It would have no effect IMO. It's still far more inefficient than a centralized ledger controlled by a central authority (which is the nearest comparison to Ethereum).

Tom - What's my recourse if I buy a good from a merchant that accepts bitcoin and they don't send it?

Call them, wreck their reputation, hack their site, ruin their lives.. But yeh, bitcoin is irreversible.

I ordered a service for 1 year from a site once, that went bankrupt week later. Their site said literally "please dispute/revert any paypal transactions" (as they will file for bankruptcy anyway). BitPay didn't refund my TX (: gg.

Bitcoin is also still far more inefficient at what it does than a centralized ledger, so that point is moot.

The goal of crypto isn't to be more efficient than a database. One of the main goals is to be distributed and decentralized to promote censorship resistance and immutability.


The question was, if POS and sharding were perfectly implemented, what would happen? Would it still be less efficient than a database, yes, duh, but that doesn't matter. Would it be more efficient and scale-able than bitcoin? Most likely.

Is eating fairtrade/ organic food less efficient, more costly, yes. That doesn't stop people from doing what they believe in. Hold long, in 10 years we will see a 20x growth mark my words.

The same as if you sent them cash.

But Bitcoin, unlike Ethereum, is not a centralized ledger. It's decentralized (well, in theory, though it's in a bad state with POW until a new POW is chosen or the mining cartel is broken up).

Right, which is why I don't include Ethereum in that definition. Ethereum is a centralized, replicated, trusted network.

Probably not due to the inefficiencies of a computational network vs. a verification network. Ethereum is not solving a useful problem.

What are the variances with buying a coin like Litecoin with Bitcoin; when bitcoin is down %5 for the day and Litecoin is up %5 on the day? Are you losing %10 on Poloniex?

Depends on your unit of account, or your trading pair.

Can you elaborate on this point?

I'm not an ethereum expert by any means, but the concept is similar to bitcoin except, instead of only transmitting transactional data with each block, ethereum also transmits the "state" of the blockchain or the equivalent to the UXTO in bitcoin.

This would mean both systems are distributed, trustless systems because in both cases you could theoretically run full node that validates every TX back to the genesis block.

Ethereum has no centralized database, and there is no trust needed to rebuild the blockchain. The biggest difference, is that you can "fast sync" because every block has the state attached. So if you select a block buried under enough POW, you can grab that state of the network, re-validate all TX between that state and today's state and you are off and running. Or more realistically, do that process backwards: start with today's state and work your way back through the blockchain until you are convinced that you are following a valid chain.

Does this all make any sense? I dont even know if I asked this right, I am very confused myself. Just do your best someone! I am trying not to throw money down the drain, and I am not sure I can buy some Alt. Coin low if Bitcoin is high/ vice versa.

Say I want to buy with my Bitcoin 1 Litecoin. The current price of Bitcoin is $2700 per coin.

One Litecoin is currently .02 bitcoin.
------

Next trade on Poloniex; I want to buy 1 Litecoin with my Bitcoin when Bitcoins value is $3000

One litecoin is .05 bitcoin

What if Bitcoin goes up to $3500 and Litecoin is .05?

Is litecoin always ~.50 cents? What if Bitcoin goes up or down?

If $2700 BTC/USD and 0.02 LTC/BTC, then the LTC/USD price is around $2700*0.02 = $54

Now if BTC goes to $3500 BTC/USD and LTC/BTC is 0.05, it means LTC/USD price is around $3500*0.05 = $175

This means in that time the markets gained:

BTC/USD= (3500-2700)/2700*100% = 29.6%
LTC/BTC = (0.05-0.02)/0.02*100% = 150%
LTC/USD = (175-54)/54*100% = 224%

Obviously it would highly surprise me to see LTC going that high, but okay.



So if you want to see how much X coin went up (or down) against BTC, you simply have to look at the X/BTC market.



What the ..? There is no 0.50 cents??

All those markets can move in whatever direction they want. Arbitrage bots make sure the X/BTC and X/USD stay in ratio with BTC/USD (with ETH sometimes it actually affects BTC markets instead.)

In the end BTC and alt coin trading is pretty much gambling, although there is a certain skill aspect (I personally think it's very much like poker.)

Grunch: If someone could possibly read from post 1 to the end, this thread is ****ing hilarious.

Case in point.

Thank you Nico! Let me make sure I am understanding you correctly:

Bitcoins price is currently $2700, Litecoin is .02 LTC/BTC =$54

Fastforward, Bitcoin price is $3000 and LTC/BTC is still .02 = $60

In sum, this doesnt mean that we are paying more with Bitcoin for Litecoin. It just means that the BTC/ Alternative coins always change thier /ratio based on Bitcoin price, not thier own.

So its not like I am losing money buying a cheap price alt. with Bitcoin when Bitcoin is high. When Bitcoin goes high I can buy more alts with it? Can you confirm that?

I also just invested $400 worth of Bitcoin into a new ICO CryptoPing. The price is 9000 ping coins per 1 Bitcoin. This is different from the BTC trading tab on Poloniex. This I am sure I lost money if I bought PING when Bitcoin was $2750 vs buying when Bitcoin was low.


Edit: in summary I am just double checking that I am not screwing myself by not getting max value on some buys, sells, and trades.

seems like you might want to hold off on investing if you don't understand this basic concept.

im not trying to be a dick but unless im missing some deeper question what you're asking seems crazy to not understand.

i mean just replace btc with USD n then realize how silly what youre asking is.

Okay so the BTC/LTC is always changing, when expressed in fractions of a Bitcoin the numbers change on LTC based on BTC's price vise versa.

