Pervasive Feeling of Wasting my Life
10-20-2014
, 12:14 AM
My 2c.
Life is hard but it's like about the journey man. That and banging chicks along the way
.
I've found and I think a lot of happiness researchers have studied that the quantity and quality of your social network is greatly related to well being and happiness. For most, the nomadic lonely life of a poker player is at odds with this.
Living and working or studying where a lot of your friends are can deliver on this.
Personal development
-Exercise / Diet
-Meditation (check out calm app or headspace... 5-10 minute investment to unwind and relax, esp after poker)
Career development
Spend a portion of your day starting to diversify your future. Poker is unfulfilling for you and greater success in it probably won't make you happier. This won't change and it will likely get worse. These next steps will give you hope and lay the foundations for a career change if / when.
-Polish off your resume. Might not be applicable right away but always good to have.
-Take a few classes in different fields that seem appealing to you and see if anything clicks. BFI favourites here are coding, data science, MBA, actuary.
Then if something clicks take the next step. This would be to identify and apply to a coding / data science bootcamp, Biz school or graduate program. Online courses are probably best for your lifestyle (check out Coursera specialisations / MySlideRule learning paths / Udacity nanodegrees).
Taking an IRL college class in a different country might be interesting experience tho, and you can meet people / birds. It will also get you out of the house.
-Make a list of positions you're interested in. Find out what sort of credentials are necessary. You lose nothing by applying for them.
Poker
Keep playing poker for the meantime. In the short run you'll need the money to fund your day to day needs and then invest what you don't need for them longterm millions.
At the end of the day, it's up to you to find the life you want.
-
Nice to see the presumably ballin Green Plastic still mucking about here.
Life is hard but it's like about the journey man. That and banging chicks along the way
.I've found and I think a lot of happiness researchers have studied that the quantity and quality of your social network is greatly related to well being and happiness. For most, the nomadic lonely life of a poker player is at odds with this.
Living and working or studying where a lot of your friends are can deliver on this.
Personal development
-Exercise / Diet
-Meditation (check out calm app or headspace... 5-10 minute investment to unwind and relax, esp after poker)
Career development
Spend a portion of your day starting to diversify your future. Poker is unfulfilling for you and greater success in it probably won't make you happier. This won't change and it will likely get worse. These next steps will give you hope and lay the foundations for a career change if / when.
-Polish off your resume. Might not be applicable right away but always good to have.
-Take a few classes in different fields that seem appealing to you and see if anything clicks. BFI favourites here are coding, data science, MBA, actuary.
Then if something clicks take the next step. This would be to identify and apply to a coding / data science bootcamp, Biz school or graduate program. Online courses are probably best for your lifestyle (check out Coursera specialisations / MySlideRule learning paths / Udacity nanodegrees).
Taking an IRL college class in a different country might be interesting experience tho, and you can meet people / birds. It will also get you out of the house.
-Make a list of positions you're interested in. Find out what sort of credentials are necessary. You lose nothing by applying for them.
Poker
Keep playing poker for the meantime. In the short run you'll need the money to fund your day to day needs and then invest what you don't need for them longterm millions.
At the end of the day, it's up to you to find the life you want.
-
Nice to see the presumably ballin Green Plastic still mucking about here.
10-22-2014
, 03:13 PM
10-23-2014
, 02:51 AM
Quote:
Start meditating every morning. Download the app "headspace" to start (calm is another one, I have used headspace though), then adapt once you get used to it.
Sounds like hippie nonsense (or at least it did to me), but it does wonders if you put the effort in. It has allowed me to sort of detach from myself and view things as if I were someone else observing me, which has been hugely helpful in my stress, happiness, and sense of worth. I view things about myself much more objectively and am okay with it, good or bad.
I read an article about Ray Dalio crediting meditation as the number one factor in his success as a hedge fund manager, so I decided to give it a whirl. Glad I did.
(http://www.businessinsider.com/ray-dalio-2014-2)
There is a lot of other good advice in this thread. Especially the networking advice, good networks allow for great opportunities you would never know existed otherwise.
Sounds like hippie nonsense (or at least it did to me), but it does wonders if you put the effort in. It has allowed me to sort of detach from myself and view things as if I were someone else observing me, which has been hugely helpful in my stress, happiness, and sense of worth. I view things about myself much more objectively and am okay with it, good or bad.
