** Official Beginners NL Holdem Stats Thread **

[grindtofreedom]

doesnt seem very laggish to me. even if its FR his VPIP is not even 18, but this is 6M right?

[irungood]

yeh its 6max, too me it seems like im showing down too many times with the worst hand =/ its just hard to consider me a solid player cuz im on a 17 buyin downswing live and im trying to figure out what im doing wrong =/

[RoSeeker]

Uh. Your graph is decent. What's your problem? Obviously you want like 7-8BB/100 before you start get cocky. I hope you're not here to show off your graph. If you want comments on your stats, get some more hands in and post it here: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/32...70/index3.html

Your NSD winnings is good. That's... a good thing You might be blowing away people a bit too much and thus losing value when opponetns have marginal hands, though.

[RoSeeker]

I have been playing several years off and on in the micros...grinding my first PP account up from $100 to $600 before it was closed, transferred about $150 from that into stars and grinded that up to about $1k before I decided I really needed to buy a Gibson!

That's a pretty good sign for you already, minus maybe the cashing out part. I don't understand how other people who realize that they can win thousands of dollars playing poker can resist the urge to keep playing and move up.

Anyway, your winrate: Sir, I envy your winrate. It seems that you do not multi table a lot though. 6 or so tables I guess? So take my comments with a bit of salt in that regard. Also, you don't have a huge sample size; you seem to be doing well, so I say get in more hands, and think about moving up when you can. Since these results do not include your previous successes, I must assume you're crushing the games over a decent sample size.

Despite all this, I really don't like your VPIP/PFR numbers. 30/13 is a really fishy stat. You're too passive preflop, and also quite passive postflop. Your 3bet isn't so bad, but it should be around 5. The fact that you managed to have 55% W$SD despite a 29 WTSD, I must assume that you're either running quite hot (not too impossible over just 9k hands) or super sharp with reads.

In fact, your stats overall look quite impossible. I'm not too sure how to respond to this. You fold to a lot of C-Bets too, and you cold call FAR too often in the SB. The fact that you win money in the SB is somewhat mindboggling.

Basically, I'd look to play a bit tighter, and more aggressive overall.

Keep it up though.

[OziBattler]

I have to lol cos right now i'd be happy if my last 10k graph was breakeven and i assume your title is wrong and that you are actually asking if you are just running good?....cos you are probably running well and havent had any downswing of note and your green EV line is basically shadowing your $ line.

anyway you may be a bit nitty for 6max but thats okay if you are learning and if you can find people who will payoff when you decide to play a hand. What youll find though as you move up is that people dont payoff or you just wont get hands when the other guy gets a hand he can call with and that is very frustrating.

but this is stats thread material so ill shipit.

ps live and online are different beasts

[irungood]

Originally Posted by RoSeeker

Uh. Your graph is decent. What's your problem? Obviously you want like 7-8BB/100 before you start get cocky. I hope you're not here to show off your graph. If you want comments on your stats, get some more hands in and post it here: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/32...70/index3.html

Your NSD winnings is good. That's... a good thing You might be blowing away people a bit too much and thus losing value when opponetns have marginal hands, though.

thats what i figured, i dont think im getting value out of my hands a good amount of times, i thought all the coaches say value bet, so i try to stay aggressive. should i check the flop and show weakness/let them catch up a little?

heres an example of one where i dont think i got enough value.

Poker Stars $25.00 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

CO: $32.00
BTN: $7.25
Hero (SB): $37.35
BB: $15.00
UTG: $53.30

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is SB with K A
1 fold, CO calls $0.25, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.75, 1 fold, CO calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.75) 2 9 K (2 players)
Hero bets $1.00, CO folds

[OziBattler]

irungood, the thing is your opponents wont always have a hand they can call with and so there is no value to be had........so all you can do is make the +EV play and hope they have something they can call with that you beat and that doesnt suckout on you. TPTK on a board that has some draws isnt a hand you want to slowplay

also your betsizing in that hand is not good...4xBB+1 per limpers works. Bet like at least $1.25 here. You have AK and are going to be OOP. your raise size basically lets CO and BB see a cheap flop and thats not good poker. so yeah, you could have got more value here by raising more preflop and having him call. your flop bet is too small too also.

[irungood]

Originally Posted by OziBattler

irungood, the thing is your opponents wont always have a hand they can call with and so there is no value to be had........so all you can do is make the +EV play and hope they have something they can call with that you beat and that doesnt suckout on you. TPTK on a board that has some draws isnt a hand you want to slowplay

also your betsizing in that hand is not good...4xBB+1 per limpers works. Bet like at least $1.25 here. You have AK and are going to be OOP. your raise size basically lets CO and BB see a cheap flop and thats not good poker. so yeah, you could have got more value here by raising more preflop and having him call. your flop bet is too small too also.

thanks for the analysis ozibattler. question, in your other post you say im a bit too nitty for 6-max. should i be raising pf more? i mean probably the loosest i get pf is 97s on button.. maybe cutoff if i feel the table is pretty nitty and wont three bet much.

