I was thinking lately how to improve my game at cash , i think those two things are probably the hardest to fix and as long as you play them out perfectly your winrate will skyrocket.

This thread assumes that we are playing against unknown villains.

Some examples of tough spots:


Facing reraises on the flop

Facing pot sized bets postflop

Facing three bets from late position


Some examples of tough spots who are cooler material:


Getting three barreled when you hold a very strong overpair

Getting 4-bet from EP Raiser when you hold KK

Getting 4-bet from LP raiser when you hold AK or QQ

3-bet with AK and get called by villain and the board comes KJ8 and then
he calls your cbet.

Getting reraised postflop when you hold a bottom set

Getting 3-bet from random villain when you are at EP and hold QQ


Avoid coolers and playing tough spots correctly should make your game really easier , from what i can think is that all those spots are supposed to be *thin spots* i mean if you end up winning the hand then this win was a thin win because you are supposed to be against a very strong range and a very small number of bluffs.

I can also think that losing would be thin too which you may overcome through fat value depending on the limit you play ofc.

How much of a mistake is to simply give up on all tough spots without reads and when you are against a *cooler* situation choose the more passive way to reduce damage? How do you deal with all these things?

Way too much stuff in here to write out a very good response. However, your last paragraph brings up a vey interesting point, one that I've grappled with in the past while uNL grinding.

A lot of people insist that a TAG style is the optimal style for grinding uNL. Personally, after my hundreds of thousands of hands there, I think weaktight is actually the way to go up until at least 50nl. It won't work against solid regs but it'll destroy the fish which is the main goal at these limits.

The idea of weaktight being optimal might give a lot of these ABC regs an ulcer, but nonetheless it's my conclusion based on all my experience. I would argue that yes, you should just shut down in those spots where you're facing aggression. I fold to like one large bet from a fish if I'm holding less than TPTK, and often fold even that to a big 2 barrel. That's extremely weaktight, and yet I've crushed these limits for ~20bb/100 for craptons of hands. Sure, you'll see people getting out of line with weak holdings fairly often. So you note that, and next time they do it to you you'll be able to make a more informed decision. But for the vast majority of fish, the vast majority of the time, they don't go shoveling money into the pot without at least a very strong top pair, and generally 2 pair or better. And never with draws. For a beginner, it's very important not to confuse the super wide, loose calling range of fish with their much tighter and stronger betting ranges.

Your on the way to improving OP, you need to start thinking about different scenarios, and how you will re act to them so in essence thinking in a multi facet manner, especially during post flop play, so for example all things such as this should be running through your head when you make a play:

( Bare in mind that our ability to optimally think about these factors when making decisions and how to do so properly is where theory knowledge will become applicable )

Start putting people on ranges

Start thinking about your stack size relative to pot size

Start making plays with an end goal in mind.

In order to determine the optimal play one has to consider every play the outcome of each play

How your hand performs against villains ranges,

How villain perceives your hand ranges,

What better hands call?

What worse hands fold?

Think in a multi facet manner

Become creative and improve our game ten fold

Which action is going to be most profitable?

How will an action on the flop affect an action on the turn and river?

What may our action influence the villain to do?

Are we getting him to call with worse by betting here?

Or are we getting him to shove/raise/call with better

QQ is often an easy fold when facing a 4bet live.

good post i agree. its only a problem when you start being exploited too often.

Lot of good points to improve on but for the love of don't put too much effort in trying to get away from KK or bottom set, it's too infrequent and just no.

You could play weak tight, tag, lag... But each of these restricts you. I play fluid poker. What was it Bruce lee said..

'You must be shapeless, formless, like water. When you pour water in a cup, it becomes the cup. When you pour water in a bottle, it becomes the bottle. When you pour water in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Water can drip and it can crash. Become like water my friend.'

To do this, you need to understand poker in it's pure form. I have written a thread which explains the traditional game poker, 'Yadis perfect thought process', but there is also the GTO style to consider too... Learn both of those, and you will realise that your op makes little sense.

You probably missed the part where i said *against unknown villains* playing lag , tag , nit still stand for something in an unknown enviroment if you think * you can beat most of the population with these approaches* , this thread is mostly about zoom , in reg cash i dont need a style indeed , because villain's hands are usually face up with the cheat huds.

And yes what bruce lee said is correct , strategy is all about adjusting perfectly to the situation but sometimes the situation is not crystal clear or you know nothing at all , so this doesnt apply well at poker.

Of course you will tell me *but im never readless with my hud* , try to play with your approach at zoom and see it wont work the same.

Huds are basically the equivalent of maphack in a rts game , they are simply cheats and should be nerfed because they take the magic out of poker.

