Curious about my flop and turn play on this one. Expert or suspect?

MP is a 38/31/1.5 over 100 hands or so. He is aggro but not necessarily at the right times. A little erratic and I have not quite decided how good/bad he is. Looks like a guy who wants to be a LAG but hasn't quite nailed down how to do it.

Button is a fishy maniac type who just seems to mash the raise button. He is 48/29/1.8 over 153 hands or so.


[converted_hand][hand_history]Merge, $1/$2 Limit Hold'em Cash, 5 Players
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Preflop: Hero is CO with Q Q
MP raises, Hero 3-bets, BTN caps, SB folds, BB calls, MP calls, Hero calls

Preflop plays itself.

Flop: (16.5 SB) 2 4 6 (4 players)
BB checks, MP checks, Hero bets, BTN calls, BB calls, MP calls

This is a great flop for my hand and I decide to donk hoping to get a spite raise from the manic button. My thoughts were this is the best way to protect my hand.

Turn: (10.3 BB) J (4 players)
BB checks, MP checks, Hero bets, BTN calls, BB calls, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, BTN folds, BB calls, MP calls

My flop plan failed to produce the desired results yet the card is a good one for me. Standard turn C-Bet. MP's raise could be a very wide range and I feel pretty strong he would be raising AJ, KJ, QJ or any other J he may be holding so i 3! to protect my hand and hopefully get this heads up on the river ip.


River: (20.3 BB) 2 (3 players)
BB checks, MP checks, Hero bets,


My turn plan got rid of 1 and with a total blank I am v-betting the river.

I like it, call if raised 'cause pot is huuuge

This becomes an interesting spot on the river if it comes back to you on the third floor.

NH

PS. I'd put some turned FD's into villain's range. People seem to like to semibluff draws in hopeless spots these days.

nh imo.
I'd be fine with going another way on the flop, though donking is probably fine, too.
b/c (for one, at least) on river. If it came back TWO raises.......idk; I probably spite call against this crowd.

This is just a hopeless spot, because we led two streets in a row into a crowded pot?

How would you have played it differently?

To be honest, I never felt hopeless at any point in the hand.

To clarify, what I mean to say was that by the river I fully expect to be ahead and don't think my v-bet is all that close. I was mostly curious about my flop donk and turn 3!.

If you turn a flush draw and decide to bluff antneye off his over pair in a 4 way pot, you're hopeless. That was my comment, "People try to semibluff a turned draw here, even though it is hopeless".
Flop donk is standard. Your villain isn't likely to have hit anything on this flop. Maybe he bets anyway. Maybe he spite raises JTs. You don't really want to give the field a free draw. In modern poker, we check to the raiser because he bets a lot. Even a meh LAG may decide to check back his overcards to the 6. He also raises you with worse than QQ. You totally expect 88 to jam you.

Turn 3 bet, as others have said, there are plenty of J's in his range to get value out of. I don't think MP has 100% of his big pairs, so JJ and AA-KK are less of a concern. Likely.

My other comment was that this hand becomes interesting if it comes to you 3 bet on the river. A single raise on the river is just giggle and call or decide whether to 3 bet thin yourself.

Yeah Doug, I got your original post and was thinking along those lines.....it was Schup I misread. I thought he was saying my line was hopeless. I didn't catch that he was questioning your comment.

Glad that got figured out, because ftr, i like your line.

I would play the same. Nice donkbet flop bcz this is only way to protect hand. Turn you still need to protect, acehighs or AK KQ overs or even gutshots maybe, called after one bet but will fold after raise-reraise.

stop thinking less in terms of "protecting", but rather in terms of value in limit games.

I think this is the most interesting part of the hand.

Hand is perfectly played.