OOT Cooking thread 2011

[omnimirage]

I think pesticides and all that stuff would be a leading reason to consume organic food. We're made of the same stuff in the end, and if the insects can't stand it... Not sure if it works like that though.

It is very expensive, good point about the labeling, gonna do some more research into it

[JackInDaCrak]

Csa farm shares and farmers markets are where it's at if you cannot grow your own. Other than that I agree with RB, factory organic is just a marketing gimmick. Grass fed beef is a matter of preferences, but I think that pastured usually local pork and poultry is markedly better than the corporate alternatives.

[omnimirage]

I'll try to find some local markets, but it will be hard to determine whether they're not loaded with chemicals


Is it worth buying/making my own broth for soups and what not? Seems like a tad bit of a waste of vegetables to do it myself and I suspect commercial ones will be pretty unhealthy.

Does a dish lose flavor/nutrients by allowing it to cook without the lid on? So allowing lots of unnecessary steam to escape. If I've made a dish that is too watery, what will happen if I decide to "overcook" it? Let's say with a curry for example that looks too much like a soup

[JackInDaCrak]

I don't really care about pesticides/chemicals but the fresh produce from local farmers just tastes fresher and more like it should imo.

Making your own stock/broth is absolutely worth it. Onions, carrots, and celery are cheap, and chicken bones are free if you buy bone-in chicken instead of boned chicken. Bone-in chicken is also disproportionally cheap compared to the weight difference for boned chicken since you're paying for the labor/machine to de-bone the chicken. In any event it's good to learn that chicken anatomy by cleaning the carcass yourself, it will only help you work with the birds in the future.

Steam escaping doesn't carry with it the flavors of the dish significantly even if it smells good. I usually leave lids on when I want something to cook slowly over low heat and lid off when I want something to cook quickly and reduce moisture like for a sauce. That's a massive oversimplification but there's reasons to do both for different dishes.

Usually to some extent you can reduce a watery soup, but you have to be mindful of overcooking the meat and vegetables in it. Over time you'll just get a feeling for how much liquid or how much heat particular ingredients can handle.

[Ron Burgundy]

Is it worth buying/making my own broth for soups and what not? Seems like a tad bit of a waste of vegetables to do it myself and I suspect commercial ones will be pretty unhealthy.

I don't make my own stock just because I rarely use stocks. Homemade stocks are generally going to be better, but there are respectable store brands. I often buy a brand called Pacific natural foods, they make a decent veg and chicken stock. Always get low sodium stocks if you're buying it, and add your own salt to taste. You never really know how salty it's going to be, and if you plan on making any kind of reduction sauce with it, you're going to concentrate the salt and make it super salty. I'm not sure why you think store brands would be so unhealthy.

[Ron Burgundy]

Does a dish lose flavor/nutrients by allowing it to cook without the lid on? So allowing lots of unnecessary steam to escape.

steam is evaporated water, not nutrients. Nutrients are solids.

You will lose nutrients into the cooking water tho. So when you boil a vegetable, some of the nutrients will leech out into the water, so if you want to retain all the nutrients, use techniques that will incorporate the cooking liquid as well as the veggies. Or use a different (dry) technique.

If I've made a dish that is too watery, what will happen if I decide to "overcook" it? Let's say with a curry for example that looks too much like a soup

The longer you cook it, the more water will evaporate.

[omnimirage]

hmrmmmm ok, so stocks are generally recommended if I'm going to make a minestrone soup? I eat a vegan diet, so the soup will lack that extra flavor from the bones or whatever it comes from. Oh and when should I add the salt to it? /noob cooker

What actually happens to the vegetables when they're over cooked?

[Ron Burgundy]

hmrmmmm ok, so stocks are generally recommended if I'm going to make a minestrone soup?

soups can be made with stock or water, the water would essentially become a stock when you cook the soup ingredients in it.

I eat a vegan diet, so the soup will lack that extra flavor from the bones or whatever it comes from.

there's vegetable stock, mushroom stock. You can make stock out of anything. Stock is just a general term for "water that's had stuff cooked in it, and the flavors of the stuff has permeated the water." At the restaurant I worked at this summer, they made corn stock, rhubarb stock, and a few others I can't remember, in addition to the standard chicken/veal/veg stocks.

What actually happens to the vegetables when they're over cooked?

I'm not going to go into the scientific answer, but veggies will get mushy and bland if they're overcooked.

[JackInDaCrak]

Google recipes for cort boullion for a standard veg stock recipe. For veg stock you need to add lots of veg, and you can add the "bones" of your veg i.e. mushroom stems, celery trimmings, parsley stems etc.

For the non-green vegetables you need to develop flavor by roasting or sauteeing them before you add them to the stock.

