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Old 03-14-2010, 07:57 PM   #1
SoulPower
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Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Brief history of allegations:

An anonymous poster (who may or may not have had a personal grudge with stoxtrader) starts a thread in HSNL accusing stoxtrader of multi-accounting and shortstacking HSNL games. The thread is quickly taken down and moved to the mod forum for discussion about the credibility of the accusations at the request of stoxtrader. HSNLers question the seemingly preferential treatment given to a paying advertiser. It is ultimately decided that the motivations of the accuser are dubious and the thread stays deleted. A new thread is started by credible HSNLers asking stoxtrader to address the accusations.

Here's his lol response:

Quote:
Originally Posted by stoxtrader View Post
There are online poker players who have used 2nd screenames for the purpose of deceiving others into giving them action, evading taxes, collusion, entering multiple times into the same tournament, ghosting, to obscure previous results and stats, to clear extra bonuses, to circumvent affiliate CPA or rakeback rules, to bypass the pokersites shortstack buy-in time limitation, to teamplay, to share action with others at the same table, to chip dump or otherwise engage in underhanded actions I do not know about. I have never done any of these things. Beyond that I cannot and will not comment on the screename issue, nor can I say why I cannot elaborate further other than to say that my reasons for that are serious and personal.

I have played a shortstack some of the time, I will do this when games are tough and I don't want to just not play, when there is a good game at a "shallow" table, in CAP NL games, or I think it's the most profitable strategy for that particular table. My poker results are shown over my last 650k hands or so in the HEM screenshot below, and they are sorted by stack size. A good percentage of the "under 50bbs" stack size games are from cap tables, where the buy-in is 30bbs. The rest are from 20-40 BB buy-in at "shallow" tables and a 20-50BB buyin at normal tables. The collusion allegation is laughable and completely false.


link to thread in HSNL

If I got any details wrong please correct them.

Last edited by Kevmath; 03-14-2010 at 08:11 PM.
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Old 03-14-2010, 08:12 PM   #2
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

lol at the response
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Old 03-14-2010, 08:19 PM   #3
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

the cover-up is always worse than the crime...

What a bizarrely written response. Did he seriously expect that response to not add fuel to the fire?
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Old 03-14-2010, 09:19 PM   #4
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

In before this thread is renamed "Where did the Stoxtrader Thread Go?" and it is moved to the Coaching forum.
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Old 03-14-2010, 09:56 PM   #5
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about short-stacking. While many find it annoying and inconvenient, it is a legit strategy, and it is allowed by sites, obv.

Multi-Accounting, obviously, is a bird of a different color.

Quote:
I cannot and will not comment on the screename issue, nor can I say why I cannot elaborate further other than to say that my reasons for that are serious and personal.
Am I reading this right? Is he just saying "nunya bizness"? "No comment" is ok in a courtroom or congressional hearing, but it does not fly in a public forum.
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:16 PM   #6
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

I don't really know how much of those hands you can attribute to shallow tables since they just came out recently, but that response is pretty surprising.
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:24 PM   #7
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by bulls_horn View Post
I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about short-stacking. While many find it annoying and inconvenient, it is a legit strategy, and it is allowed by sites, obv.

Multi-Accounting, obviously, is a bird of a different color.


Am I reading this right? Is he just saying "nunya bizness"? "No comment" is ok in a courtroom or congressional hearing, but it does not fly in a public forum.
he is saying he does have other screen names but can't comment
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:40 PM   #8
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

I know nothing about the case, but wouldn't PS or FTP (wherever he plays) catch on the multi-acc thing, especially they acuse villain of having a lot of acc and not only a couple?
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:41 PM   #9
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

No response at all>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>that response
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:52 PM   #10
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

maybe this has something to do with the mystery reason leatherass left? either he knew it was going on and didnt want to out or he was involved and wanted to get out before it blew up?
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Old 03-14-2010, 10:55 PM   #11
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by blocka View Post
he is saying he does have other screen names but can't comment
No, he just said he can't comment. That he does have other screen names is just implied, as he doesn't bother denying it.

And the why is obvious. Multi-Accounting = Cheating, no matter why you're doing it. It doesn't matter if your colluding, sitting in multiple seats at a cash game, or chip dumping or playing at a microstakes game to make a training video. It's expressly prohibited by the sites' TOS's.

He's very much in the same spot Townsend was in last year, imo. At the very least. It'll be interesting to see the sites response.

What sites does he play for? I'm sure FTP, but does he also play for Stars? Also, is he a named pro for any site? These questions would be pertinent to this discussion.
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:12 PM   #12
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
maybe this has something to do with the mystery reason leatherass left? either he knew it was going on and didnt want to out or he was involved and wanted to get out before it blew up?
you posted this twice and it's ****ing retarded.

what you mean to say is, the reason WHY this came out is that Leatherass now has a grudge versus Stoxpoker which either resulted in or came after him leaving and so he leaked it to get back at him.
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:17 PM   #13
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

i agree, that is a pretty good assumption also, but i cant see how my post is " ****ing retarded"
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:24 PM   #14
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

scandal all over stoxpoker these days tsk tsk tsk
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:26 PM   #15
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
maybe this has something to do with the mystery reason leatherass left? either he knew it was going on and didnt want to out or he was involved and wanted to get out before it blew up?
im sure if leatherass has anything, its the he found out and wanted out. if anything at all.