I read an article about Ray Dalio crediting meditation as the number one factor in his success as a hedge fund manager, so I decided to give it a whirl. Glad I did.
(http://www.businessinsider.com/ray-dalio-2014-2)
There is a lot of other good advice in this thread. Especially the networking advice, good networks allow for great opportunities you would never know existed otherwise.
Quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z73La1RdWOo
chris is a good friend of mine and who i immediately thought of when i read your post the other day... maybe this will give you some insight into integrating back into the real world, idk. but it's full of great advise either way
chris is a good friend of mine and who i immediately thought of when i read your post the other day... maybe this will give you some insight into integrating back into the real world, idk. but it's full of great advise either way
Quote:
Although I am a few years older we have similar college backgrounds, so you may find this book/talk interesting. I will link to the closing of the talk ( you should spend the time to watch the entire thing and if you like buy his book called The Education of a Value Investor) where Guy Spier says, (paraphrase) "....emotions are call to action. The call to action is there is something wrong in my life and I need to change.....You need to get to a place where you are going to bed every night happy with what you did that day."
Here is a link to the talk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifDCmRBElPY#t=3664
You have already made a nice sum of money which if saved and invested properly has significant future value. Sure, you could have more. Would having a net worth that is 500K larger really improve your overall happiness? Remember, the correlation between money and happiness is likely to be a fraction of what we think it is. Sit down and ask yourself why you are still playing. It is because other people think it is cool or is it because you really still enjoy the profession and are happy with your decision to wake up and play everyday?
About the poker industry.... This is a dying business. There really is no way around this fact. In 5 years this industry is going to look VERY different from what it does now and is extremely unlikely to improve and even unlikely to only get marginally worse for professional players. Poker is not like other jobs, where if you lose your job or want to leave, you can transition to something else quickly and easily. You are not building a network of professional contacts that can give you opportunities in the future (not that you couldn't just that most professional players don't and aren't). This leads to higher switching cost than other careers, which will only increase the longer you play.
You are right that poker is very unlikely to be adding value to society. Lots of other industries are not either. It is what it is. I don't think that anyone has an obligation to add value to society (although the argument could be made), but what really matters is this certainly seems like this is important factor to you. If it truly is, then there is no reason to not act upon it.
Here is a link to the talk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifDCmRBElPY#t=3664
You have already made a nice sum of money which if saved and invested properly has significant future value. Sure, you could have more. Would having a net worth that is 500K larger really improve your overall happiness? Remember, the correlation between money and happiness is likely to be a fraction of what we think it is. Sit down and ask yourself why you are still playing. It is because other people think it is cool or is it because you really still enjoy the profession and are happy with your decision to wake up and play everyday?
About the poker industry.... This is a dying business. There really is no way around this fact. In 5 years this industry is going to look VERY different from what it does now and is extremely unlikely to improve and even unlikely to only get marginally worse for professional players. Poker is not like other jobs, where if you lose your job or want to leave, you can transition to something else quickly and easily. You are not building a network of professional contacts that can give you opportunities in the future (not that you couldn't just that most professional players don't and aren't). This leads to higher switching cost than other careers, which will only increase the longer you play.
You are right that poker is very unlikely to be adding value to society. Lots of other industries are not either. It is what it is. I don't think that anyone has an obligation to add value to society (although the argument could be made), but what really matters is this certainly seems like this is important factor to you. If it truly is, then there is no reason to not act upon it.
Quote:
There's an abundance of valuable content in this thread; thanks to all who have contributed.
OP, fwiw, I'm dealing with similar issues, but I've had a much different trajectory in life than you. Was an academic all-star in college, went to an elite law school after failing to come up with a better plan (horrible reason), worked for a large law firm for 4 years and made six figures, was miserable on a daily basis and finally reached the point where I couldn't take it anymore and quit. Since then, I've been playing poker full-time. While the $ has been good and I'm much less stressed now, with no regrets about leaving the firm, I still feel the same spiritual emptiness that I was hoping would go away once I left the firm. I agree with many others itt that your feelings are probably less directly related to poker than you think. It's more likely the same spiritual malaise that plagues a lot of us who have had a taste of success yet still feel unfulfilled. Life is hard, and it's not any easier when we've been conditioned by American culture to want spectacular lives.
