I'm micro stake player. Been playing $0.5 to $2 mtt, played 10 per day, only cashed 3 the most by not going into FT.
9 handed cash game 2NL, seems like by playing 100bb for every player, even against a fish long run its unbeatable. My thinking is 'unless 2 players are sitting with big stack' then it can show who's gonna have an edge against each other.

Online poker seems so dead, I can play for weeks mtt, more than 10 hours per day and still not profit much!

Live poker? I don't have much bankroll to sustain.

Seems like someone needs a lot of luck to do it full time (oh btw, poker boom has gone since long time ago after Chris moneymaker...)

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Because you can't beat it, nobody can? Look, if you're asking questions like, "How do I beat Baccarat," chances are you're a fish yourself. Good players don't go around asking how to make a profit from -EV bets (do you think you can profit by making dumb -EV poker plays too, or just -EV Baccarat bets?). They understand that -EV means it's a losing proposition, not a profitable one.

Luck doesn't last that long in cash games, just like it doesn't in Roulette. Just as there are no professional Roulette players, there are no professionally lucky poker players except those who binked a big tournament.

COOL!

Sent from my laptop using a keyboard!

Maybe not dead, but answers in this linked thread may help more than here in the Beginners Questions area of 2+2

I don't think online poker is dead completely, but it definitely isn't in its glory days pre BF. The game is no doubt more difficult to beat than years ago, but still possible. I used to play a lot of online and live poker, and walked away for a few years. I have just recently started playing regularly again, and it definitely is more difficult but I am still playing profitably. In the past few months, I've turned a $25 deposit into $1100. My short term goal is to grow that into 10k, but it will be difficult.

If you are having trouble beating the game and being profitable, maybe its time to take a look at your game and the mistakes you are making. There are definitely not as many fish playing these days, but I wouldn't say it is dead. I'm hoping that it makes a comeback of some kind though, and another "Boom" happens but who knows when/if that happens.

I'd just recommend to keep studying and playing as much as your bankroll permits. You should improve, and be able to make some profit. I do think that it is much harder to play professionally right now, but I just play for enjoyment and some extra money to supplement my primary income. I'd love to play professionally, but I have a lot more improving to do, and need to build my roll before I can even consider playing for a living. It takes a special kind of person to play professionally, and most people don't have the traits needed to be successful.

Answer me why many online cash game tables only offers 100bb only at once buy in, why not 300, 500? Because the house wants to have an edge? In the long run all in vs all in situation. It's gonna be even nobody makes enough money

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$25 to $1100 only in FEW MONTHS?!
I've to earn at least $3k (1.5k for br, 1.5k for living expenses after currency xchange), for current situation even if I face laptop for 12hrs/day x 6 days playing mtts I don't think I can achieve regular score like this.

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Yeah, I play mainly SnG's and MTT's, but do play micro/low stakes in cash.
I think I was just running good, but taking 2nd in that MTT helped quite a bit. Aside from that I typically play Double up SnG's. I would only call my self a decent player. I'm no expert, but I think my style of play is a bit different and I try to make all the right decisions when possible.

Are you trying to say if they offered 300 to 500bb cash games you would be a winner in them?

Its dead for you because your just clicking buttons without much thought.

Set vs fd
set over set
100bb all in
long run the house is making money

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In the long run winning players are winning money

Wait, poker sites don't just provide games as some kind of charity?!!?

I sure hope B&M rooms never hear about this "making money" thing or surely live games will become unbeatable.

Not dead yet, but no longer viable for a regular income. Unless we talk about peanuts.

Leads to the joke....

How do you make a million dollars playing online poker in 2017?

Start with two million.

OP, play for fun and the possibility of small reward. If you are looking to score "real money" through poker....most will tell you that live casino play is the only way to accomplish that goal. But online micro stakes can still be a fun and cheap form of entertainment.

You make it sound bad that the house is making money. It is not.

