OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

[Avataren]

okay that makes sense.

[JustinSFO]

Mostly, $0.02/$0.04 on Merge. About 6,600 at $0.05/$0.10 and 1,345 at $0.10/$0.20. Probably a little spewy with turn CBets particularly against villains who will call down with any pair.

[Admania]

Justin

Congrats on the great winrate, it was funny because I was looking at your Wtsd at 39 and your w$sd at 47 and I thought you must be running bad until I saw your winrate at 4.5BB/100, seems kinda strange.

I think you know your cbet turn at 96% is off the charts and I think you'll need to tone it down if you were to move up. I would be curious to know what your cbet river stat is out of interest. I always wanted to try but never got round to it just 100% barreling every street at a micro limit to see what the outcome would be, you seem to be doing well doing that on the flop and turn.

[JustinSFO]

I was kinda curious so I pulled up my Stars ($0.25/$0.50) database (last session 4/14/2011) and the turn CBets are just a bit lower; maybe still too high.

My River CBet drops to around 74% for Merge nano.

[antneye]

May as well ask this in here. Total n00b question but I think I am doing it wrong so I may as well ask. Some basic stat confusion.

If a villain has the following stats:
VPIP:35
PFR:10

If I want to stove my holdings against his limping range how do I figure out what to eliminate from his 35% since he did not raise? Is it as simple as eliminating the top 10%?

[augwest]

fwiw - in general that's where I start - and then tweak it a bit for position, open limp vs over limp, etc..

for example someone may open limp from utg a hand that they would raise from the button, or they might open limp from the button with a hand they would fold from utg...
so just subtracting PFR from VPIP isn't necessarily the whole story

[antneye]

Originally Posted by augwest

fwiw - in general that's where I start - and then tweak it a bit for position, open limp vs over limp, etc..

for example someone may open limp from utg a hand that they would raise from the button, or they might open limp from the button with a hand they would fold from utg...
so just subtracting PFR from VPIP isn't necessarily the whole story

lets assume these are their co stats and they are in the co.

[augwest]

Well then if you have a large enough sample for positional stats to converge then you also will know if they do anything funky like limp-reraise AA/KK. So let's also assume he's straightforward in this respect.

So here's what the simple subtraction gives us



However at my typical stakes a villain is more likely to have the small pp's and more sc's in his range so I would adjust it to look more like this



Again - I'm no genius, it's just how I currently do it...

[ryanpb]

HI guys,

I'm a big dirty live fish and haven't got much of a clue with what i'm doing online. I thought you guys could help me out.

After having holdem manager for about 4 years I recently realised I could customise stats and as I want to play limit I thought you could let me know if I am on the right track

[IMG][/IMG]

Also, I was going to customise them with colours but I realised that I don't really know what normal values are and I was wondering if someone could point me in the right direction with that.

Thanks

[augwest]

Too much imo - I had a 4 line HUD when I started and found that it became a crutch
and actually hindered my progress in hand reading and ranging villains because I was attempting to interpret the stats more than I was watching and understanding the table dynamics and actions being taken.

imo, try to keep it to one or two lines or else you will be spending too much time at the table trying to look at the villains stats rather than watching how they are actually playing.

I'm down to one simple line of stats:

I think VPIP/PFR/AF are pretty standard
I have 3bet in there (although this is another stat that takes a bit longer to converge and where notes are going to be more valuable - I don't look at this stat very often tbh)
I also like ATS, fsbts, and fbbts - these are really helpful in deciding what ranges you can defend/steal with
and I have wtsd to help judge showdown bound-ness

I would dump "limp" and just take a note the first few times he does it and eventually consolidate them into a note like "open limps ep and mp w/ sm pp's and med sc's"

flop cbet is pretty useless since most players will already cbet close to 100% up to 3way
and will check 4way+ without a made hand - it will be rare that this stat will stick out and provide any value - if you see a villain check back after a pfr a few times (especially into a a small field) then just take a note "plays passive post after pfr" - a low Total AF will sort of indicate this tendency anyway.


fold to flop cbet is also fairly useless imo - if a villain is folding a lot to cbets you should already have a note that says "plays fit or fold on flop" - also imo your better off looking at wtsd in correlation to their VPIP number to see how showdown bound they are with what relative strength.

dump the donk bet stats and take notes - notes on what they donk with are WAYYyyy more useful - notes like "Donks TP only" or "Donks any pair + draws" are necessary to make decisions - you can't make decisions just based on this number

I also ended up dumping af by street - total af is usually a good enuf indicator and you want to focus on hand reading and board textures more than you want to try to interpret these stats.

I also ended up dumping wsd and w$sd but only because I didn't get any real value from having them in front of me - again notes like "showdown Ahi on dry boards" are gonna tell you a lot more

My 2c fwiw

[antneye]

Have we ever established what a reasonable BB/100 is out of the BB and the SB for 6Max? I vaguely recall this being discussed in the past but am not sure if there was any consensus.

[prfsr_cain]

Alright guys here's my stats after 10k hands and still have no clue what I'm doing help me please lol. WTSD = 35.95, W$SD = 53.07, and AF = 2.2



Oh and too lazy to post a new pic lol but WTSD = 35.95 (too low I'm guessing) , W$SD = 53.07, and AF = 2.2

[DougL]

Paying 4BB/100 in rake, you probably don't have to defend BB 70%. These are pretty reasonable stats for a mid-stakes LAGTAG. Your AF is probably a tiny bit high for someone who is playing this wide open -- you have the goods less often than a standard TAG, you're flopping more marginal hands, etc. Look for spots where you're bluffing with the best hand, passing on inducing bluffs, etc. Not a big deal and AF can be driven by passive opponents.

21% UTG seems pretty wide. I don't mind being loose/nuts in position. I'd prefer to be a little more picky in EP.

[antneye]

Originally Posted by antneye

Have we ever established what a reasonable BB/100 is out of the BB and the SB for 6Max? I vaguely recall this being discussed in the past but am not sure if there was any consensus.

bump this q

[nyrugby]

Originally Posted by antneye

Have we ever established what a reasonable BB/100 is out of the BB and the SB for 6Max? I vaguely recall this being discussed in the past but am not sure if there was any consensus.

Curious about this too. I'm (25.1) in BB (1.1) in SB Don't Know if that's good, bad or standard