Just like while at the firm, sometimes I wake up in the middle of the night and I find myself panicked by my absence of purpose. Like you, I often find myself troubled by the consequences of preying on dead $, but at least I feel like my actions have no worse bearing on society at large than when I was as a litigator. Feeling as if your life has purpose is not natural imo, but rather something that will take time and effort; imo most people are walking around "faking it" and feel spiritually empty to at least some extent.
IMO, the solutions offered in this thread might help but are generally too specific and biased. I think it'd be better to focus on more general things you could do, such as adding new daily exercise and dietary habits. It's these kinds of basic changes that often pave the way for more momentous change. They'll make you feel better on a physical level which will lead you to have more energy and direct more of your mental focus towards what matters.
I've seen a therapist and found it helpful, albeit too expensive, but there's plenty of other things you could do as well. Exercise, meditation, keeping my most valuable friendships intact, and maintaining a journal are all things I've done that have helped me feel better about my life on a day-to-day basis. There are also well-documented positive psychology techniques you can embrace such as focusing at the end of the day about what you've accomplished that day and why/how as well as taking a moment to think about something for which you're grateful.
OP, fwiw, I'm dealing with similar issues, but I've had a much different trajectory in life than you. Was an academic all-star in college, went to an elite law school after failing to come up with a better plan (horrible reason), worked for a large law firm for 4 years and made six figures, was miserable on a daily basis and finally reached the point where I couldn't take it anymore and quit. Since then, I've been playing poker full-time. While the $ has been good and I'm much less stressed now, with no regrets about leaving the firm, I still feel the same spiritual emptiness that I was hoping would go away once I left the firm. I agree with many others itt that your feelings are probably less directly related to poker than you think. It's more likely the same spiritual malaise that plagues a lot of us who have had a taste of success yet still feel unfulfilled. Life is hard, and it's not any easier when we've been conditioned by American culture to want spectacular lives.
Just like while at the firm, sometimes I wake up in the middle of the night and I find myself panicked by my absence of purpose. Like you, I often find myself troubled by the consequences of preying on dead $, but at least I feel like my actions have no worse bearing on society at large than when I was as a litigator. Feeling as if your life has purpose is not natural imo, but rather something that will take time and effort; imo most people are walking around "faking it" and feel spiritually empty to at least some extent.
IMO, the solutions offered in this thread might help but are generally too specific and biased. I think it'd be better to focus on more general things you could do, such as adding new daily exercise and dietary habits. It's these kinds of basic changes that often pave the way for more momentous change. They'll make you feel better on a physical level which will lead you to have more energy and direct more of your mental focus towards what matters.
I've seen a therapist and found it helpful, albeit too expensive, but there's plenty of other things you could do as well. Exercise, meditation, keeping my most valuable friendships intact, and maintaining a journal are all things I've done that have helped me feel better about my life on a day-to-day basis. There are also well-documented positive psychology techniques you can embrace such as focusing at the end of the day about what you've accomplished that day and why/how as well as taking a moment to think about something for which you're grateful.
Quote:
My life's work? It's good question. I have asked it myself many times. especially as I get older and tend to reflect.
I thought for a while whether I should reply to this thread or not. I've been drinking though so what the hell I just turned 60 this year so in 2+2 terms I am an "old". Mentally I still feel 18, physically not so much! But at this point in ones life they tend to reflect.
Although not a pro poker player I have had a similarly "solo" type career. I have been a professional trader since 1987. All I have done in that time is chase the buck. All of my friends from college went to corporate America. They spent their lives in sales and accounting and management. They talk about their industry and corporate America in general. It was and is their lives work. I can't relate. For me it was and is about the next trade. Me against the world! I wouldn't want it any other way. I never had the security they had in guaranteed incomes and constant employment. And I wouldn't trade with any of them! Even the VP's at fortune 500 companies (a couple actually).
Do what makes you happy! Do what you enjoy. Trading makes me happy and I will do it until I die. I will never fully retire because I love it so much. If poker makes you happy then go it! If not? Find out what does.
James Taylor says it best. Yeah, remember I'm old The Secret 'O Life is enjoying the passing of time.
