Only way it good be good news is if somehow GBT was pulling competitors staff for a relaunch. 1%?

This is a perfect example of an NVG thread being filled with complete ******s and their baseless speculation. Does this graph really make it seem like the company is facing a doomsday situation? Should this indicate that Stars has "been doing whatever possible to piss of players" or that the company is rapidly losing its market?

http://i.imgur.com/9H3CO.jpg

The only interesting idea in this entire thread so far is that this might be related to internet poker in the USA. I mean even that is just random speculation but at least it makes *some* sense.

Ironically, there are theories that FTP (or whatever the successor is) might be allowed back in the States because the site will be under new management and ownership (at least for the most part), and will have sorted out whatever is needed with the DOJ as part of the whole restructuring and paying back players.

My hope is that PokerStars is also working something out with the DOJ behind the scenes so that they will be allowed back in, but admittedly that doesn't seem very likely.

Every single other year in the past Stars improved their VIP program, their games or otherwise gave something back to the players at the start of a new year. This year they gave their players two rake increases, one disguised and one not disguised. And that's all. This is 100% about falling profits.

Imo it's very unlikely Stars will be allowed into the US market when it re-opens, and this will see them decline further.

Think about the figure Party paid to be allowed back in. Then think about how much Stars have made while being unregulated and under indictment over the years. Then think about what kind of fine Stars would have to pay in order to get back in. I simply don't think they have the resources anymore to do that.

A lot of posters here don't seem to realise that if the US was regulated tomorrow, it would be without Stars.

Your denigration of others, as is typical on 2+2, is ironic.

Seasonal trends and promos. The older 'gains' were directly linked to their billion hand offerings. More recently, January is when everybody decides they're going to be SNE and puts in way more volume for a couple of months before they give up. This trend is being further exagerrated by Stars actually offering up some sort of a new years promo - rake $4,545.46 in one month and you get a $300 bonus (which then has to be cleared). Obviously it's one of the worst value promos that's ever been offered in online poker, but it's better than what Stars normally gives - which is to say: nothing!

FTP's deal with the DoJ allows them to partner with US companies if regulation happens. Will the the fine print allow FTP to partner with a US company when it's all said and done, though? It is anyone's best guess.

Pokerstars' situation is different(worse). FTP will be for all intents and purposes a different company when it reopens. Pokerstars still has the same ownership, the same people that the DoJ believe violated US laws. If stars owners take a plea deal that involves a felony(which it would), that is reason enough to be denied a gaming license in Nevada.

http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/g...l_criteria.pdf

What a self deluding response. Unfortunately you have to pay for the older data but the graphs don't have a significant seasonal trend. If you think I am wrong you can go ahead and buy the graph on poker scout to see for yourself. Also poker sites have plenty of promotions going on all the time - I doubt that one promotion increased the traffic much at all. Next month your excuse will be, "well duh, they put in a reload bonus" and the month after maybe your next response will be, "uhh yeah but they had that big tournament series" or whatever. Get a grip on reality, sir.

It is people like you who remind me how guys who lose money at poker can still believe they are good and winning players. People tell themselves a narrative about something and they stick with it no matter what the evidence shows.

FWIW
Im sure stars can make a very strong estimation of how many high volume grinders they will gain or lose for the entire year based on Data from:
December to January. (and then feb drop off of high volume grinders) <--New grinder/Old grinders should fall into different cats for Analysis.

They have an annual participation VIP program unlike other sites. They can use pokersitescout numbers, but their Business Analysts should also be independently verifying these numbers, with other procedures to track progress vrs other sites.

Remove all other governmental/apocalypse issues etc
--
*Either way stars program in 2012 is worse then any year prior. + the annual commitment is more detrimental in this new "poker world" we exist in.
**And January is Stars largest month for profit by far

Hahaha. I love it. You're trying to assess the exact financial status of a company based on a 6 month graph taken without context while calling everybody else ******ed. I point out the irony in this and now I'm the self deluded one "sticking with a narrative no matter what the evidence shows". Bravo, sir, bravo. You are the epitome of irony, or at least of 2+2.

Stay classy.

The writer of this piece is Wendeen Eolis who amongst other things is the Agent/Manager of Thomas Kremser, the disgraced TD of the EPT. She has been gunning for Stars for some time and it seems to me to be a flagrant abuse of her column to start all this gossipy witch hunt crap at a time when online poker needs all the friends it can get.

So what if this guy is leaving, so what if the EPT CEO left... these are normal changes in a company. As for Kremser, he was just a Tournament Director who allegedly was bad at matching the prize-pools with the chip counts and was overpaid to do this. His 'departure' is beyond insignificant.

Eolis should be barred from having a column in any poker related newspaper as she is clearly just out for herself.

also it's written horribly.

how the fk does a texan know who teddy sheringham is? i guess you expat? Either way nice avatar

I used to work for PS. But this is not based on any inside information, just public domain stuff.

PokerScout says that PS' traffic fell 19% year on year. The entire market fell 32% YoY, so obviously PS' market share has increased. You could therefore argue that PS are doing worse or that they're doing better. Market size is largely out of their control though so I'd argue that things are going pretty well for what they can affect.

FTP's playerbase must've been at least 66% US, PS' was going to be more like 25%. If you look at the peak times for the sites over time, it's clear that PS was always aiming to increase marketshare in Europe after Oct 13th 2006, when they were hugely reliant on North America. People like Raymer are most attractive to the US market. Once that market disappears, his value falls. That's why he wasn't offered as much. I don't think it's part of a trend.

I'd have said that when the EPT formed it was necessary for its image to have established, respected people like Duthie and Kremser as figureheads (though I think Kremser joined for season 2?).

Now that the EPT is established and probably the most respected poker tour in the world, you don't need their image anymore. You probably still want their skills but they aren't as valuable as they were at the start. So you don't offer them as much money and they might not want to take that contract.

And this is the perfect example of an NVGtard that doesn't realize he's what people are referring to when talking about the stupidity of NVG. The irony here is excellent though, please don't be a level.

LOL Teddy's a sexy beast. Americans aren't as ignorant as most would like to think

poker stars a failing company?

I am currently playing it is 1.36am london time and there is 153,309.

and unless the world ends this 2012 how can anyone say that poker stars will never ever be back in the US. Governments and laws change all the time, this might take a while, but it will eventually happen.

unless there is something we don't know the worse is behind poker stars, for now anyway.

They effed with the banking system in the US, no company that does that will ever get a gambling license.

If the US regulates online poker and droolers can deposit and cash out at will, then the US market will become enormous. Any online site that is shut out of the US will then be relegated to being a second tier player at best, because non US players will want to play where there are lots of bad players and liquidity.

That's why PS may be in deep trouble, although they may still be banking cash now. The key people leaving and rake and VIP program changes are all huge red flags.

I am not at all clear that this is the case. The indictment doesn't discriminate between the sites mentioned. It's not clear to me what PS, exactly, have been accused of doing. Plus, you know, innocent until proven guilty.

The US is not the rest of the world. The total market today is much bigger than the US. PS have about 50% market share. If their closest rival gets the entire US market, PS will still have higher market share. Furthermore, the US leaving made the games softer, not tougher.


Gabi was CEO for two years. Or was it more like 18 months? I've forgotten. HIM coming in was "key people leaving", or in this case, owners moving jobs within the company.

Plus this is the third year in a row they've tried to change the rake.