As long as you are making a decent wage, saving 10-20% shouldn't be too hard as long as you steer clear of vices and big ticket items that you don't really need.

To those of you who say, find something you enjoy and get really good at it: How long do you think does it take to get "really good" at something, to a point where you actually make 100k+/year? Would one year doing only one thing be a reasonable estimate?

I doubt that a year is nearly enough time for most activities. IMO if you find something you really love and get really good at it, the best thing you'll gain is not feeling like a slave. And what they're saying I think is that if you do that you'll also end up making a decent amount of money eventually. Maybe like 5-10 years?

I think this is one of those sayings that are just myths. It's like when people say poker is so good for life experiences. Yeah, right.

The fact is certain skills and fields are more highly compensated than others. If you work in a financial or a trading environment, you're simply going to make more money than if you are in art or criminal justice. It's that simple. Sure, you can be a photographer and really love it, but I know plenty of broke photographers (who are actually waiters or bartenders). I don't know many broke lawyers. Do you?

There are SO many people with awful fields and awful jobs they "love". It just baffles me, but I really think it's due to this sentiment of people saying "do what you love" or "do what interests you". Well, everyone I know who studied psychology or wanted to be a teacher because they liked kids is on the poorer side. I'd much rather be highly compensated and enjoy my time off and having plenty of money. For me, money IS freedom.

And I don't mind my job one bit. In fact, I almost like it. Mind you - not to the point where I'd rather be there than home, don't get me wrong. There are literally days I'm at work and say to myself "I can't believe they pay me 100k to sit here and watch tv and answer the phones once in a while".

Beats a psychology degree.

I hope you're kidding. If you're not then how on earth are you qualified to tell people what is or isn't doable financially?

Did you get a huge inheritance or something? And if you've grown up really wealthy (and still are) then I gotta say you have absolutely no connection with reality whatsoever.

I could not agree with you enough on nearly every point you've made in this thread. It really is what you keep not what you make. Things like nice cars are fungible and provide very little marginal pleasure to anyone. (Unless they're single in which case it marginally increases the quality of ass they're getting... which is worth something I guess)

Quality of ass is worth a lot actually if you think about it.

I never really understood what "pay yourself first" meant until I (we) started doing it. Watching our assets grow is satisfying. Not being in any financial stress at all and knowing that if any normal situation comes up we could easily handle it really gives me peace of mind and has made me entire life just less stressful. I don't care about the bill when I go out, me and my wife don't fight about money, we do whatever we wish and it's really nice.

Much better than 7 years ago when I literally was borrowing a few hundred bucks all the time just to get to next paycheck and having my girlfriend bail me out of jams because I was broke. I just wish I woke up earlier when it comes to how I manage my income, and saving a portion of it every month, over time, really adds up and changes things.

In before Henry says you only live once!

The funny thing is that I think Henry is usually spot-on with the lifestyle arguments and people come out of the woodwork to argue against it.

Living in a nice area and a nice place, having a decent car and having expensive nights out (200-400) is massively expensive and really can't be done on 100k a year in a major metro area. It can be done if you don't go out much or don't spend much when you do, but it's no where near "big ballin" and it baffles me how people can't understand it. Just go through the numbers and you'll quickly find you absolutely must cut back in one of the areas immensely to make it work.

Did not grow up wealthy -- typical blue collar upper-middle class family.

Not kidding about not working but somewhat kidding about being a bum. Topics in OOT have tendency of becoming about me if I answer questions fully so I'm trying this new approach.

I have a feeling we'd disagree on a lot of things -- I can tell you right now that you are wrong about a nice car. Obviously a nice car when single really helps but I'm not single and I have plenty of non-single friends who have bought or plan to buy nice cars. I plan to replace my car with a nicer one next year because obviously I see value in that. Driving a nice car is fun and it changes your mood which is valuable. People treat you differently and again that changes your mood. These are small things but things you experience so often that it really matters. Further, I'd argue that a nice car more than pays for itself in doors it opens for you.

My guess is that you'd feel the same way about most of the things that people traditionally see value in so I'm curious if you could answer what is the end game and motivation? Basically if someone is going to have the same lifestyle as a typical middle class person why bother to make money?

I guess the trick is to find something you love doing that is in short supply, but that isn't so easy.

This is very person dependent thought, Henry. I like nice things. I like good food (French trained cooking is my favorite), I like nice clothes, I bought my wife a 13k engagement ring (not outlandish, but in no way cheap), I spend 100-300 every single night I go out. I just don't value an expensive car at all. I don't spend time in my car and I don't really have people in my car all that often so I just don't put it high on my list of things that I'd like to be nice or expensive.

I think it's more just a personal thing. Of course, I know people who are the opposite - don't spend money on food or going out or clothes, but they have a new BMW. It's just a personal preference.

trick is to be in a business that has a trillion dollar+ market cap/day so that your 100k is not even relevant

I firmly believe that when choosing between something you would really like to do and something that pays well that you don't hate, go with the money. Of course there are extreme examples that are pretty easy choices such as having a job you hate making 150k or having a job you like making 100k, it's obvious to choose the latter. In the case of doing something you really like making 35k and something that's so-so making 60k, go with the 60k.

The bottom line is having a decent income makes life easier. It gives you freedom, it gives you choices. This in itself has value. The satisfaction of providing for my family and their future is just as important to me at this point as me enjoying myself. This is a strange shift as I've always only had to worry about my own happiness (in general) my entire life. That slightly changed when I got married, and now it's fully geared towards my daughter who is on the way.

I'd give up quite a lot to ensure her having a good chance at life - and I will make sure she does. It's what will make me happy.