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AT vs. JJ AT vs. JJ

08-02-2015 , 07:30 PM
The title asks it all:

SB: Ac 10h ($.05) Your stack: $2.00.

BB: Jd Js ($.10) His stack: $3.00

I get this question on Zynga Poker all the time.

If you don't know the opponents' hand, how would you play this, in both the SB and the BB position, pre-flop?
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 07:33 PM
1st off, aww... Zynga poker... how cute! (sorry I had to get that off my chest).

2nd, with stack sizes as low as that... Raise-call pre, shove any flop!
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 08:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanJWarburton
1st off, aww... Zynga poker... how cute! (sorry I had to get that off my chest).
They keep wanting me to play and I hate Zynga. For my fake money, I do Pokerstars or the WSoP app. I get ads asking about this all the time so I figured I'd ask.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 08:51 PM
OP, are you asking how to play when you don't know your opponent's hand but he has JJ? This question is very oddly worded.

If I had ATo in SB, it folds round to me and I have 20bb effective, I'm raising and stacking off on any top pair flop. Not stacking off pre without reads.

If I had JJ in BB, it's presumably limped to me, I have 30bb, I'm raising and prepared to stack off pre without reads.

Not sure if that helps but as I said, you have not explained your question clearly.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 09:00 PM
Raise, raise, arrrr in

Played correctly by both players this is all in preflop .

If opponent doesnt oblige ill have put in last raise pre and see what happens.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 10:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
OP, are you asking how to play when you don't know your opponent's hand but he has JJ? This question is very oddly worded.
Essentially, I want advice in both situations (I have AT and he has JJ or I have JJ and he has AT, but in neither case do I know the opponent's hand).

Well, like you explained.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 10:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
Essentially, I want advice in both situations (I have AT and he has JJ or I have JJ and he has AT, but in neither case do I know the opponent's hand).
If you don't know his hand, you're playing against a whole range. If you have AT, villain has JJ less than 1% of the time. Why do you want to know how to play against JJ when he's just as likely to have KK or 33, but even more likely to have 72?

I'd have to check my push-fold charts, but I'm pretty sure you can open jam AT for 20bb or even 30bb and it's unexploitable. JJ is definitely going in, but I'd probably start with a standard raise.

Last edited by ArtyMcFly; 08-02-2015 at 10:33 PM.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 11:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
I have AT and he has JJ or I have JJ and he has AT, but in neither case do I know the opponent's hand
this. Does. Not. Make. Sense.

Please think about it
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-02-2015 , 11:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly
If you don't know his hand, you're playing against a whole range. If you have AT, villain has JJ less than 1% of the time. Why do you want to know how to play against JJ when he's just as likely to have KK or 33, but even more likely to have 72?
My guess is that Zynga didn't want to show a 72o because most people would fold it, unless they were donks. (or going for the hammer bonus).

I just saw an ad on Facebook showing two players, one with ATo and the other with JJ and the only thing I knew for sure was that I would rather have had JJ because I believe one overcard only hits about 32% of the time.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 12:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
Essentially, I want advice in both situations (I have AT and he has JJ or I have JJ and he has AT, but in neither case do I know the opponent's hand).

Well, like you explained.
You can't know what he has and also not know, this is not quantum poker.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 01:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
You can't know what he has and also not know, this is not quantum poker.
Well, I don't think the opposing player is going to show you his cards. This is why I asked in both cases. If you did know, then the ATo is a 7-3 dog, roughly.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 01:16 AM
ATo in small blind: Raise pre. Call jam.

JJ in big blind: 3b pre (non allin if he minraises, jam if 3x+). Raise if limped.

Why is this a thread?
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 01:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncelanas
ATo in small blind: Raise pre. Call jam.

JJ in big blind: 3b pre (non allin if he minraises, jam if 3x+). Raise if limped.

Why is this a thread?
Honestly? Because I've gotten back into the game after 9 years and I feel like I know practically nothing. That's why I came here.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
Honestly? Because I've gotten back into the game after 9 years and I feel like I know practically nothing. That's why I came here.
don't think you can raise fold JJ or AT with 20BB
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
Honestly? Because I've gotten back into the game after 9 years and I feel like I know practically nothing. That's why I came here.
It's great to come here and ask questions, but you'll get a lot more out of asking some questions than others.

AT and JJ are both the nuts HU and it's a super trivial spot both ways unless you want to start getting into theory that's way too advanced for Zynga poker.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHNo96
I just saw an ad on Facebook showing two players, one with ATo and the other with JJ and the only thing I knew for sure was that I would rather have had JJ because I believe one overcard only hits about 32% of the time.
Oh, it sounds like one of those facebook ads that other sites also run, where they put up a screenshot and ask "How many outs do you have?"
Such questions have almost no strategic value, since your opponents' hands aren't face up in real life. If the Zynga ad just said "Which would you rather have - JJ or AT?" then it's obviously JJ. It's about a 70/30 favourite. Get Equilab if you haven't already.

In the real world I'm very happy to see JJ or AT heads up, and I'm pretty much always stacking off pre for 20bb if possible.

FWIW, there are some old Zynga strategy videos on YouTube and the commentators say such ridiculous things (e.g. "K5 is a good hand to see a flop with") that it's almost as if they are levelling. I would not trust anything their facebook posts say.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 12:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtyMcFly
FWIW, there are some old Zynga strategy videos on YouTube and the commentators say such ridiculous things (e.g. "K5 is a good hand to see a flop with") that it's almost as if they are levelling. I would not trust anything their facebook posts say.
That's what I have when I see Phil Hellmuth play. "He can't seriously be this bad can he?"

Phil Hellmuth could actually find a fold with either of those hands preflop. Don't do that, just get it in.
AT vs. JJ Quote
08-03-2015 , 05:32 PM
^^ Yeah you're concerning yourself with the wrong things op if you are looking to improve your game that is.
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08-04-2015 , 12:42 AM
Quote:
Well, I don't think the opposing player is going to show you his cards. This is why I asked in both cases. If you did know, then the ATo is a 7-3 dog, roughly.
Looks like OP want to know this - the allin preflop equity ATo vs JJ

Spoiler:


So to answer your Title, yes, JJ wins roughly 7 out of 10 times and ATo, 3.

But I have no Idea how to play this.
AT vs. JJ Quote

      
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