The sooner dreyfus is out of the community the better .. the " entrepreneur" is the nut low .... Let's go RIO poker lead by Galfond a man of integrity

A guy involved with poker that repaid his debts, albeit late -- he is already better than 96% of every "name" mentioned in NVG.

If they are they taking nominations to the Poker Hall of Fame this month, add him to the list.

fedor still nails a +5% ROI when scammed

Um, I think we know what his best is now.

Reg flag = avoid

Lost it all at the $5-$10-porsche $100 CAP tables

The run good continues

Did you know that you weren't going to send the same day when you made the agreement?

Probably, but he definitely knew the next day, and didn't say anything until he was contacted 5 weeks later. This sure does look like he needed the money, and made the "trade" in order to "borrow" the money with the intention of paying it back when he was able to.

This +1

Does he really need 10k that badly? Thought the triad was hooking him up for a while.

Nice, I loled

I forget loans all the time, even though i write it up, and i get surprised when my telephone blips and says transfer completed, and i have to dive down and look it up, i mean, yeah, its not $20k, but its not $200 or lower either when ive forgot. I wounder how big of a chance either of these guys forgets their loan, especially fedor since he won so much that he can shortstack 1porsche/2porsche games.

You don't have legitimate reasons for being late. You can't ask for a swap and state you will pay back at a certain time and then decide to do something else with their money because it's more convenient for you. That's not legitimate.

Seem to have multi copied the post.... will repost later.

You always type way way too much Sage, it's impossible to read.

Would love to know where the $20k came from. Ponzis are fun.

Now *that*, I can't argue with.

Read through most of it. I agree with him in a vacuum, but after seeing a pattern of Alex lying and weasiling his way out of his obligations I don't think he should get any benefit of the doubt. This was premeditated most likely imo. And fedor likely wouldn't have gone forward if there weren't things that we don't know about (other people he scammed that didn't want to come forward?).

So no, we should let him burn and hope he leaves poker alone (which he won't because he owns gpi and hendon mob)

Of course he should be outed, while this transgression probably had a relatively minor affect on the parties aggrieved it makes Dreyfus look quite sketchy. Who's to say outing him won't save somebody else being scammed in a major way. The rest of your post just seems like irrelevant spew.

This is super harsh outing of someone by some members of the "holier than though" poker community. By all accounts what Alex Dreyfuss, sorry I mean Dreyfuß, did, unless this was a widespread simultaneous multi "borrowing" across multiple players without the debts then being paid off, is not an offense worthy of his whole poker rep being destroyed.

I obviously realise that there appears to be a significant chance the so called "swap" may have been intended from the start to be a loan for Alex Dreyfuss, with him maybe thinking that super rich guys would not be so bothered by a delay, and if he did intend it this way then his calculation was more or less correct, save him then getting outed on the world's most popular and read poker forum afterwards.

Outing after paying back plus interest, albeit that it appears that the "swap" may have been intended as a loan in the first instance is very harsh IMO, in poker where there are a plethora of people who have cheated by on line replacement playing for other players (saw it happening myself multiple times with moderate to good UK players) paying a % of their eventual cash in an on line MTT to a far superior buddy player to play the last 3 tables for them when big cashes were at stake.

Multiple other forms of cheating such as multi accounting and plain playing on someone else's account from the start of a comp.

Collusion at on line cash game tables, especially PLO where the cards already out info is so valuable, and all sorts of other straight up cheating including collusion in live satellites etc etc.

This is not to mention that the whole idea of being a professional poker player is to aggressively profit from other people's losses.

In case you have forgotten, as professional poker players you are producing nothing, there is no real productivity aside from your minor contribution to being a tiny cog in the creation and sustainability of what is a relatively small amount of *real" jobs in the poker industry, i.e. employees of on line and bricks and mortar poker providers and a few television industry people.

Even this job creation, if I can loosely call it that, is not good job creation for society it is quite a few percent below neutral for society, and that is being kind to it.

So to the group of players, of whom there are many, and whose number grows often when someone who has cashed big then joins you, not all players who cash big, but some...... I have news for you, you are producing zero for society, if anything you choosing poker as a profession is having a net negative impact on society, and it is extremely unlikely that you have never committed any of the "offenses" or similar ones to the ones I have described above.

I have nothing whatsoever against anyone at all striving to be and indeed succeeding at being a professional poker player. I tried it myself and half succeeded / half failed (all documented on other 2plus2 posts/threads of mine), but I truly believe that many (not all by any means) successful poker players have applied a an incorrect correlation between how successful they have been thus far, and their own self importance and inflated opinion of their own moral fibre and moral compass.

As far as outing a scammer, a non payer, or a devious person with money, well unless Alex Dreyfuss has multiple done this *and NOT paid back", then IMO you've applied a Grade 8 offense outing (out of 10) to about a Grade 4 offense.

I have experienced being scammed in poker quite a few times myself and the amounts of money were not all small relative to my bank roll.

I am not and never will name any names because a) it was a while ago, and b) I either resolved the situation amicably without publicaly outing the person, or I wrote off the amount I lost as a judgement error by myself that I then learned from.

So can I say also that any player whether they are transferring (swapping) $50 of funds or $100K of funds in an "industry" (poker) that is frankly still run like the Wild West with little or no proper underpinning regulations, bonds or indemnity schemes for backing/staking/lending/swapping of funds, should know that they are doing any/all of these transactions at their own risk and should take obvious steps such as checking their bank balances and when any significant amounts are involved perhaps go further and ask the requester to physically click the transfer buttons on the screen in front of them, or if remote from each other then in front of them on Skype.

No one however wealthy, or of perceived wealth, is a sure fire bet to always act entirely appropriately or honestly.

Allen Stanford, Robert Maxwell, Berni Madoff, and multiple multi national companies false accounting with black holes in their accounts.... etc etc

Now going back to Alex Dreyfuss, I have never met the man and have zero association with him in any way, shape or form, apart from me having a current GPI ranking of 47,493!

And I am in no way defending him, but what I am saying is that I feel that this outing on 2plus2 is overly harsh. Whatever his possible faults, and we all have them, it does appear that he has created some good things in poker, things that some of the people ITT and many others have certainly benefited from during their poker careers.

Sure if someone has damaged their rep through their own poor behaviour then there should be a certain amount of this information divulged/distributed as this is normal in life, but I feel that to basically try to 100% destroy someone's rep based on a Grade 4 offense is over the top.

Hi jadbral:

Dreyfus has also inquired about buying Two Plus Two interactive LLC (this website but not the publishing company) and we have told him it's not for sale.

Best wishes,
Mason

My post was tripled in length as I somehow copied and pasted the spell checked version 3 times. Apologies for that.

If I, as someone who has played a fraction of poker compared to most, outed all of the players I know to be sketchy, of dubious character or just downright dishonest, then I'd have a list of 10+ names.

If everyone in the poker community did the same, the number of people not appearing on any outed list would be small.

So as I said, I believe this is harsh. Perhaps those affected could have restricted their actions to telling only their inner circle. I think this would have been fairer.

Instead they appear to have elevated themselves to judge, jury and executioner, roles that they are not worthy of in my opinion, as they are only Gunslingers in the Wild West, perhaps they are very fair Gunslingers who fight fairly by the rules, but Gunslingers nonetheless.

I am legitimately chuckling at SageDonkey's novel.

How many of them are in the position AD is in? What happens the next time he does five figured "swaps" with multiple people but isn't able to come up with the money next time for other legitimate reasons? How much money has to be involved before it's important enough to warn people? Response in under 10,000 words please

Gplregproblems