I thought for a while whether I should reply to this thread or not. I've been drinking though so what the hell
I just turned 60 this year so in 2+2 terms I am an "old". Mentally I still feel 18, physically not so much! But at this point in ones life they tend to reflect.Although not a pro poker player I have had a similarly "solo" type career. I have been a professional trader since 1987. All I have done in that time is chase the buck. All of my friends from college went to corporate America. They spent their lives in sales and accounting and management. They talk about their industry and corporate America in general. It was and is their lives work. I can't relate. For me it was and is about the next trade. Me against the world! I wouldn't want it any other way. I never had the security they had in guaranteed incomes and constant employment. And I wouldn't trade with any of them! Even the VP's at fortune 500 companies (a couple actually).
Do what makes you happy! Do what you enjoy. Trading makes me happy and I will do it until I die. I will never fully retire because I love it so much. If poker makes you happy then go it! If not? Find out what does.
James Taylor says it best. Yeah, remember I'm old
The Secret 'O Life is enjoying the passing of time.
Quote:
My 2c.
Life is hard but it's like about the journey man. That and banging chicks along the way.
I've found and I think a lot of happiness researchers have studied that the quantity and quality of your social network is greatly related to well being and happiness. For most, the nomadic lonely life of a poker player is at odds with this.
Living and working or studying where a lot of your friends are can deliver on this.
Personal development
-Exercise / Diet
-Meditation (check out calm app or headspace... 5-10 minute investment to unwind and relax, esp after poker)
Career development
Spend a portion of your day starting to diversify your future. Poker is unfulfilling for you and greater success in it probably won't make you happier. This won't change and it will likely get worse. These next steps will give you hope and lay the foundations for a career change if / when.
-Polish off your resume. Might not be applicable right away but always good to have.
-Take a few classes in different fields that seem appealing to you and see if anything clicks. BFI favourites here are coding, data science, MBA, actuary.
Then if something clicks take the next step. This would be to identify and apply to a coding / data science bootcamp, Biz school or graduate program. Online courses are probably best for your lifestyle (check out Coursera specialisations / MySlideRule learning paths / Udacity nanodegrees).
Taking an IRL college class in a different country might be interesting experience tho, and you can meet people / birds. It will also get you out of the house.
-Make a list of positions you're interested in. Find out what sort of credentials are necessary. You lose nothing by applying for them.
Poker
Keep playing poker for the meantime. In the short run you'll need the money to fund your day to day needs and then invest what you don't need for them longterm millions.
At the end of the day, it's up to you to find the life you want.
-
Nice to see the presumably ballin Green Plastic still mucking about here.
Life is hard but it's like about the journey man. That and banging chicks along the way
.I've found and I think a lot of happiness researchers have studied that the quantity and quality of your social network is greatly related to well being and happiness. For most, the nomadic lonely life of a poker player is at odds with this.
Living and working or studying where a lot of your friends are can deliver on this.
Personal development
-Exercise / Diet
-Meditation (check out calm app or headspace... 5-10 minute investment to unwind and relax, esp after poker)
Career development
Spend a portion of your day starting to diversify your future. Poker is unfulfilling for you and greater success in it probably won't make you happier. This won't change and it will likely get worse. These next steps will give you hope and lay the foundations for a career change if / when.
-Polish off your resume. Might not be applicable right away but always good to have.
-Take a few classes in different fields that seem appealing to you and see if anything clicks. BFI favourites here are coding, data science, MBA, actuary.
Then if something clicks take the next step. This would be to identify and apply to a coding / data science bootcamp, Biz school or graduate program. Online courses are probably best for your lifestyle (check out Coursera specialisations / MySlideRule learning paths / Udacity nanodegrees).
Taking an IRL college class in a different country might be interesting experience tho, and you can meet people / birds. It will also get you out of the house.
-Make a list of positions you're interested in. Find out what sort of credentials are necessary. You lose nothing by applying for them.
Poker
Keep playing poker for the meantime. In the short run you'll need the money to fund your day to day needs and then invest what you don't need for them longterm millions.
At the end of the day, it's up to you to find the life you want.
-
Nice to see the presumably ballin Green Plastic still mucking about here.
Quote:
I would def +1 on the therapy at first.
