Just came across this book and was looking to get some feedback on it

http://www.zerosumpoker.com/crushing...t-and-gos.html

to me it sounds to good to be true considering the price and what your getting so was wondering if anyone has it could give me some feedback on the book

I have seen the table of contents and it looks pretty solid but if there is a reg who has purchased it id def like to hear some feedback on it

I guess I'd be skeptical of anyone saying that they don't actually crush themselves but are a great coach.

It says there's a 14day money back guarantee though so why not knock yourself out if you're that interested.

the guy apparently played $10 games, and (on PS and FTP) not many of them, with less than 6k games total played, and no particularly amazing results.
he also says moshmans sng book was "one of my most important resources when learning SNG's" :\

I obviously can't really say much about the quality of the product but I would be shocked if there wasn't hefty list of better things a new player could do with the low-low 14day money back guarantee price of $99.99.

there is sometimes some merit to the whole "a good coach doesn't have to be a good player" sentiment, but I don't think it is so in the SnG world, especially the low-mid limit sng world.

the statement that you can turn "anyone" into a "SNG crusher" in 5 weeks is ridiculous.

iirc (and this is a big if, because I'm not that good at remembering stuff) he was one of Moshman's students and even one of his horses in something called "Team Moshman" (?). So, not sure how much weight I'd put into his statement about the book.

zerosum79 is a coach at Drag The Bar. You can get a week long trial and watch all his videos then decide if you want/need the book.

I'd recommend him, he's very thorough and gets his point across well.

im not sure if that would make me more comfortable or less comfortable.

i have just purchased the book il write a review on it once im through it once,

if my kid wanted to play tennis seriously, i would find him an ex top retired player that is coaching.
if you want to learn poker, i would suggest you to get your advice from someone with at least 6 digit profit (100k+)

imo the only poker-ish related coaching that doesnt require 'achievements' is mental coaching/sport psychologist/someone do make your diet/fitness coach
bit please please dont get 'how to play poker' knowledge from someone who by some weird coinsidence is qualified do teach you crushing, yet, he didnt do it himselft ?!?

/i dont know who this author is, maybe he crushed on other SNs somewhere, that was just generalization on my part

I've seen Greg's videos on Drag the Bar - and he *is* a very, very good teacher. Clear, systematic explanations etc.

I would be interested to see what people think of this book - I am considering buying it.

He is also a Team Moshman coach, FWIW.

do you have a ton of games played on a site other than FTP/Stars or something? I see you having just shy of 5,300 games played with $2,000 total in 6-9man sng profit.

I don't see how you can be considered qualified to teach someone how to beat SnGs if you don't have a history of beating them yourself. You even mention quizzes for mid-stakes games which, unless you played on another site, you never played yourself.

I mean it really seems like a joke if that is really the extent of your sng playing.

I am not going to lie to you and tell you that I have played a ton of games. I have never been a high-volume, high-stakes player, and have never represented myself as such. To attest that I have would be untrue, and I am not going to hide behind the idea of "phantom screen names" to try to sell books. I have presented my qualifications. You have also seen that several people (unsolicited) have posted positive comments on my coaching and teaching style.

However, if you want to accurately judge my playing results, please at least include 18-man SNG's in your filtering to achieve a more accurate accounting of my true ROI. Mostly I specialized in 18man SNGs and achieved a much better win-rate than you posted.

I don't find that there is necessarily a correlation between well written poker literature and players who played the highest volume or stakes. However, I do know that people who read poker literature will ultimately decide whether this work is up to the standard necessary to be considered good.

I geared this information and scope to games I a have played. I have also verified that it is a winning strategy with higher limit players who have had access to the material. I believe that it as well as the other literature and training videos that I have produced speak for themselves. I have never been openly criticized for the strategy articles or videos I have produced.

The price tag may seem steep, but I have geared it toward what I believe the quality of material is, vs what current SNG hourly coaching rates. I consider it to be a value especially at the introductory price. I would be happy to send you a free copy to review if you would like to see it before passing judgement. (this is not a invitation to the forum to criticize it in hopes of a free copy)

Regards,
zerosum79

I think those who dissent really need to review Greg's ABC series on Drag the Bar - you can sign up for a free membership. his quality of teaching is excellent.

Greg presents his work in a very clear and concise method - I myself have gone from a break even player to a winning player just by watching his ABC series. His concepts are easily digested, and his approach to "pivot points" is a new - but excellent - concept.

To be clear - I have no affiliation with Greg - I am just a DTB member - but his videos have improved my games so much - far more than any other coaching series!

