I noticed that FullTilt heavily emphasize that Rush Poker is patented, so I decided to look into it.

It turns out that FullTilt are not the owners of the IP around Rush Poker, and they have licensed it from a third-party who claims the rights to the invention. The patent has not yet been granted, and is in a provisional state pending review and the grant process. The provisional patent for Rush Poker was filed in July of 2007, and you can read the filing here:

http://www.google.com/patents?id=xh2...age&q=&f=false

An interesting read (you can see the names of the people who make claim to the invention - two guys based in the USA).

The FullTilt website claims that 'Rush Poker' will aggressively pursue any and all infringements of its patent claims. I couldn't find any corporate entity called 'Rush Poker', at least not in the USA - but I doubt they can make a claim against any other site implementing something similar to Rush Poker while their patent is still in a provisional state (anybody can file a provisional patent, getting them approved and granted is a whole other matter).

Rush Poker is really catching on, and there is a prospect that it transforms online poker completely, especially for the more casual player. Is anybody else concerned, as I am, that a single company may hold the right to implement Rush Poker? FullTilt seems to have done a deal with these guys, and I wouldn't be surprised if it is an exclusive deal (which tilt would have paid handsomely for).

I have been hearing about ideas similar to, or almost the same as Rush Poker online for years, I believe it has even been discussed on these boards. If there is any 'prior art' out there, now would be a good time to find it and publicize it, in an effort to prevent the patent on Rush being approved and/or being held up in court.

+1

Rush poker is terrible and will die soon hopefully. Lol @ transforms online poker.

not me, and i doubt very few others either

wait and see abt rush poker future.

Well said.

the rush poker romance has died for me, and on this day of all, valentines day

Quick post....no depth sheeeeet I/M TOO BUZZIN AN ITS TOO LATE(5AM-wtf caps)

i am sure I read that Party (or whoever was the first...) tried to to patent SNG's or MTT's though I'm sure it was the former...

Anyway, I doubet (in my seeriously inebriated stete!) that Rush poker will be granted a patent, it is just a variation on a very established game - 'Poker'.

So IMHO Rush will not get a patent, and if it does believe ypu me that it is some shady business going on related to the soon change in law re online gaming 9ONLINE [POKER0 in the us....and thus peoople making some serious cream in the background.

But yea, whatever.....LIVE PLAY FTW!!!

MY BB/100 Has gone from 2.5/100 after 35000 hands to 1.2BB/100after 50000 from playing Rush. People never played a hand against me are just 3 & 4 betting I'm like WTF. Either get coolered or bad beat. I haven't got a tin foil Hat, but **** feels rigged. Excellent.

This just means that if a patent is granted -it is technically not a patent yet- then they can possibly get some monies from people who have used the idea between the time the provisional patent is lodged and the time the full patent is granted. If they don't get a patent then any poker site using it currently won't have to pay anyone a cent.

[ ] sample size
[ ] tin foil
[x] aluminum foil

Personally I love it. Its very efficient to get 500 hands in an hour (before or after work) without having to jump between 8 windows to do so. I don't miss the ****** banter in the chat window either

Yeah if they had changed the number of cards counted to 4 or 6 and/or changed the value of hands they might have stood a chance. Not likely to get a patent.

And if they got a US one what's stopping any non US sites anyway. Seems like any EU site could challenge any US patent for many years.

As for Rushs popularity doesn't it seem to be at the same number of players as the first week? Which is not bad but certainly not taking over poker.

Let's clear up a few issues of simple patent semantics first.

The Burnside patent application (Application No. 11/316,573) is not a "provisional" patent application. A provisional application has no claims and is not reviewed by anyone at the USPTO. It is simply a placeholder of sorts until an applicant files a formal "utility patent" application within one year of the filing date of the provisional application.

The '573 application is a full utility patent application at this point and the original filing date was December 20, 2005. The document you see in your link is the "publication" of that original patent application. The claims may have been amended by this point in time. And publication of U.S. patent applications is now automatic after 18 months from the filing date (pursuant to 35 U.S.C. 122, 37 CFR 1.211).

Any "prior art" as you suggest would have to pre-date the 12/20/05 filing date.

I don't know where you get this July 2007 filing date for Rush Poker. Nonetheless, provisional patent applications are confidential and are not published for public viewing unless they meet some narrow exceptions.

U.S. Patent law requires that the actual inventors be listed on the application. (This differs from foreign patent practice where the "owner" is not necessarily the inventors listed on a patent application.) Full Tilt may actually own this, but the inventors may be under an employee agreement to automatically assign any IP rights to Full Tilt (and I have no idea who this "Hold 'Em One, Inc." company is - could be a shell company for all we know.)

U.S. patent law requires that the patent show some level of non-obviousness and novelty. Just because a "very established game" exists does not mean there is no room for improvements. Most every patent application that is filed today is simply some "improvement" over a previously known idea/invention. There's even a drafting method for claiming simply the improvement (known as the "Jepson" claim).

So when Full Tilt advertise "Patent Pending" they must be advertising something different to the 2005 document?

.

No. It means exactly that... the "patent" they expect to receive is still pending while awaiting issuance. In the meantime, the "patent pending" statement is notice to anyone else that the method of "Rush Poker" might be soon protected by U.S. Patent laws and that anyone using it at this time may find themselves liable in the near future for actual damages (and potentially additional damages for willfulness).

Pokerballa pls don't do stuff like that.

Epic 1st post anyhow.

Does the U.S Patent Laws have any governance if an Non U.S Poker client wishes to introduce rush poker or the same game under different name. For instance, if ipoker (based outside U.S) comes out with Rush Poker (or a different name) is there much that Full Tilt can do from a patent point of view?

Yes, there are international treaties governing patents. Countries have agreed to protect patents across international borders with the exception of a very few countries who are not signatories to these treaties. In other words, just because it's not in the US, doesn't mean that patent infringement will stand.

isn't that the whole reason a company spends time and money developing an idea, patenting the idea, and then entering an exclusive agreement to license and/or produce that idea?

This same situation exists for thousands of products and/or services you use every day. Automatic Shufflers at the table are patented and leased to the casinos. Casinos that don't want to pay the licensing fees, don't use them.

The key is whether other people can develop similar software that works around the patent.

I wonder if its the same people that made turbo texas holdem

That means your hourly went from 2.5x/100 to 3.6x/100 (where x is number of 100/hr you play), sounds like you should be liking not hating Rush poker.