Play weak-tight against unknowns, but try to avoid playing against unknowns.

I didn't say it wouldn't be profitable to play tight etc. I just said it would be better if we played more fluidly.

Against unknowns it's important to balance, not play tight.

I wouldn't play zoom because I'm a exploitative master, I'm not so good playing balanced.

You are thinking about *tight* as something which is meant to be spammed , *tight* describes a lot of things thats why in my post i didnt say tight but talked about specific spots. When someone answer me that i must be tight in that spot , it doesnt neccesarily means that i should i follow all the rules about other spots aswell.

We may not be able to adjust perfectly against a single opponent or put him on a level accurately but we may have a *general* idea of what most players do in a certain limit and use these as our reads and adjust to them and this might be better than balancing. This is called population tendecies.

I think there are different levels of adjustment , your theory basically describes the perfect one when all information is availiable but sometimes only small pieces are availiable to us and might not be for a speficic person. If someone says play like a nit it could be due to the fact that he thinks that the population are *mostly* calling stations without any level , his advice of course is valid , with this small of piece of information he had then concluded the best strategy , so as i said having a *system* can sometimes stand for something.

Playing tight is simply a *tool* , its not something that it meant to be spammed but instead is a counterstrategy when limited information is availiable and it makes it the optimal choice.

Fair enough ^ ... Though you should add, level 2 etc to your understanding of the population tendencies

In a cash game our stats are availiable so we can use those to see how others view us but in game where those stats arent availiable and they simply dont see how you play , how will you consider what they think about you?

This is interesting , if you played a game with unknowns but you are also unknown to them and you have assumptions that all of them are level 2 , how would you develop your level 3? would you say for example *they all think im a random tag*? would you use generic solid ranges for yourself?

On micro limits , i think its better to assign most at level 1 but im not sure about that.

You really do like to troll don't you?

I like the Bruce Lee reference. I actually read your thread yadis perfect thought process. Good stuff. Can anyone explain to me what exactly GTO is?

GTO is what chuck norris used when he fought bruce lee but bruce lee managed to outlevel him. well JK

Gto means game theoretic optimum and its a style where you take predetermined lines which cannot be exploited by the villain , its a defensive mixed strategy which opts to remain unpredictable and not be exploited , its basically a strategy of perfect frequencies in anything you do.

No matter how good you are , you cant exploit a gto player but the gto player cant exploit anyone either , he will only make money when his opponents make major mistakes but he wont be capable to take advantage fully of his opponent's leaks.

In order to take advantage of others leaks we need to become exploitable ourselves and that leave us vulnerable to further exploitation.

Its a good approach in an unknown and solid enviroment but its much worse than using read and tendecy based strategies if we have the information to do so.

Thanks man I definitely understand more now. So basically cards dont matter when playing a GTO strategy?

If you mean to read your opponent cards then no they dont matter but your own cards matter , you have to break down your hand range and assign an action to each part of it to match the perfect gto action. Usually you tend to assign tasks which seems more logical , for example you will mostly bet with the semibluff part of your range or you will tend to check/call with the middling part and of course value bet with the strong part.

No matter what you do though you have follow correct frequencies and continue in the hand with the correct frequency aswell , for example bet with x part of my range x% of the time then continue with a smaller part of it x% of the time and so on.... Gto players use certain frequencies with their hands to create unexploitability.

Regarding the OP, just about all the "tough spots" that were described can be dealt with by having a plan for the hand.
I used to find poker really stressful (and still do sometimes, especially when playing more tables than my tiny brain can cope with), but it became a lot easier when I started considering the likely reactions to my actions before I even took them. e.g. Before I open in MP, I've already decided how I'll react to a 3-bet by the button or the blinds. Similarly, post-flop, I'll look at the board and say to myself something like "Oh, this looks like a two-streets of value spot. Unless the board turns super-ugly, I'll go bet-bet-check. And I'm snap-folding to a raise at any point". That is to say, before I make my c-bet, I've already decided that I'll fold to a raise, and I've already decided that I'll be barreling most turn cards. Planning for these possibilities means it's actually quite easy to deal with them when they occur. Another one to learn is to plan your river play on the turn. If you're about to call a turn bet, say to yourself something like "I'll only call up to half pot on blank rivers. If villain bets more than half pot, it's because he has me beat, so I'll fold my TPGK". The difficult part is keeping your discipline and sticking with the plan once you've made it. (I've lost count of the number of times I've said to myself "Fold if he bombs the river" and then when villain bombed the river, I sigh-called and lost).

As for coolers, just accept them. They are part of poker, and you shouldn't be looking for reasons to get away from the inevitable.