Thanks for the lease advice champ.

No one is making money off their car. Period. The idea that you're "investing" money in it is as retarded as saying you're investing in a washing machine. You're buying a tool that moves you places. If your goal is strictly utilitarian (I want something cheap with minimal risk of mechanical breakdown and minimal fuel consumption) then optimize that. If your goal is to have something fun and luxurious and new then that's a different set of criteria that's neither wrong nor dumb.

Leases are perfectly reasonable for people to get.

fyp

There is a price to having a new car every 2-3 years by leasing. It's a much bigger cost than buying and holding long term, but if people are willing to pay the cost for the luxury then go for it.

I think it's laughable when I run into people who are always struggling for money and they are leasing nice cars though. But that's obvious (at least to me).

Geaux ul: are you the guy who bought a pickup truck for long commutes?

I want to thank everybody for keeping the discussion going, I am still in the market and after a lot of discussion with my wife, friends, and family, we are going to be as patient as we can and just find a deal that works for us. We are targeting a new/almost new Sonata or a used TL. If something else comes along and the value looks too good to pass up we will consider it. We are going to start test driving today actually, so I'll TR if it will help anybody.

Fwiw, I agree with both points about the comfort of buying a nicer car vs the value of buying a used beater. In the end it obviously comes down to the specifics of your individual situation more than anything else. As most of us are poker players I think we (more than the average consumer) are always looking to make optimal decisions and find the best value. As one or two other people pointed out in the thread, sunk costs are kind of an unavoidable factor in purchasing a car, unless you find a really good situation such as luckily finding what you want from a private seller in your area.

For anyone else in the market, if you don't have Geico, take a look into it. They are certainly price leaders in the industry. I don't know how this works but I saw a used 2006 TL (30k miles ~15k) I was really interested in, and got a quote. For the same coverage, my payment was actually less expensive than my Sentra. Might be because I have a Spec-V, but either way its awesome news.

Did you get the GLS or the Limited? Include any options? And how much did you pay if you don't mind me asking. I need to get in the car and check it out myself but the dinky wheels on the base model are unbearable to me. Everything else with the car looks perfect. Have you had to use your warranty yet?

PS - My wife curbed our Sentra today and ripped a tire.. Leaning towards Hyundai.

Yeah, I'm also the guy who gets 100% of my gas for free.

FWIW,
Here's 2 links to the "Free Car for Life" plan. In short, if you save a car payment for 5 years instead of spending a car payment for 5 years you'll have enough money to buy that same car used AND have enough money for a car fund that will replenish itself with compound interest when u need to buy another car. It's amazing how you can take two people with the same amount of money and after 5 years one is rich and one is broke. Neat stuff.

Video:
http://www.daveramsey.com/article/drive-free/

Article:
http://www.barefootinvestor.com/free-cars-buying-plan/

I guess I can appreciate that this is going to go over your head because, after all, you decided that buying a pickup truck was a good idea for a commuter car. I'm perfectly ok financing and paying for the 3 year depreciation in order to have a new car. You are aware that the lease payments are basically equal to the lease tenor depreciation plus a financing premium, right? Your "savings" by purchasing are on a flatter part of the depreciation schedule, but make no mistake you pay depreciation as well, just not explicitly. So if in fact it's clear we all pay depreciation regardless of purchase/lease of something used/new, then it's just preference about what we want to drive and what we can afford.

Wow went to first place to test drive today.. I'm pretty tired but basically the Sonata is huge and the Elantra has all the options I want, so I am looking at those now. It's tough to deal with the scummyness of the sales people. I can only take so much of that. I wanna test drive a few different cars but man, being treated like a retard (or talking to a retard) and all the BS to go along with it is excruciating!

the best way to go about it imo, is to search online first. go to cars.com or autotrader.com and look for cars nearby. usually they offer the best rate, and not much haggling can be done. target the listings you like then go take a look at those. At least this way, youll be more efficient with your time.

Yeah, I have done that, thanks to some other advice from this thread actually! I thought (and still think) haggling can be done. They moved down to 18k from 19k while I was there, but I said I wasn't ready to buy. The car I was looking at I barely knew much about because I was looking at Sonatas. After taking a look their offer seemed reasonable (thought I was getting PURE hustled at the time so I guess I was kind of a dick, but that might have helped me out) but I wanna drive a few more cars and scope around for a better price. Also they were super douchy..

No problem chief. You seemed like you needed to be clued in.

I guess you don't consider a house an investment either. It's just a place that you live in, amirite?

Semantics aside, cars are major financial committments. Just because you don't purchase a car with the intention of making a profit doesn't mean that there's nothing wrong with hemorrhaging money. Which is exactly what will happen with the majority of leases.

Furthermore, cars are built to last and new / certified pre owneds have ridiculous warranty coverage. Getting something new / near new, driving it for 5-6 years, and selling it is miles better financially than leasing two cars with little difference in your driving experience. And really, what is the big deal about always having something brand new? New models on most cars undergo very few changes, sometimes none, from year to year.

If you know how to maintain a car, years 4-6 on a car will be nearly identical to the first three. All you're getting with a lease is something new that drives the same and has most of the same **** that you just had. Is the extra cost worth it just so you get to experience that new car feeling every few years? I don't know your financial situation, but it's not for the vast majority of consumers.

They are perfectly reasonable for people who don't care about money. Everybody else, no.

Yeah definitely need to know what you want before you go in to test drive. Otherwise they'll grab the top end of the model you ask about and once you drive that everything else will seem like a step back.

Anyway on to my situation, I'm looking to buy a car in the near future and I'm looking to spend 8-16k. I'd just like something reliable that looks ok and is reasonably comfortable. If I bought new it would be something like a base model Kia Forte/Rio, Mazda 3, Ford Fiesta, etc. The used market seems a little ridiculous. Civics with 80-120k miles on them going for 10-12k, Corollas are a little cheaper but not by much. Granted all these prices are from a dealer and can be haggled down and are high to begin with. What should I be looking at that I currently am not?

Is it reasonable to expect like a 2003 Accord/Civic etc to hold up with 120k miles on it?

For something that's reliable and looks ok I'd look into any used Honda or Toyota. It's hard to be specific given your guidelines though since your price range is wide and you don't seem to have much of a preference on the kind of car you like.

If you do go the Honda / Toyota route, you probably don't need to bother with the certified pre-owned selection because of their high reliability and low cost of maintenance / repair. Just make sure that you get any used car you're seriously considering inspected by a local mechanic. It'll run you 100 bucks or so but the cost is inconsequential if it saves you from buying a car that's going to cause you problems. Most dealerships offer a free carfax as well, usually listed online on their website.

Civics and Accords can easily run up to 200k miles relatively problem free, provided the car was well taken of. That isn't always the case, and any mechanic worth his weight will be able to tell right away if the car has been abused.

Any recommendations for a mechanic in the LA area or a good way of finding a reputable one?