You need to be surrounded with people you love/care. Does not matter how much money they win (unless they are just total leechers). You need to find other interests than poker, interests that you can share with people you want to be with. With the intelligence you have and the connexions/reach you potentially have, you can do something great. Like Slow said, it is going to be a lot of f**in work, most people rather sitout and just stick to the "easy" path. At this point, it's up to you if you really want to change.
I hear a lot of people saying that winning a lot of money/playing poker is great because it gives you a lot of freedom. Right, freedom is what everyone wants. It is the ultimate goal. But you have to understand, if your freedom is being alone or eating pizzas while playing beerpong /going out getting drunk with other poker pros, you might reconsider your freetime. What about family? Girlfriend? Close friends? If your freedom does not involve them, you will always feel like you are wasting your life. Because your life means a lot more once you care about others ("only a life lived for others is a life worthwhile"). I was like you before. I'm older than you (29) and I have been around for a while. I've lived the up and down of poker. I have traveled the globe, being far away from the ones I truely did care. I have never been as happy as right now, living with my gf, being closer as never of my family, having close friends that I can talk to in any situations. Having a brother that I'm close to and enjoy being with, and his child/wife. Money does not buy all of this. I made changes in my own life because I felt empty, unhappy. Took me a while, and I'm still trying to be a better person as of today. These changes had to be made for my own sake (long term). Those changes aren't easy. I went back to university. Started projects with people I met tru poker (you should do that too fwiw) and enjoy being with. PS: Entrepreneurship looks like a good venue for you.
And for those saying voluntary work is useless, I'm not sure how to respond to this. I hope this is variance because it is def the comments that shocked/surprised me the most. You guys are aware there are a lot non-profit organisations that are there to help the ones that needs the most? Those organisations have no budjet whatsoever and are helping a lot of people, those people that you might think just live in movies, but no trust me, they do exist. They do need these organisations. These organisations need voluntary work. And I know what I'm talking about because my gf works for one of those (YWCA, not YMCA fwiw) and I do voluntary for them. It is actually pretty sad to see intelligent people thinking it is useless. Then, if that is useless, what is, usefull?
You are a smart individual OP and I hope the best for you. I truely believe that you will find your way. It does take some time. Always be gratefull for what poker gave you, because it gave you, more than just money.
Ludovic
You need to be surrounded with people you love/care. Does not matter how much money they win (unless they are just total leechers). You need to find other interests than poker, interests that you can share with people you want to be with. With the intelligence you have and the connexions/reach you potentially have, you can do something great. Like Slow said, it is going to be a lot of f**in work, most people rather sitout and just stick to the "easy" path. At this point, it's up to you if you really want to change.
I hear a lot of people saying that winning a lot of money/playing poker is great because it gives you a lot of freedom. Right, freedom is what everyone wants. It is the ultimate goal. But you have to understand, if your freedom is being alone or eating pizzas while playing beerpong /going out getting drunk with other poker pros, you might reconsider your freetime. What about family? Girlfriend? Close friends? If your freedom does not involve them, you will always feel like you are wasting your life. Because your life means a lot more once you care about others ("only a life lived for others is a life worthwhile"). I was like you before. I'm older than you (29) and I have been around for a while. I've lived the up and down of poker. I have traveled the globe, being far away from the ones I truely did care. I have never been as happy as right now, living with my gf, being closer as never of my family, having close friends that I can talk to in any situations. Having a brother that I'm close to and enjoy being with, and his child/wife. Money does not buy all of this. I made changes in my own life because I felt empty, unhappy. Took me a while, and I'm still trying to be a better person as of today. These changes had to be made for my own sake (long term). Those changes aren't easy. I went back to university. Started projects with people I met tru poker (you should do that too fwiw) and enjoy being with. PS: Entrepreneurship looks like a good venue for you.
And for those saying voluntary work is useless, I'm not sure how to respond to this. I hope this is variance because it is def the comments that shocked/surprised me the most. You guys are aware there are a lot non-profit organisations that are there to help the ones that needs the most? Those organisations have no budjet whatsoever and are helping a lot of people, those people that you might think just live in movies, but no trust me, they do exist. They do need these organisations. These organisations need voluntary work. And I know what I'm talking about because my gf works for one of those (YWCA, not YMCA fwiw) and I do voluntary for them. It is actually pretty sad to see intelligent people thinking it is useless. Then, if that is useless, what is, usefull?
