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Old 06-11-2008, 11:48 AM   #101
High Time John
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

What are a few software programs for tracking online statistics? What are the pros and cons of each?
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Old 06-11-2008, 03:15 PM   #102
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

So why do folks consider 72o as the worst hand?
The question of course begs "worst hand where? how?" but poor 72 goes down the tubes. Preflop against most ranges 32o is still going to be a lot worse.
Poor 72 gets a bad rap....
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Old 06-11-2008, 03:25 PM   #103
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

BR question, with $1000 am I being a nit sticking to the 10NL deep tables ($20 buyin, 50x in BR)? I am just scared of having a downswing and feeling under pressure to win it back without having to redeposit ;P
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Old 06-11-2008, 04:05 PM   #104
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by StregaChess View Post
So why do folks consider 72o as the worst hand?
The question of course begs "worst hand where? how?" but poor 72 goes down the tubes. Preflop against most ranges 32o is still going to be a lot worse.
Poor 72 gets a bad rap....
It's because 72o contains a 2 and has poor straight and flush possibilities. I'm not saying that 72o *is* the worst hand, but I believe these are the traditional reasons given.
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Old 06-11-2008, 04:55 PM   #105
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

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Originally Posted by MoonOrb View Post
It's because 72o contains a 2 and has poor straight and flush possibilities. I'm not saying that 72o *is* the worst hand, but I believe these are the traditional reasons given.
Yea but the last time I checked 32 also has a 2, and it's traditionally stated as "worst starting hand" which again, pre-flop straight or not, 32o under preforms 72o.

I know the traditional reasons, but they don't really hold much water.
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Old 06-11-2008, 04:59 PM   #106
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

I'd be curious to run that through poker stove. against what range preflop are you suggesting 72o will win more often than 32o?
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Old 06-11-2008, 05:05 PM   #107
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by StregaChess View Post
So why do folks consider 72o as the worst hand?
The question of course begs "worst hand where? how?" but poor 72 goes down the tubes. Preflop against most ranges 32o is still going to be a lot worse.
Poor 72 gets a bad rap....
32o is the worst hand against one other player. In a full ring game, against 9 others, 72o has a lower equity (than 32o) because of the lack of ability to make straights:


---
4,101,496 games 14.188 secs 289,082 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 05.109% 04.50% 00.61% 184512 25047.35 { 32o }
Hand 1: 10.555% 09.40% 01.15% 385554 47363.10 { random }
Hand 2: 10.531% 09.39% 01.14% 385037 46910.18 { random }
Hand 3: 10.529% 09.38% 01.15% 384801 47064.77 { random }
Hand 4: 10.547% 09.40% 01.15% 385449 47152.10 { random }
Hand 5: 10.541% 09.39% 01.15% 384991 47338.85 { random }
Hand 6: 10.556% 09.40% 01.15% 385601 47364.43 { random }
Hand 7: 10.543% 09.39% 01.15% 385287 47146.18 { random }
Hand 8: 10.559% 09.41% 01.15% 385840 47256.77 { random }
Hand 9: 10.527% 09.38% 01.15% 384676 47104.27 { random }


-----
4,504,654 games 15.375 secs 292,985 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 04.245% 03.40% 00.84% 153276 37950.13 { 72o }
Hand 1: 10.610% 09.49% 01.12% 427552 50407.30 { random }
Hand 2: 10.631% 09.51% 01.12% 428581 50300.30 { random }
Hand 3: 10.655% 09.54% 01.11% 429821 50149.38 { random }
Hand 4: 10.653% 09.54% 01.11% 429655 50209.55 { random }
Hand 5: 10.644% 09.53% 01.11% 429331 50134.63 { random }
Hand 6: 10.633% 09.52% 01.11% 428742 50224.30 { random }
Hand 7: 10.640% 09.53% 01.11% 429242 50073.13 { random }
Hand 8: 10.659% 09.54% 01.12% 429710 50438.55 { random }
Hand 9: 10.630% 09.52% 01.11% 428681 50175.72 { random }

---
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Old 06-11-2008, 05:08 PM   #108
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

After further investigation, the cutoff seems to be a 5 handed game. In a 4 handed game (against 3 opponents) 32o is slightly worse. Add one more player and it becomes slightly better than 72o.

Last edited by frumpus; 06-11-2008 at 05:17 PM.
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:17 AM   #109
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

That's sort of my point is that they are almost identical in worthlessness.
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:29 AM   #110
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Time John View Post
What are a few software programs for tracking online statistics? What are the pros and cons of each?
Software forum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony Montana View Post
BR question, with $1000 am I being a nit sticking to the 10NL deep tables ($20 buyin, 50x in BR)? I am just scared of having a downswing and feeling under pressure to win it back without having to redeposit ;P
50 buy-ins is pretty nitty... Why wouldn't you just switch to 25NL? The buy-in is only 25% more and the quality of players is not going to be much different. But do whatever you feel comfortable with, you're not on a schedule or anything.
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:13 AM   #111
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Who should show his cards first?

