poker on one of those mechanical tables (cruise ships, Excalibur, etc). You can bet "all-in" and all your chips will go into the middle (where you wait for your opponents reaction), but while the screen is waiting for you to "confirm" your bet, you can actually just "cancel" and then fold, check or raise.

Well, then, why did the floor manager tell Michael Carroll he couldn't push his chips and then bring them back?

IMO the worst call since Don Denkinger called Jorge Orta safe at first.

Bad ruling, imo he wanted to bet 3 mil and at the last moment changed his mind and pulled it back.

i hope carrol is dead

Well, Carroll's demonstration showed the stack being pushed much further towards the middle than Losev did.

Still, I'm not sure about the ruling.

This is a very timely thread.

cantu think hes playing plo or something? just calling there and not raising is so bad lol

I think the ruling was fair guys Kappa

But that was still a string bet PogChamp

Holy necro-bump.