You are a smart individual OP and I hope the best for you. I truely believe that you will find your way. It does take some time. Always be gratefull for what poker gave you, because it gave you, more than just money.
Ludovic
Quote:
you are 23 years old. jesus. Stop stressing and enjoy life. Also **** poker as a career/living - just use it as a means to fund whatever career you actually want to have.
Find something you would enjoy doing 7 days a week (regardless of pay) and then find someone who is already successfully doing it - and go work for them...even if it is for free.
What I wouldn't give to be 23 again. sigh.
Find something you would enjoy doing 7 days a week (regardless of pay) and then find someone who is already successfully doing it - and go work for them...even if it is for free.
What I wouldn't give to be 23 again. sigh.
Quote:
I actually like this thread, but I'm emo in general so who knows.
I will +1 on speaking to a professional counselor. My wife is a therapist and I have seen how much she studies best practices and devours research. She also puts in a lot of time outside of sessions. This is vital.
Look, leaving poker was the smartest decision I ever made. I was fairly unhappy in that world by the time I left & although the money was certainly seductive, I agree with cottonseed that it's been drying up ever since 2009 & is likely to continue contracting. I empathize was the sentiment. 1. That said, I've now been in the VC world for 3 years...and frankly, it becomes less interesting the more time goes on, because it becomes more rythmic and less novel on a day to day basis. I don't have a solution for this, but I'm thinking about it a lot...
A lot of people are focused on happiness. I'm a bit controversial in that I think our culture greatly over-prioritizes pursuit of happiness. Doing what makes you happy is not always the right thing to do. 2. I'm a big believer that our foremost focus should be on doing the right thing - and that longterm we reap real benefits & happiness from continually making proper decisions.
Evan, unfortunately I don't have a magic suggestion, but you do have a fair amount of freedom & resources at your disposal. At the end of the day, my belief is that real relationships are key - based on more than poker circuit acquaintances - where you can cultivate deep & meaningful conversation and introspection. 3. There's no formula, but you're a good guy, and if you seek out other good people, you will find it.
E
I will +1 on speaking to a professional counselor. My wife is a therapist and I have seen how much she studies best practices and devours research. She also puts in a lot of time outside of sessions. This is vital.
Look, leaving poker was the smartest decision I ever made. I was fairly unhappy in that world by the time I left & although the money was certainly seductive, I agree with cottonseed that it's been drying up ever since 2009 & is likely to continue contracting. I empathize was the sentiment. 1. That said, I've now been in the VC world for 3 years...and frankly, it becomes less interesting the more time goes on, because it becomes more rythmic and less novel on a day to day basis. I don't have a solution for this, but I'm thinking about it a lot...
A lot of people are focused on happiness. I'm a bit controversial in that I think our culture greatly over-prioritizes pursuit of happiness. Doing what makes you happy is not always the right thing to do. 2. I'm a big believer that our foremost focus should be on doing the right thing - and that longterm we reap real benefits & happiness from continually making proper decisions.
Evan, unfortunately I don't have a magic suggestion, but you do have a fair amount of freedom & resources at your disposal. At the end of the day, my belief is that real relationships are key - based on more than poker circuit acquaintances - where you can cultivate deep & meaningful conversation and introspection. 3. There's no formula, but you're a good guy, and if you seek out other good people, you will find it.
E
1. This is very interesting to hear and perhaps slams home the point that others made ITT... that your career isn't what leads to fulfillment. I guess the way I previously thought about it was that I spend so much time working each day that I want to get some fulfillment out of that huge time commitment. The assertion that I should see it purely as a means to an end has been very helpful for me.
2. So happiness is derived from making the right moral decision? Or am I misunderstanding what you mean here?
3. Thanks for this. Mentioned earlier in this post that I want to settle down, and I think doing that will help me in this regard.
Quote:
I'm not going to add anything new, but here's my thoughts....
I'm 20 years older than you and I remember feeling the same as you at your age.
Here's how I think now
That feeling you're searching for, let's call it fulfillment, doesn't come from a job. Certainly it's possible to find a job that fulfills you but I think that is rare. The most I hope from work is that it is an interesting and lucrative way to fund my life and give me security. 99% of jobs will end up feeling like a grind. At least with poker I have freedom.