When veggies are overcooked they get mushy and bland and unpleasant to eat. Most vegetables at bad restaurants and bad home cooks' kitchens are overcooked rather than undercooked.

[omnimirage]

Thanks both for the good answers

soups can be made with stock or water, the water would essentially become a stock when you cook the soup ingredients in it.

That's what I did the other day, didn't put any stock but a bunch of vegetables instead, I figured why make a stock when I could use the vegetables in the soup instead but it turned out rather bland, I only cooked it for an hour or so though. Would it be recommended to either cook the soup for an extended period, or create/buy a stock?

you can add the "bones" of your veg i.e. mushroom stems, celery trimmings, parsley stems etc.

Oh right yeah ok, but wait, you don't use the stems of your mushrooms in cooking?

For the non-green vegetables you need to develop flavor by roasting or sauteeing them before you add them to the stock.

weird, so I can chuck a non-fresh tomato/bell pepper in the oven to make it taste better?

When they go bland, does the flavor "creep" out into the sauce?

[Ron Burgundy]

Oh right yeah ok, but wait, you don't use the stems of your mushrooms in cooking?

some mushroom stems, like shiitakes, are really tough and not good for eating, but they can add flavor to stocks.

weird, so I can chuck a non-fresh tomato/bell pepper in the over to make it taste better?

heat will evaporate water and caramelize the sugars in the veggies, and do some other more complicated things. Heat also breaks down the cell walls of plants, making them softer. The point is, roasting veggies makes them taste better, yes. But a "non-fresh" veggie might still taste like **** if it has really gone bad.

[Ron Burgundy]

That's what I did the other day, didn't put any stock but a bunch of vegetables instead, I figured why make a stock when I could use the vegetables in the soup instead but it turned out rather bland, I only cooked it for an hour or so though. Would it be recommended to either cook the soup for an extended period, or create/buy a stock?

If it's bland you should try using stock instead of plain water, yeah. What was the recipe you used?

[JackInDaCrak]

Originally Posted by pat3392

Thanks both for the good answers

That's what I did the other day, didn't put any stock but a bunch of vegetables instead, I figured why make a stock when I could use the vegetables in the soup instead but it turned out rather bland, I only cooked it for an hour or so though. Would it be recommended to either cook the soup for an extended period, or create/buy a stock?

Cooking the soup for longer would probably develop more flavor but probably not as much as using a stock in the first place. By making stock you essentially make soup base and use it for future soups, and develop the flavors from there. Stock also cooks for many many hours. Between 4 and 24 or longer depending on whom you ask. By using stock you can put together a rich, complex soup in a matter of 20 minutes.

Oh right yeah ok, but wait, you don't use the stems of your mushrooms in cooking?
Depends on the mushroom, really. Some mushrooms' stems are tough. Sometimes I remove the stems and stuff the caps (photo related). My point was that you don't necessarily need to make a shopping run to make stock, you can make it with whatever's on hand even if you wouldn't normally eat that part of whatever item it is, such as bones, stems, peels, whatever.



weird, so I can chuck a non-fresh tomato/bell pepper in the oven to make it taste better?
non-green as in onions, carrots, celery (I know it's green), garlic, mushrooms, turnips, rutabaga, parsnips, etc. basically any vegetable but leafy greens. Using something non-fresh will not work so well.

When they go bland, does the flavor "creep" out into the sauce?
sure but not enough to make up for killing your vegetables

[jws43yale]

Originally Posted by JackInDaCrak

Csa farm shares and farmers markets are where it's at if you cannot grow your own. Other than that I agree with RB, factory organic is just a marketing gimmick. Grass fed beef is a matter of preferences, but I think that pastured usually local pork and poultry is markedly better than the corporate alternatives.

CSA is the best. Just did one in NYC and got phenomenal veggies.

Been doing a ton of cooking with Heirloom tomatoes since they have been in peak season.

[omnimirage]

Cooking IQ +5 points

Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy

If it's bland you should try using stock instead of plain water, yeah. What was the recipe you used?

I was winging it, so know of a bunch of ways to improve it, will give you guys a shout if it's bland again. You're that guy who was living in his car doing poker for a living, but decided to to become a chef/baker or something instead, right?


I've got some ideas for a awesome enchilada; wanna make everything from scratch basically, including refried beans(never used a dried bean, nor am I sure if it will go well with but it sounds like it will) own tortilla bread(may skip this one) sauce and my own vegan "cheese", think I'll need to buy a proper food processor though 'cause I don't think my drink blender will crush cashews properly, also wanna make a ricotta on the side to make it go further and some sort of pretty garnish for it. Anyone done anything like this before? I've never made anything like this before, particularly unsure about what spices to use