I guess the PING ico is throwing me off, They want to raise 1000 Bitcoins. The price of the Bitcoin could plummet to $100 tomorrow, and when they meet thier 1k goal they would be much shorter on available funds than anticipated.

So when 1 Bitcoin = 9000 PING coins

Am i gaining or losing anything by buying these PING when Bitcoin is 3k or 1k? Because they sure are not getting a specific dollar amount.

I guess my inquiry is moot, as suspected, I just wanted to be %100 sure. Long winded albeit.

What is a good alternative to Coinbase? And Poloniex?

(*has no idea what PING is, so googling*)

Wait wait wait. You are telling me that this "telegram bot" valued itself to 1k+ BTC ($2,600,000) and you want to give them some money? Lmao.

Well good luck.

To be clear: it is absolutely possible that this PING token gains value by some pumping, so don't blame me if you miss that boat. But I wouldn't valuate such bot on more than $10k unless they have some serious revenue already (which currently seems to be .... $0.00?)



At moments like this I kinda wish I had such low morals to raise 1k BTC for some bull**** thing. Just develop some fancy stuff, make simple site, some buzz words, blabla and apparently people throw money at you

Is actually a great working bot that is accurate %95 of the time. Its way beyond a proof of concept and its functional. I am super impressed with it how accurate it is thats why I believe in it.

Believe me, when my friend told me about it I was super skeptical and it seemed shady (probably is tbh) but the app actually works incredibly. I was shocked it worked. It takes volume, trends, parameters into account that are different on each coin. It saves the user so much time. Its a tool, and a coin, which gives it value imo.

Meh, plenty of alt coins can be raised ~10%+ with less than 50 coins. Seems like great concept:

1) Buy 50 coins of alt coin X to make it quickly go up.
2) Tell your (tens of?) thousands of followers: coin X has some great volume and up trend! :O (something about self-fulfilling prophecy?)
3) Your followers will be buying that coin, making price go higher (and some will make profit.)
4) Make profit on your followers.
5) Spend ~$300 per article to be one some "crypto news sites" about your great success and ICO.
6) Get 1k BTC from your followers and repeat step 1 in even bigger ways.

Thinking of it, this concept is indeed pretty great. Mostly for the owner obviously.



But sure, I never even heard of this bot, so I might be completely wrong. Maybe it does have a magical way to have 95% accuracy. Personally I think I would just keep that magic formula to myself if I knew how to predict the markets that well. 1k coins is not that much in trading terms, should be able to gain that easily with 95% accuracy. Or maybe they are mostly "sharing it" because they can make more money that way, like step 2.

If you are shady enough then just look at any scheme that was succesfull when stock exchanges were less regulated and implement it in bitcoin/altcoin. You are sure to make money and some enemies.

When a complete donkey like myself is looking to trade bitcoins I am looking for certian alts with a surge of movement and volatility. Preferably a good entry (Ping is developing indicators for shorting too).

So While I am wasting a bunch of time clicking through tabs and zooming in on graphs looking for movement... Ping gives me a desktop alert of something thats about to pump. It is then my decision to jump in, make x % gain, sell order.

Of course I was like yeah right, but this thing works, its weird, like something does what it says.

IF Poloniex takes in this coin it will do well, thats all im thinking. People are always looking throw money at garbage coins if they are volatile, and that is pure profit for me to take the risk buying this junk at ICO prices.

I don't have a bitcoin account, but I'm thinking of cashing out some money from BOL onto bitcoin. Can anyone recommend which pages to read out of these 800+ pages or PM me?

I have a Copay acct on my phone. Easy. Create a wallet and scan your bar code to the site, or (meticulously) copy the receiving hash into the client when it asks for your wallet address. Don't make even one mistake or your money is gone.

Im Canadian so I can't cash money out from CoinBase. Theres a CDN exchange but its selling bitcoin for 30% higher than its buying, so expect to lose a bunch in exchange rates, even if you're an American on CoinBase. Prob 10% minimum. Not worth it for me, which is one of the reasons I think bitcoin is ******ed. Any other questions PM me.

Hey guys. I use electrum to store bitcoin. I like to get some altcoins like ETH, litecoin etc.


Is there a way to do this anonymously? I believe people mentioned bitcoin is not anonymous but ETH is. Is that true or not? I read people mention its a good idea to do it anonymously with a mixer or somethign like that but i have never done something like this ever when dealing with bitcoin.


Does anyone know if there is a way to trade btc for eth/litecoin and say waves anonymously while using electrum? I believe it has something to do with a mixer. Can someone explain this?


Also another question i want to ask. Assuming you trade btc with someone for their cash... let say they give you cash in person or at a casino for example, are there any traces to you sending bitcoin? Because i heard a while back bitcoin was anonymous but now it isn't? Can someone explain this?


Does it also have to do with your bitcoin address that you use? I heard people mention you shouldn't use your bitcoin address more than once etc. Does anyone else actually do this? Because i mainly use the same addresses when using bitcoin when receiving etc. But people seem to mention its better to have it anonymous such as dont use the same address over and over agin.


Can someone tell me how i could trade bitcoin for altcoins anonymously if thats even possible? I was reading about shapeshift and how its a site that converts btc to eth and vice versa and a lot of other coins. I don't really mind but when most ppl mention its no harm in doing that and requires like a mixer, i wouldn't mind trying that.


Also if using this mixer, does that mean i could still send it with electrum? And how hard would it be to use a mixer? Im not tech savy at all etc.