I think fulfillment starts from inside. Being comfortable with yourself and who you are. Next it's about the people who surround you. Cut out the negative people and the emotional vampires. Surround yourself with people who add to your life and work to add to their lives.
I'm extremely pragmatic when it comes to poker. It's the best combination of freedom and earning power available to me and there isn't a close second. Money gives me freedom and it's what I do with that freedom which brings fulfillment. I consider it short sighted and stupid of me if I didn't take advantage of this opportunity. I am bothered by the fact that my life is built on my exploitation of others which likely hurts their quality of life. I have no way to justify that other than I'm a self-serving *******.
That being said poker isn't for most people, even among those that have the skill to win. I know a lot of guys who win but really lack the discipline. Poker ends up giving them freedom and enough to live on but they don't get ahead.
I treat poker like a business. I diversify my income and I work set hours. I work 8am-2pm and then the gym and if needed an hour or two when I get home. I take 1 day off each week and one or two vacations each year.
My advice
With poker you have a rare and limited opportunity. Having a solid 6 or 7 figure life roll make a huge difference in your future. Take advantage of that. Make goals. From the time I started in poker I felt absolutely certain I would be out in 3 years and I use that motivate myself to get the most out of poker.
How can you make poker more interesting for you? I find it much more enjoyable doing multiple things. A little coaching, some affiliate stuff, software related work, ect. Try to simply view poker as a means to an end.
Work on yourself. Figure out your passion. What do you want out of life? Poker isn't an activity that consumes every waking hour. How can you mix in what makes you passionate with poker?
I really think that how you're feeling has much more to do with you rather than poker.
I'm 20 years older than you and I remember feeling the same as you at your age.
Here's how I think now
That feeling you're searching for, let's call it fulfillment, doesn't come from a job. Certainly it's possible to find a job that fulfills you but I think that is rare. The most I hope from work is that it is an interesting and lucrative way to fund my life and give me security. 99% of jobs will end up feeling like a grind. At least with poker I have freedom.
I think fulfillment starts from inside. Being comfortable with yourself and who you are. Next it's about the people who surround you. Cut out the negative people and the emotional vampires. Surround yourself with people who add to your life and work to add to their lives.
I'm extremely pragmatic when it comes to poker. It's the best combination of freedom and earning power available to me and there isn't a close second. Money gives me freedom and it's what I do with that freedom which brings fulfillment. I consider it short sighted and stupid of me if I didn't take advantage of this opportunity. I am bothered by the fact that my life is built on my exploitation of others which likely hurts their quality of life. I have no way to justify that other than I'm a self-serving *******.
That being said poker isn't for most people, even among those that have the skill to win. I know a lot of guys who win but really lack the discipline. Poker ends up giving them freedom and enough to live on but they don't get ahead.
I treat poker like a business. I diversify my income and I work set hours. I work 8am-2pm and then the gym and if needed an hour or two when I get home. I take 1 day off each week and one or two vacations each year.
My advice
With poker you have a rare and limited opportunity. Having a solid 6 or 7 figure life roll make a huge difference in your future. Take advantage of that. Make goals. From the time I started in poker I felt absolutely certain I would be out in 3 years and I use that motivate myself to get the most out of poker.
How can you make poker more interesting for you? I find it much more enjoyable doing multiple things. A little coaching, some affiliate stuff, software related work, ect. Try to simply view poker as a means to an end.
Work on yourself. Figure out your passion. What do you want out of life? Poker isn't an activity that consumes every waking hour. How can you mix in what makes you passionate with poker?
I really think that how you're feeling has much more to do with you rather than poker.
To everyone else I didn't single out or respond to a specific point, thanks for your posts as well. This thread has been very helpful and I feel like I have a roadmap of what I should do over the next months. Any more advice is always appreciated, so don't hesitate to post
10-23-2014
, 04:55 AM
Quote:
I actually like this thread, but I'm emo in general so who knows.
I empathize was the sentiment. That said, I've now been in the VC world for 3 years...and frankly, it becomes less interesting the more time goes on, because it becomes more rythmic and less novel on a day to day basis. I don't have a solution for this, but I'm thinking about it a lot...
A lot of people are focused on happiness. I'm a bit controversial in that I think our culture greatly over-prioritizes pursuit of happiness. Doing what makes you happy is not always the right thing to do. I'm a big believer that our foremost focus should be on doing the right thing - and that longterm we reap real benefits & happiness from continually making proper decisions.