Situation is that lets say one guy is on BB and another on the button and both those players have seen the river card. Now on the river BB checks, button bets and BB calls. Question is: who should show his cards first?

Im interested in response only from player who plays in casino - preferably not in one

A friend of mine was dealing in one casino and he said that the player on the button in this particular situation should show his cards first but im donkey and imo BB should show them first as he had worse position. ... or it depends on the casino?
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:21 AM   #112
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Time John View Post
What are a few software programs for tracking online statistics? What are the pros and cons of each?
Your best bet is to check out the Software forum. There are threads about Holdem Manager and PokerTracker 3 and comparing the two. They are the two leading applications.

There are others available but they would be of appeal mostly to people with quite specific requirements.
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:07 AM   #113
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

what are the gold stars above some peoples circles on poker stars
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:31 AM   #114
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

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what are the gold stars above some peoples circles on poker stars
I believe they are playing through pokerstars.net not .com although I have been known to be wrong in the past lol
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:56 AM   #115
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Re: Who should show his cards first?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cold.FuzZion View Post
Situation is that lets say one guy is on BB and another on the button and both those players have seen the river card. Now on the river BB checks, button bets and BB calls. Question is: who should show his cards first?

Im interested in response only from player who plays in casino - preferably not in one

A friend of mine was dealing in one casino and he said that the player on the button in this particular situation should show his cards first but im donkey and imo BB should show them first as he had worse position. ... or it depends on the casino?
Position has nothing to do with it. The player who bet, shows first, and the player who called, then has the option to muck if he doesn't beat the hand shown.
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:58 AM   #116
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

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Originally Posted by StregaChess View Post
That's sort of my point is that they are almost identical in worthlessness.
Yeah, but one is less worthless than the other, depending on the situation.
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:40 PM   #117
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

You could also argue that even heads up, with 32o, you can at least win the additional occasional nice pot when you hit a straight against TPNK or two pair or something, whereas the situations where you are winning a nice pot with 72o's pair value (pretty much the only thing that is better in 72o than 32o) are yet even rarer.
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:42 PM   #118
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

RAKE! What the hell? Over 30 days I made 70 bucks grinding 2NL, and 23 was taken in rake? Is this normal? I WANT MY GOD DAMN MONEY BACK PS!!!
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:43 PM   #119
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

RAKE! What the hell? Over 30 days I made 70 bucks grinding 2NL, and according to PT3, I lost $23 in rake? Is this normal? I WANT MY GOD DAMN MONEY BACK PS!!!
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Old 06-13-2008, 12:08 AM   #120
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

you can say that again !
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Old 06-13-2008, 03:01 AM   #121
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Yes, this is normal. Always amusing to see people surprised about it because it looks really small doesn't it? People will think "Oh, I will lose only 5% of my winnings, I can take that." While in reality, it's more like, without rake the actual amount of pots you take down is like 460, but you also lose 370 in the process, so rakes takes away ~20 of your ~90 net sum which is more like a quarter. Now imagine, if, say, at 25NL, you win 11K and lose 10K for a nice little "profit" of 1K... you lose half of it to rake.
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Old 06-13-2008, 10:37 AM   #122
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vantek View Post
Yes, this is normal. Always amusing to see people surprised about it because it looks really small doesn't it? People will think "Oh, I will lose only 5% of my winnings, I can take that." While in reality, it's more like, without rake the actual amount of pots you take down is like 460, but you also lose 370 in the process, so rakes takes away ~20 of your ~90 net sum which is more like a quarter. Now imagine, if, say, at 25NL, you win 11K and lose 10K for a nice little "profit" of 1K... you lose half of it to rake.
Thats absolutely ridiculous, I had no idea it was that much! And thats at 2NL, where the pot reaches $1 only like 10% of the time!!!!
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Old 06-13-2008, 11:41 AM   #123
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

At 2NL, people don't fold. The majority of your winnings comes from huge pots where you have a monster and your opponent has a little something and calls down three streets with it, resulting in a pot over $1.
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Old 06-13-2008, 01:17 PM   #124
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird24 View Post
Thats absolutely ridiculous, I had no idea it was that much! And thats at 2NL, where the pot reaches $1 only like 10% of the time!!!!
It's pretty easy to make money in the micros even with the higher rake. As you move up in levels the rake gets less because it is usually capped.
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Old 06-13-2008, 03:25 PM   #125
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Re: ***** Official Dumb Questions Thread ****

How about this:

6 max vs. fullring games.....NL Micros

1) What is the difference other then the obvious?

2) Why do players chose one over the other as a preference?

3) Which is more popular and why?

4) What types of skills is necessary to play both well?

5) Which is more suited to beginners?
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