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Old 07-21-2012, 07:07 PM   #1
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.25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

    Preflop: Hero is SB with K K
    UTG calls, 3 folds, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG calls

    Flop: (6 SB) A J A (3 players)
    Hero bets, BB folds, UTG calls

    Turn: (4 BB) 8 (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls

    River: (6 BB) 5 (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls



    hi all,

    op: 44/5/1 for 40 hands..
    i dont have any special read on op.
    any advice ?
    should i do turn c-bet?
    going showdown is ok ?

    thanks in advance
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    Old 07-21-2012, 08:01 PM   #2
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Why did you check on the turn after betting the flop? The 8 shouldn't change anything on this board.

    In my opinion you should be betting this turn to get value from flush and straight draws as well as Js and smaller pocket pairs. You can consider folding if you get raised by this (so far according to his stats) loose passive opponent.

    As to the river as played, I really can't see folding, since he could be "value betting" a J, smaller pair, or just bluffing since you showed weakness on the turn. Given that, I think you are good more than 1 time out of 7 so you should call.
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    Old 07-22-2012, 12:01 PM   #3
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Easy turn bet for value. Think about how the two Aces on the board affects his chances of having an Ace.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 05:31 AM   #4
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Bet the turn, that's a safe card and if the guy's slowplayed an A he'll let you know here by raising. I like the river check though, missed clubs might have a bluff as will KQ or T9s due to your check on the turn.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 10:33 AM   #5
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    I will only check this turn for deception vrs. a thinking player ,maybe once in a billion times. The turn is not a cbet but a value bet vrs a jack/draw/ someone who thinks you are cbetting/ someone with a small pocket pair/etc/etc.

    I am betting and calling a raise very often here.

    I'll be happy to lose this hand when I bet/call a raise.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 10:56 AM   #6
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    *g*

    I cbet the turn for value the 8 is a blank. Call down if raised or as played. He open limped and there's 2 As on the board, unlikely to have one in his hand.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:10 AM   #7
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nyrugby View Post
    *g*

    I cbet the turn for value the 8 is a blank. Call down if raised or as played. He open limped and there's 2 As on the board, unlikely to have one in his hand.
    Agree on turn, but a 44/5 has a lot of limped aces in his range. If he is as passive as his stats indicate, calling down could be bad.

    i know the sample size is not big, but let's make believe he is 44/5/1 over a large sample..do you still call down a turn c/r from him?
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:20 AM   #8
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by antneye View Post
    Agree on turn, but a 44/5 has a lot of limped aces in his range. If he is as passive as his stats indicate, calling down could be bad.

    i know the sample size is not big, but let's make believe he is 44/5/1 over a large sample..do you still call down a turn c/r from him?
    Tougher scenario, but he can't x/r you on the turn he has position. I would hope if I had volume on the guy I would have notes that would help me make the decision. But the read would have to be real solid for me not to go to showdown with KK.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:26 AM   #9
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Granted, the pot isn't very big, but do we discount his bluffing possibility that much in a heads up situation?

    We have a Pair of Kings , vrs only one other player, 2 aces on board. Is this even controversial, or do I have a tendency to call too much?

    We only have 40 hands on this dude. I am not folding and if I lose I won't think twice about it.

    Do I call too easily in pots like this?

    Last edited by Green-Machine; 07-23-2012 at 11:31 AM. Reason: *I am also calling if these are long term stats, and I don't even think about it. I wonder if I should.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:35 AM   #10
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    ^^
    yeah, my post above is about antneye's c/r scenario
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:40 AM   #11
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nyrugby View Post
    Tougher scenario, but he can't x/r you on the turn he has position. I would hope if I had volume on the guy I would have notes that would help me make the decision. But the read would have to be real solid for me not to go to showdown with KK.
    Yeah...not shot for a C/R, but the same thinking applies. I think if we have a lot of hands on the guy we would have notes to go with it. There are some villains who I will happily b/f to and others that I would simply call down as you recommend.

    This guy, early on, looks like he will develop into someone we can b/f, but at this point in time I guess we have to b/c in order to start developing those reads since 40 hand is not a lot to go on.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:41 AM   #12
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Green-Machine View Post
    Granted, the pot isn't very big, but do we discount his bluffing possibility that much in a heads up situation?
    Not at this point in time, but as I said above, with more hands and more notes we can definitely learn something and start to exploit guys like this (or should I say guys with his stats over a large sample)
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:45 AM   #13
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Another reason I am calling is because I have a bit of a weak/tight image, so I generally factor in bluffs vrs me more than you guys might.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:49 AM   #14
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    As played I think we have to calldown, by checking the turn he very well could be betting with what he thinks is the best hand Jx or even 8x.
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    Old 07-23-2012, 11:53 AM   #15
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    Re: .25 .5 AAJ flop w/KK 1 limper

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nyrugby View Post
    As played I think we have to calldown, by checking the turn he very well could be betting with what he thinks is the best hand Jx or even 8x.
    Absolutely, there are a thousand reasons to call the river as played, and this is a great one.

    I get the impression he had trip A, but it was absolutely not a mistake (as played) to call the river.
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