[RoSeeker]

i mean probably the loosest i get pf is 97s on button.. maybe cutoff if i feel the table is pretty nitty and wont three bet much

Pretty standard.

[Demonic]

What are rough guidelines for afq and af?

[Shick]

Originally Posted by irungood

thats what i figured, i dont think im getting value out of my hands a good amount of times, i thought all the coaches say value bet, so i try to stay aggressive. should i check the flop and show weakness/let them catch up a little?

heres an example of one where i dont think i got enough value.

Poker Stars $25.00 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

CO: $32.00
BTN: $7.25
Hero (SB): $37.35
BB: $15.00
UTG: $53.30

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is SB with K A
1 fold, CO calls $0.25, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.75, 1 fold, CO calls $0.50

Flop: ($1.75) 2 9 K (2 players)
Hero bets $1.00, CO folds

No, I wouldn't check that flop.


Ozi's, right. Bet more pre with the limper.

Value bet more on that flop.

You're betting for value, not checking to let them catch up for value. You don't want them to catch up much with that hand.

[OziBattler]

Originally Posted by irungood

thanks for the analysis ozibattler. question, in your other post you say im a bit too nitty for 6-max. should i be raising pf more? i mean probably the loosest i get pf is 97s on button.. maybe cutoff if i feel the table is pretty nitty and wont three bet much.

i just meant you probably could play a few more hands but understand that this will put you in more tough spots....spots that can be +EV if played well but can also lead to spewage. for example, the easiest spots to add a few more hands may be to increase your stealing range particularly when you have to tight players in the blinds or to increase your isolation range when you have a bad player limp in front of you.

[irungood]

Originally Posted by OziBattler

i just meant you probably could play a few more hands but understand that this will put you in more tough spots....spots that can be +EV if played well but can also lead to spewage. for example, the easiest spots to add a few more hands may be to increase your stealing range particularly when you have to tight players in the blinds or to increase your isolation range when you have a bad player limp in front of you.

i think iso betting is my weakness live. in live no one respects my iso raises so it ends up being like a 5 way pot when i bet out around 7bb's pf (usually in button or cutoff). before i would be on such a sick heater and catch every flop while of course usually getting paid off big time (ended up coming up 30buyins in less than a month) but now its much harder since im basically missing everytime in these multiway pots. how should i play these players? i mean it is only a 36% chance i hit the flop so this cant be good. i play the same style i do in live and online, except in live i have a little tighter range since its usually a FR game.

[MrKite]

Originally Posted by RoSeeker

That's a pretty good sign for you already, minus maybe the cashing out part. I don't understand how other people who realize that they can win thousands of dollars playing poker can resist the urge to keep playing and move up.

It wasn't really about not having the urge, it was more just prioritizing my free time. This time is different and my goal right now is to be able to beat the $1/$2nl.

Originally Posted by RoSeeker

Anyway, your winrate: Sir, I envy your winrate. It seems that you do not multi table a lot though. 6 or so tables I guess? So take my comments with a bit of salt in that regard.

90% of the time I only 2-table with the rest 3-tabling.

Originally Posted by RoSeeker

Despite all this, I really don't like your VPIP/PFR numbers. 30/13 is a really fishy stat. You're too passive preflop, and also quite passive postflop. Your 3bet isn't so bad, but it should be around 5. The fact that you managed to have 55% W$SD despite a 29 WTSD, I must assume that you're either running quite hot (not too impossible over just 9k hands) or super sharp with reads.

Good info, thanks. I posted data based on 25K hands, and the 55 W$SD / 29 WTSD is pretty consistent at all the levels.

Originally Posted by RoSeeker

In fact, your stats overall look quite impossible. I'm not too sure how to respond to this. You fold to a lot of C-Bets too, and you cold call FAR too often in the SB. The fact that you win money in the SB is somewhat mindboggling.

Agreed on the SB stat - the 100CCPF stat from 3rd position makes me wonder if there's something screwy. Here's the most recent 15K hands at 10 and 25nl only, which includes a more realistic SB result, but I think I'm still getting involved there way too much...


By mrkite08 at 2008-12-18

I appreciate the feedback, thanks!

[Lego05]

Originally Posted by Shick

IIRC, your ATTS% is pretty high already.

What's IIRC mean?