My advice - if you are a break even or losing low/mid stakes player, Greg's work *will* improve your game.

This is true, and I can respect that

I have seen a total of 2 people say something positive. 2. I haven't seen anyone respected say anything and I haven't seen any results from any of your students.

This post should be a big red-flag to everyone.
First of all, your entire, unfiltered (HU - MTT) results are a total of about 6k games and 3.5k profit. And you only have ~400 games played of the 18man games you "specialize" in.
Secondly, and maybe even more importantly, your statement shows if anything a lack of knowledge about SnGs.
6,000 games in any format is an almost nothing sample-size in 6-18man games. You're ROI is going to stray full multiple points plus or minus. As somebody who is going to charge people to teach them you should know this.


this has nothing to do with playing the highest volume or the highest stakes. you literally have next to no experience playing sngs, low-stakes sngs, you have played 6k games since 2008. You're as qualified to coach this as you are to coach tennis after getting some lessons (from an arguably somewhat decent coach) and playing a handful of games.

you obviously market yourself well (another thing you share in common with your coach) and are very articulate. i would not be surprised to find out you have packaged something that is very well put together and received well by completely novice players - of course it's going to sound good if they don't know right from wrong and it's presented in such a professional manner. but that doesn't automatically mean it's actually a good product.


I wasn't passing judgement on your book so much as stating my problem with you having a complete lack of qualifications to charge money for your knowledge on SnGs.
You can send me a copy and I'll gladly critique it when I have a chance but unless it is a lot more than a basic beginners guide to SnGs I'm probably not very likely to change my stance on you being qualified to coach. However if it is more than that and I agree with it I will gladly eat my words.

I think every poker book/ebook released these days or video package has to include the word "crushing" in it. It must be law.

SiQ - I am not going to argue you point by point. I just don't think it will be productive. If you are only seeing 400 18 man SNG's then your numbers are simply way off. I played 18mans for Team Moshman and was playing 800-1000 a month. And yes I am well aware that your ROI is higher in these games typically. I was posting win rates in the low 20'%s.

Other than that, I appreciate your feedback and opinion. Although my original post was deleted by mods, I feel that my resume is what it is. There is plenty of information that I have put out for free over the years, or that can be accessed to verify whether or not my SNG Analysis skills are good or not.

I would like to send you a copy of the book and videos. I would hope that you judge whether I am a qualified coach based on the material. Any criticism you have you are welcome to post publicly. It may not change your mind, but I certainly hope it does. If you PM me your email, I will ship you a download link and maybe we can chat outside of this thread a bit.

Respectfully,
zero

I know. I kind of cringed when the other one beat me to the punch. I have actually been working on this (slowly) for a very long time and this has been the working title for at least a year. I almost changed it at the last minute, but couldn't come up with something I thought was better.

zero

Destroying.

Pwned twice in one day by PP! I actually might consider changing it. I do have that power.

zero

No offense to zero since he posts here, but I found his video (along with most on DTB) to be very lacking.

I think the time, work and general personality type it takes to make videos or be a coach makes it so the best players, who are actually crushing, arent the ones that make videos and coach.

Tell that to sippin_criss then! The guy crushes sngs, but still has time to make vids for cardrunners. I'm afraid I disagree with you, if I may.

Its cool man, no offense taken. I am particularly open to feedback so if you have any please pm me.

One thing about DTB is that I have been encouraged to make a lot of classroom videos. At the time I came on they thought it complemented the other coach who was with the site since he was doing mostly HH commentary. This format may not resonate with some people as much as it does with others but I am also getting a lot of positive feedback on them. I have stuck with this format because I feel that it gives my videos a different twist that you might not see at many other training sites.

Regards,
zero

Youre honestly gonna list one example to the contrary to disprove my point? Theres a guy in this thread who absolutely crushes and is(was?) a training site pro. Theres tons of people who crush and make great videos. But i know a lot of pro sngers and from my experience the top guys are generally more concerned about getting better and making money playing than they are marketing themselves. A lot of the coaching/training site world is filled with guys like zero who havent played enough games to prove themselves and focus most of their energy trying to make money and get notoriety from things other winning money from the tables. Guys dont become site pros and training site pros and coaches because they are they best; they become those because they put the effort into marketing themselves.

You also have to account for the fact that someone who was crushing even a year ago might not be that good anymore. There were guys that crushed high stakes hypers on FT that cant beat lowstakes hypers on Merge.

From my own experience ive backed away from coaching even though i was able to charge a large rate and had a ton of interest, because my time was better spent improving my own game and grinding.

btw, Sippin is an absolute stud at both making videos and playing; and being funny.