Wheeling Island Poker Room, 1/2 NLHE.

Preflop action doesn't matter, there was some raising and two people saw the flop.

On the flop, Guy A bets 25, Guy B raises to 50, Guy A says "50 more" and before Guy A puts his raise out Guy B says "All in for 49". Guy A looks at the dealer and asks "How much more?" the dealer says "It will be 49 additional". Guy A counts out 49 and pushes it in the middle. Right after the dealer see's Guy A push chips in the middle, he deals the turn and the river. Guy B wins the pot. The dealer says to Guy A "You owe 50 dollars" he puts on a pissed off face and says "What!? You said I only owed 49 additional!?" The dealer explains "You raised 50 more, but you didnt put it out yet, however, thats a verbal bet which is binding, so when you asked how much more I said 49 because you were verbally in for 100." Well Guy A dosnt like this at all and starts arguing with the dealer. The dealer calls the floor, and after 10 minutes or so, the floor says, "It was a dealer error and you owe 50 more to the pot."

During this whole gigantic time waster, I was on the dealers side and I put Guy A on trying to get away with not paying off this guy and was counting on the dealer making an error so he can save an extra 50 bucks.

My question is this, is this the dealers fault? I feel like it isn't.

Thanks!

Dealer should have gotten the money into the pot before dealing the turn but he did remember to get it from the player. It owuld have been easier and less time would have been wasted to get the money pre turn.

However, that small slip does not excuse Guy A from his obligation to the pot. (Guy A is no relation to Dealer Guy nor is Guy B)

sounds like just plain miss-communication.
but just to clarify was the 49 from B ontop of the 50 raise by A? If so, then it is As fault.

Many people like to assign fault as though it is an either or situation. But in this case they both are at fault.

This is why I insist on chips going over the line or forward past your cards before dealing out the turn and river. I hear a lot of whining but it doesn't take much effort at all to put your chips forward, yet it wastes gobs of time when nonsense like this happens. When dealing I don't trust but always verify by making the players push the damn chips forward already.

From reading your post I have no idea what happened. Sounds like it was an easily confusing situation. The dealer could/should have simplified it by pulling bets in and telling whoever the action is on what they need to put in to continue in the pot. This should ALWAYS be done before the turn and river go out. The dealer made a mistake.

However, that doesn't make it all the dealers fault. If it was clear what was happening on the flop obviously the player who owes money needs to just put it in instead of arguing to save $

Guy B and dealers fault.

When the player said "all in for 49" it sounded like he had 49 of the last 50 bet.

Dealer and Guy B should have made it clear it was 49 more on top of the last 50.

It's everybody at the table's responsibility. We all saw this one coming a mile away.

Awww, but it doesn't affect you, and you're not in the hand, so it's not up to you to decide, right? Wrong. You think this whole mess isn't affecting the mood of the table? It's not taking time away?

We're all in it together.

Dealers fault 100%

All bets should be sorted before the cards are dealt.

Sound like even after the fact, the dealer/floor could not get it right.

Dealer's fault for not clarifying it.

Guy A is trying to wiggle out when he knows he would have called the bet if the dealer had made it perfectly clear. $249 in pot from just the postflop action and he owed $49? Not going to call?

pretty sure the INSTA reraise has never worked smoothly

I guarantee if Player A wins he sits up straighter and wants to get a GOOD look at Player B's chips and wants to get paid on ALL of the chips. He never will say, I only thought it was $49 of my last $50 not ANOTHER $49...

huh? small stack said "all-in" and was called. There isn't a lot of room for confusion if the chips are sitting there on the table in front of everybody.

I'm new to this casino/cardroom world, but wow, it seems like nobody can even count correctly.

Um no, please try again.

All in and a call does not require all the chips to be put into the pot. There's enough witnesses at the table and the chips are clearly visible. Anyone who confuses $49 with $99 is probably not too bright to begin with.

The answer is in the middle.

All bets don't need to be brought in (though it helps), but all players should be clear on the action.

Yes they should be, but how hard is 50 bet, it's 49 MORE, to understand?

Then again, never mind, I see it constantly. UTG will ask 3x how much is it, you tell them $2, then they up and FOLD.

With the "50s" and "all-ins" going back and forth, I can see how it was unclear. To those of us watching, we see exactly what's happening, and we can also see how they don't see it. When you're in a hand, especially if you're not as experienced as a lot of us, the pressure and adrenaline can make your brain fumble a little.

The player seen the stack his opponent put in, it was twice the size of his, the dealer should have been clearer so that part was his fault. Dealers should never assume the player is honest and competent, he should have said player is all-in for $49 more then made sure the player put in the proper chips, not just the $49.

All bets in the middle should be equal at the point of the cards turning. Therefore there is no confusion since u can see how much is left in the stacks.

It sounds as if this wasn't done, making it the dealers fault.

The players can't argue if the chips in the middle are met, and after the cards all the dealer needs to do is compare remaining stacks.

Um no, please try again.

All in and a call does not require all the chips to be put into the pot...

I make them put in the damn chips already. Five seconds of each player putting their chips in the pot saves ten minutes of arguments when it goes all wrong. And it goes wrong far too often, thus my insistence.

No, they don't. But even if you don't pull in all the chips, it's a good idea to at least match the last bet pushed forward, to reduce confusion. Leave the total amount left to call separate and clearly identifiable.

Protect your... table.

No, you don't have to, but it greatly helps, and avoids problems like this.

At which point in my post do i say ALL the chips must be in the pot??

There should be the same amount of money from both A and B in the pot b4 the cards are turned. That doesnt mean it needs to be all the chips.

For example:

Player A bets $50 These chips are in the middle of the table now

Player B raises to $150 has no time to put the chips out

Player A goes all in for $450

If the dealer now turns a card it will create confusion.
The dealer can fix this by either: pushing the initial $50 back to player A so neither player has any extra money in the pot, or he can equal the bets on the table, weather its the $50, the $150, or the $450.

Either way it goes: