Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying_Cloud
I like the concept behind Nil Poker, but my concern would be that the game devoles into a game based almost entirely around pre-flop EV stats.
with those extra cards in the deck, the statistical likelyhood of drawing a straight/flush/full house or great, is significantly reduced, thus the game would devolve into a battle over who has the highest value pair/two pair/ trips - set.
set mining with anything under jacks would become all but suicidal, if you dont flop your set your effectively screwed.
what i would expect to see if im reading this correctly, is super tight pre-flop range limited to...
big pairs (ace to 10)
AK/AQ/AJ/A10 (maybe A9 suited)
mid-low pairs (but only if you can limp onto the flop)
anything else should be considered a trash hand and thrown away, the only exception being stealing the blinds. what this Nil poker seems to curb is a trash hand hitting trips,or drawing a straight or flush. the problem with that is it boils the entire game down to the strength of your starting hand and mostly big pairs AA/KK/QQ.
it's basically a game where whoever has the highest pair automatically wins, you dont have to worry about drawing hands, as they are now waaaay harder to hit than in regular poker, if im playing full ring nil poker it seem like it would just turn into a game of "who's got the ace/king/queen, if the flop comes and any of those cards are present, and i miss the board, i might as well fold.....unless im holding a pair higher than anything on the board!
what you need is a game that incentivises players to stay in the hand, but only if they had a good starting hand (high suited connectors/big pairs)....a game that still allows for dynamic play on later streets and potencial hand strength reversals, but its next to impossible to win a hand by going all-in pre-flop with a useless trash hand
basically you want to negate the chances of a player winning if he goes full donkey on a J3 offsuit pre-flop against a player with a good starting hand, whilst at the same time allowing for the game to be meaningfull on all streets, and not totally decided pre-flop/flop but making the turn/river meaningfull and worth paying a price to see.
Hello Flying_Cloud. First I would like to thank you for taking your time and writing very good comment.
You have some good points. I would just like to add that hole cards: like for example ace and nil would not be bad too(in most situations). Hole cards would be more important(slightly more important, but in correlation with person´s poker skills).
One smart poster on this site said (he actually explained it a lot better than I will now) that it is natural solution of any game, that after time, every game evolves in the same way. You see the same amount of flops, turns,… in any poker variant (for example any holdem variant); Royal Hold´em, Six Plus Holdem,... People will probably adapt, so they will start calling more with middle pairs, plus nil poker(combination) possibility…and so on.
The GTO you mentioned is probably only going to work(be profitable) against very bad poker players (but in today´s world very bad players are very rare). As for, lets say person A plays in the way you mentioned and person B plays a bit more aggressive (also a bit more loose in right spots). Persons A ranges are very easy to spot if playing like this. Person A would also not hit as much (as in poker(52-card deck); so a lot of »automatic« folds or checks for person A, which makes his ranges even more predictable), so person B can for example bluff him in a lot of spots. So, I believe person B has a big advantage vs person A. I think adding nil poker(combination) will make a game more crazy (fun), especially because nil poker(combination) is ranked between flush and fullhouse (but actually it is a lot easier to get nil poker (4 or more nil cards) than a flush).
Thank you for taking your time Flying_Cloud, again. It really means a lot to me.
Next couple of sentences are not answer to your post, but I will wrote it here because they go well with the text that I wrote here.
I believe this is a game with huge potential. The game is very easy to understand, so everybody understand rules, but it is a bit harder to play good nil poker(vs poker – 52-card deck; nil poker is a bit more advanced).
Because of reasons above it is obvious all poker coaches will love it too (profits for them goes to the moon): basically teaching people how to: more hero calling and bluffing (one of the coolest things to do in poker),... People who understand poker (52-card game) will have really big advantage in nil poker.
I actually believe everybody will like nil poker(poker coaches, casinos, forums, winning players, losing players,..), but I will wrote a bit more about this(and why) some other time.
I believe this:
Nil Poker – The Future of Poker. Golden age of poker will be back.
Last edited by blackspoker; 06-20-2017 at 11:17 AM.