So did poker radio personalty and blogger Mark Hoke do anything to warn the general public or did he help perpetuate the scam by keeping silent after realizing things were not gong well?

Yeah, let's blame the victims.

Hi Sellout:

Hoke was also promoting Dutch Boyd and attacking us even though Boyd had lost twice in court. It didn't seem to make any difference to him, so why would this situation, which I know only what I read here, be any different.

Best wishes,
Mason

He also kissed the asses of numerous Lock Poker Pros doing "interviews" w/out ever asking about the pathetic & troubling lack of payouts back in the day.

When I texted him in Chat about raising some real questions to these players.....after reading my text, he just blew it off....said that was not what he was there to do...something about "ambushing" them ?!?!

Anyways, not that I see him as the primary problem here.......hardly a pinnacle of "journalistic" integrity either.

#shill

Yep and I still remember how Boyd screwed me and others with his Pokerspot.

When situations like arise, I always wonder what things would be like if we the poker players could form an alliance of some kind to fight for our interests as a community.

I see what ya did der.

You mean like some kind of union with representatives that would communicate with legislators and fight for our rights and best interest?

It would prove more effective long term to boycott casinos that charge above normal half rake at full tables.

I think it's a great idea! Good luck!

My Friend bought a package off of someone to go to Arba this year and asked me to come with.. I turned him down because I had won my own Package on Party poker to the Caribbean Poker Party Run by Party Poker and Dusk Till Dawn in Punta Cana, Dominican Republic @ the Hard Rock Resort. Great resort and series!

Good thing.. i finished 7th in the 5K WPT there... if it was the same in aruba looks like i would have gotten Steined... Condolences to all players who haven't got paid.

Not so thinly veiled shots at the PPA aside, we would benefit from an organization that functioned well on behalf of players... but it would require players to put money up, and then you'd have a freeloader issue... and most poker players don't take kindly to being freeloaded on, so it'd be hard to get it off the ground.

I'm talking about a lot more than political lobbying, I'm talking about preventing scams, calling scammers out publicly more quickly, and going after perpetrators legally.

Something like a sanctioning body like the PGA for golf and the USBC for bowlers. You would have to be a member to participate in a sanctioned event but the sanctioning body would insure the prize fund and unify rules.

To hold a sanctioned event you would have to meet all the criteria established, and provide a complete accounting.

Membership would be reasonable like under $100 per yr

I actually like this idea very much and would register to be a participating player

Definitely way to go imo even if they added an extra $5 per entry to events and that would have players name and collected by Casino and paid directly as part of running a sanctioned event.

Just seems it would be too hard getting some guys / Gals to pay the membership when due. This way Tourney players are Paying for the m'ship directly from entry and the Cash game guys would be put in the too hard basket to start but when the Association became effective with Rake etc they could pay direct.

Anything that helps stop the continual ripping off of $$$ from Players.

They may own the poker room currently but I am guessing if they are not already kicked out of the Hilton they will be quickly if they don't pay the winners in full- and even if they do they probably will be kicked out IMO.

....they should be.

Inexcusable actions.

Obvious Co-Mingling of Money that never belonged to them. (at best)

No excuses.

HORRIBLE for Poker.

STAY AWAY.

I am in Aruba 5x a year and always play at the Hilton. I will question playing there IF they somehow are still in control when I return.

How about a gofundme page for the players that didn't get paid?

Perhaps an annual fee with an option for an event fee. If you're a paid member, you show your proof of membership and don't have to pay a fee at the event, and those who aren't members can either pay a smaller event fee, or sign up for the annual membership when entering the tournament.

Even if one accepts that argument that this justifies one (I'm far from convinced), it seems extremely premature.

I, for one, have no interest in playing in poker tournaments in which every entrants is a member of a Professional Poker Player sanctioning body.

My thought was more akin to a union that would have each other's back... Everyone pays X amount per year, you get insurance for something like this, or legal fees covered, or whatever is able to be put together. Like I said, the problem is that there would be so many freeloaders it would be hard to get going.

Perhaps just an organization that, if a tour/casino wants to charge an extra $5/buyin or a minimum of X per event they will hire an accountant/lawyer to verify everything is on the up and up and put their stamp of approval on it. The issue there is, are they legally liable if they have an oversight or someone pulls one over on them even? Then that's an issue. This would seem to fit well into something like the TDA since they have an organization in place, but that's just from my (players) perspective.

Unfortunately it's all very complicated and there are issues with almost any solution... which is why this community gets scammed far too often.

One interesting talk I had at the table with a friend was to have casinos handle prize pools and hire a company to market the tour, but all the money is handled by casinos. So in that hypothetical, the PPC would have only been responsible for promotional material and arrangements in Aruba, but all the money would be handled by MDL, Foxwoods, etc... They'd pay the PPC a cut of the rake, or a flat fee, or whatever...

Was this from the two packages awarded at the first-ever (and last) PPC Poker Tour event in Canada on September 6? Did your friend at least get the full value of the package from PPC?

Congrats also in the WPT DeepStacks Championship Calgary, and good luck at WPT Cambodia!

Regarding the bolded part, I was thinking along similar lines. We're all comfortable playing a casino tournament in a well-regulated country, and probably comfortable with the better-known tours (perhaps too comfortable). But we should begin to ask questions about how the money is segregated, and insist that the hosting casino stand behind the prize pool.

We could do this as players, even without necessarily having the support of a formal umbrella organization. It would take community awareness and widespread participation, and clear communication with the casino hosts and tours. Tournaments that don't meet the standard could be boycotted; that would attract some attention. Poker journalists and well-known pros could really help out to spread the word.

There will always be a contingent who will participate because of the boycott - greater fish %, fewer pro's with multiple rebuys, etc. Organising poker players to do anything, even in their own interests, makes herding cats look trivial.

I like this idea, and I think a sanctioning body could be created and maintained for far less than $100 a year. For the USBC, the membership dues are just $20. The USBC standardizes rules for the sport and conditions for lanes and bowling equipment. It lends legitimacy to the sport and those participating in it.

Its not just for pros either. In fact, the USBC is primarily for amateur bowlers, but of course, there is money to be made in amateur bowling because of league and tournament fees etc. and the USBC keeps everything on the up and up.

For poker, such an agency could standardize tournament rules, like the TDA tries to do, and keep track of player's results, while insuring prize pools, and lobbying for pro-poker legislation like the PPA. They could even dabble in negotiating deals for members on things like hotel rooms and car insurance.

Very few bowlers want to bowl in non-sanctioned leagues or tournaments, and over time, I think the same mindset would apply to tournament poker players.

Poker Players wont even boycott Sheldon Adelson's Poker Room. You can't organize poker players to do anything.....

+1

In addition to a largely apathetic poker playing community, I believe that the challenge of expanding poker beyond what it is today, is that it's played in CASINOS who largely don't give a ratts ass about poker. Golf Courses like Golfers, and are happy to host Golf Tournaments. They appreciate & work w/ a Sanctioning Body like the PGA. Bowling Alleys like Bowlers, and are happy to work with a Sanctioning Body like The USBC.

Casinos don't care for Poker Players. We are far from their top priority. Our primary value to them is we or our friends who tag along might pull slots.

They constantly mess around with fees, and absurd structures designed to get poker tournaments over as quickly & cheaply as possible.

A governing body for Poker would be great, especially if it expanded to cover online poker events as well as live !

I have a hard time seeing one succeed tho. (Apathetic Player Base + Unmotivated Casino Hosts) = Failure

It also equals prime hunting ground for thieves & scumbags like the PPC Poker Tour Operators.