I dont know the guy, but seen some of his work, and he is ***** slapping the games, he has no reason to be shaddy.


seems like a striaght up guy to me. That actually wins at poker. Unlike others trainers, or people who are lucky enough to have gotten sponsored by online site. I think we all know who those are....
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:27 PM   #16
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
i agree, that is a pretty good assumption also, but i cant see how my post is " ****ing retarded"
I made the same assumption as you.

Both theories seem viable.
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:45 PM   #17
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

2007 was the year of AP, 2008 and 2009 were the years of UB and 2010 seems to be the year of Stoxpoker.
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:50 PM   #18
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
i agree, that is a pretty good assumption also, but i cant see how my post is " ****ing retarded"
Leatherass was in a good position at Stoxpoker. There is 0 chance he would have left over something as trivial as this, because while there will be a big deal made out of it, it's mostly because of the coverup and the lame pr statement then the actual infraction
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:51 PM   #19
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by stass13 View Post
im sure if leatherass has anything, its the he found out and wanted out. if anything at all.

I dont know the guy, but seen some of his work, and he is ***** slapping the games, he has no reason to be shaddy.


seems like a striaght up guy to me. That actually wins at poker. Unlike others trainers, or people who are lucky enough to have gotten sponsored by online site. I think we all know who those are....

lol at thinking that LA hasnt known for years what stox name(s) are online. whether or not he is 40putts if he is making $1/hand they are pretty clearly playing in the same games as one another for a lot of hands. there is just no way he didnt know he was playing w/ stox all along and just found out 2-3 years later that it was him. im not saying they colluded or anything like that, just that LA has known his SN for years.
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:53 PM   #20
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffmet3 View Post
Leatherass was in a good position at Stoxpoker. There is 0 chance he would have left over something as trivial as this, because while there will be a big deal made out of it, it's mostly because of the coverup and the lame pr statement then the actual infraction
this is anything but trivial. if this is all true and leatherass is somehow tied to it he risks getting his accounts closed, which is what will likely happen to stox as is
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Old 03-14-2010, 11:55 PM   #21
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucidDream View Post
lol at thinking that LA hasnt known for years what stox name(s) are online. whether or not he is 40putts if he is making $1/hand they are pretty clearly playing in the same games as one another for a lot of hands. there is just no way he didnt know he was playing w/ stox all along and just found out 2-3 years later that it was him. im not saying they colluded or anything like that, just that LA has known his SN for years.
I DONT REALLY know what they are accused of. What im saying is, LA in my opinion is straight up... he kills the games as well.

Not like other trainers, that either dont even play, or are totally dominated at the tables.

Plus hes already involved with another training site, so its obvious hes in it because he wants to be in it.
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:25 AM   #22
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
this is anything but trivial. if this is all true and leatherass is somehow tied to it he risks getting his accounts closed, which is what will likely happen to stox as is
dude.........

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Old 03-15-2010, 12:32 AM   #23
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

what are u saying stocks guys played at the same tables?

lol so waht. U think they want to lose.... lol

Or two guys colluded to get fish food.?


i know thats not leatherass
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:34 AM   #24
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffmet3 View Post
dude.........

are you for real? please tell me you're not. if stox is found guilty of multi accounting over a long period of time, knowing he was breaking the rules and he will get a slap on the hand?
Quote:
Originally Posted by stass13 View Post
what are u saying stocks guys played at the same tables?

lol so waht. U think they want to lose.... lol

Or two guys colluded to get fish food.?


i know thats not leatherass
get off the douches nuts

and no im not saying that they were absolutly cheating, im just saying its something that if it happened (because if its true theres no way leatherass doesnt know about it) then leatherass is directly tied to it. hence my belief that its possible leatherass' leaving stoxpoker could have something to do with this.
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:46 AM   #25
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Re: Stoxtrader Responds To Cheating Allegations In HSNL Forum

Quote:
Originally Posted by kikadell View Post
are you for real? please tell me you're not. if stox is found guilty of multi accounting over a long period of time, knowing he was breaking the rules and he will get a slap on the hand?

get off the douches nuts
haha, i'm certainly not on his nuts, what he did was wrong and i'm not defending him. you, however, are living in some fantasyland where sites take some moral high ground and dole out harsh penalties and there's no point in my wasting my time telling you that you're wrong anymore after this.

tons of people have done unethical things and after the initial uproar dies down, people's mention or caring about it slowly goes away

Last edited by Jeffmet3; 03-15-2010 at 12:55 AM.
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