Some of us played poker before the poker boom. Before 2003, NLHE was almost never spread. The game had been around since the 1950s, but it was never very popular. A reason was no limit wasn't sustainable. Somebody would buy in for 400 BB and get wiped out in one hand. Because of the amounts involved, these players had to leave and the games broke up quickly. Poker rooms didn't want to spread games where people only played a few hands and left. They couldn't collect enough rake. Limit games work better for the house because people played longer.

About the same time as the Moneymaker boom started, the Stratosphere poker room started limited buy ins to 100 BB. This slowed the exit of players and allowed games to be sustainable in the medium term. Cash games started to be spread beyond the occasional nosebleed game.

So in a sense you are right. The rooms don't want the games to break up quickly. However, neither do the players.

lol I find this funny. I use to play No limit at a Korean casino last year and you could buy in for 1000 BBs if you wanted to. Not joking, there were whales that were buying in for over 500 BBs at 1/2. Calling 50 BB 3Bs with JJ and spazzing out on the flop.

Amazingly enough the games were constantly running and they even had 2/5. The rake was horrendous though. 10% up to $15 I think and people still regularly tipped. I know I did even though they shared tips *sigh*.

Not dead, but the happy times when you could find 3+ loose fishes per table are definitely behind us.

But there are still bad players out there. But while in the past they were calling too much, now they are more on the passive scale and fold too much. This decreases possible payouts - but second nuts will always stack.

As long as there are exploitable players and manageable rake, poker will be profitable - on the long run.

That depends

Play Zoom 25nl and below at peak fish hours (evenings and weekends GMT) and 50% of the playing pool are loose fish. You be seeing a ton of tables with 2-3 fish on them.

Outside of those hours, yeah it's a nitregfest.

Higher up idk, but most who have gone down the road say there is not much difference 25nlz >> 50nlz.

Also scheduled weekend MTTs (like the Sunday Storm) are total whalefests in the early stages.

There are still plenty of fish playing online, you just gotta work a whole lot harder at finding them.

Regs on the other hand are waaayyy better than they used to be and most of them are tooled up with every legit (and probably some non-legit) software tool available.

So yeah, it is way tougher, but that is at least as much because of the development of regs, as it is the (over-hyped) reduction in fish.

I haven't made a significant amount of the top positions, and I am ahead in money playing the micro MTTs (and such S&Gs). I have learned to trust in time with a good enough technique and increasing experience, as I keep getting in money often enough and I have no reason to suspect that it would end; just expecting to have better and worse runs in the future.

There is enough fish and it is not about luck if you will stay in the game or not; you will need the card and stack size technique and some experience and you will score often enough.

On average, you will drop out some after 50% (I have verified this number), as you can beat the fish, that also means you will score money if you play as well on average as the (remaining) field generally. One can also get the statistics of how often one scores money or whatever, to see if the leak is there, higher, because of technique or lack of experience.

Just because you win against the player pool doesn't mean you beat the rake. Poker sites are now upping the rake.

Edges are getting smaller for sure, but microstakes cashgames are still beatable.

MTTs are just a variance fest. Tourney players generally have a poker IQ equivalent to that of pond-life, but you still need luck to beat them. One big score will cancel out all the near-misses and mincashes. It's just that it might take you 5000 tourneys before you hit that big score.

It's dead in the sense that it's not a realistic professional choice for westerners with any transferable skills any more. However, if you can't beat 2NL you're just extremely stupid.

the ceiling is definitely lower for potential earnings but it seems threads like these always focus on the highest earners and how no one is making more than 5m a year (and they're the best of the best blah blah). Fact is with a proper approach its still not all that difficult to earn an above average western salary playing just low stakes online, that said most people fail to approach it properly. When I say approach I'm talking about almost only off-table stuff, all that strategy we bust our heads over is just a pawn piece in this game. Find out all the +ev off table stuff and you'll crush the game

Could you elaborate on this please?

rb deals, mental game stuff, finding the right amt of tables not just staying within your comfort zone all the time, making yourself a schedule theres a ton of stuff to increase your ev thats not relative to in-game strategy