I empathize was the sentiment. That said, I've now been in the VC world for 3 years...and frankly, it becomes less interesting the more time goes on, because it becomes more rythmic and less novel on a day to day basis. I don't have a solution for this, but I'm thinking about it a lot...
A lot of people are focused on happiness. I'm a bit controversial in that I think our culture greatly over-prioritizes pursuit of happiness. Doing what makes you happy is not always the right thing to do. I'm a big believer that our foremost focus should be on doing the right thing - and that longterm we reap real benefits & happiness from continually making proper decisions.
Quote:
Thanks for this suggestion, I've started doing it. Earlier this year when I was going through a rough time I tried yoga and found that to be extremely helpful as well.
Thank you for this. I think ultimately my lack of satisfaction comes from the nomadic lifestyle of an American pro poker player rather than not contributing to society.
Any more advice is always appreciated, so don't hesitate to post
Thank you for this. I think ultimately my lack of satisfaction comes from the nomadic lifestyle of an American pro poker player rather than not contributing to society.
Any more advice is always appreciated, so don't hesitate to post
http://yogastudioapp.com/
Many 10 minute sessions in that yoga app. Good for unwinding physically and mentally. Also those meditation apps, I use calm, have short session options.
I live and work abroad (9-5 not poker) so I can relate. There is a high / stressful start up cost for international move. Visas, accommodation, Internet set up, bank accounts, language barrier etc. Rinse and repeat a few times and you'd hard pressed not to burnout. Gets better over time as you figure things out locally.
10-23-2014
, 04:43 PM
I'm not really sure what's going to make you happy, but I feel like your current setup is non ideal in many senses.
-You're away from family and friends
-You aren't in a permanent enough situation to make new friends or join a gym
-You're playing a game that is already super isolating
I think what you wrote above about moving somewhere for at least 6 months to sort things out is a good plan. Moving around all the time must be very stressful imo.
I moved to a new place in 2012 and knew basically no one. It was a bit sad at first -- I remember one morning at around 2am looking down from the balcony and seeing a bunch of ~high schoolers running around the streets having fun and wondering wtf I'm doing here instead of being with all my friends/family!
However, being forced to meet new people was a great life challenge, especially for people like me who have the majority of friends from ~middle school. This situation also gave an amazing amount of time to think about things. Long nights spent analyzing different jobs, paths to get to them, different degrees, different schools, thinking about things I wanted to learn, all sorts of things.
Of course you could just move to a place with an established poker community and skip the above emo section
One other place that I've found myself doing good thinking is in nature. At this kind of crossroads I think some sort of mid-length trip with no poker involved and perhaps a large nature element would be a good way to have fun and think about things before getting into the grind.
On a more practical note, given your interest in finance and wanting to contribute, you could consider doing a microfinance internship with a site like Kiva (all over but many require language skills) or Zidisha (same, but only Ghana or Kenya w/out foreign language) for a few months.
-You're away from family and friends
-You aren't in a permanent enough situation to make new friends or join a gym
-You're playing a game that is already super isolating
I think what you wrote above about moving somewhere for at least 6 months to sort things out is a good plan. Moving around all the time must be very stressful imo.
I moved to a new place in 2012 and knew basically no one. It was a bit sad at first -- I remember one morning at around 2am looking down from the balcony and seeing a bunch of ~high schoolers running around the streets having fun and wondering wtf I'm doing here instead of being with all my friends/family!
However, being forced to meet new people was a great life challenge, especially for people like me who have the majority of friends from ~middle school. This situation also gave an amazing amount of time to think about things. Long nights spent analyzing different jobs, paths to get to them, different degrees, different schools, thinking about things I wanted to learn, all sorts of things.
Of course you could just move to a place with an established poker community and skip the above emo section
One other place that I've found myself doing good thinking is in nature. At this kind of crossroads I think some sort of mid-length trip with no poker involved and perhaps a large nature element would be a good way to have fun and think about things before getting into the grind.
On a more practical note, given your interest in finance and wanting to contribute, you could consider doing a microfinance internship with a site like Kiva (all over but many require language skills) or Zidisha (same, but only Ghana or Kenya w/out foreign language) for a few months.
10-24-2014
, 01:34 AM
