Sorry...I made that post at 3am. In my second statement I meant to write that individuals across the autism spectrum SMILE regularly, though not always at the appropriate time. It was in response to the last paragragh in your first post where you wrote:

"Suggesting Peter Eastgate as mildly autistic is interesting. It can explain his rather stoic response when he won the ME as well as his usual demeanor at the table. However, if I'm not mistaken, I did see him crack a smile or two during the NBC heads up. If he is autistic, I would like to know what his personal challenges have been throughout his life, and how he has learned how to cope with them."

In the interest of full disclosure I'd like to point out that I'm a behavior analyst. But also I'm much more interested in autism intervention, and if there was a better method I would learn that instead.

The fact is that ABA techniques are FAR more effective in producing change than all other therapies combined. This is true for individuals with autism who have BOTH high and low skill repertoires. These are not just wild claims. There is a great deal of evidence supporting these statements in the scientific literature.

I'm not saying things like speech, ot, and pt, can't be helpful, just that in general they are usually of much more mild benefit (with exceptions of course).

+1. This thread makes no sense to me.

Very cool thread. I'm really interested to see if any info comes out that Eastgate does have Aspergers.

One of my best friends, i'm sure has Aspergers. He's a trip, but a good friend. He does things that no one can do, and also cant do things that most people can do. For example I found out the other day that he can do the alphabet backwards(he did this fluid, with no practice and he said he's never done it before.). I tell him he has a memory like a hawk. He will remember phrases that I said months ago. He also knows my whole family tree and birthdays/names/ the works. This is all from pieces he picked up along the way.

On the other hand, he can't.....whistle. Found that out yesturday, now I know you are not born knowing how but I would guess most people can do some form of a whistle. When I tried to teach him it was lol awkward, he blows way to hard and rigid, in fact a lot of what he does is rigid. Robotic like walking/talking.

The most amazing thing is, he seems to care about and seeks out friendship and social situations. He definitly has troubles reading faces, I know this because he cant tell if I'm upset by my body language or facial expressions. He's never asked me "what's wrong" or implied anything about my mood. Anyway he's one cool kid, and spite of some blow-ups here and there, a really good kid.

Here's the thing. He wants to learn poker. He knows it's my job, and bussing at red robin hasn't been bringing him enough money lately. I've taken on this task, because he's a friend.

A couple things I've noticed. We are only a few days into this. There are times when I saw "WOW" (he learns fast). He didn't even know the ranks of hands, but obv has those memorized. He also has odds calculation down(working from a 52 card deck). I'm confident he can probably beat micros in much less time then it would take anyone else learning the game from ground up.

The problem is with the variables. Reading people, why people do illogical things/bluffing/ so on. I'm not sure he can get past this. I will say that after almost 2 decades of live play that I was able to beat online play even though I was new by just applying a basic abc tag approach. I'm pretty sure you can play cards "perfectly" and do ok online. Like solid fundamental card playing. Unfortunately that can only get you so far and really should just be a base.

Sorry for the long post, I'll stop now as I forgot what my point was. I am just posting to say that this thread is good, and I hope it grows. I also was hoping to hear from someone with more exp with people who have Aspergers. I kinda need to know if I'm wasting my time, although people are unique, so what's an answer for one may not be for the other. I guess I will just see where it goes.

If a steady income source is your friends goal, then I don't think poker is in his best interest. I think "level thinking" will be very challanging for him. He may also stuggle on putting opponents on accurate hand ranges. Tournaments might be his best bet, because identifying when to shove or re-steal is more easily identifiable.

Definately focus on the math aspect of poker in your teachings. Also, get him a hud to help him put players on hand ranges. When teaching him how to bluff or spot a bluff try to give him general rules that can be observed. (e.g open limping is usually a sign or weakness. min bets are usually a sign of weakness, etc).

When I first read this many years ago , I didn't really understand it , and I still don't.

Here's the part ( I think) I understand :

The 6-deck ( 312 card ) shoe was shuffled according to the casino technique , and then the cards were peeled-off and flipped over one-by-one as Ungar watched. This continued for 3 decks worth ( 156 cards ).

Next , for the remaining 3 decks worth ( 156 cards ) Ungar predicted each successive card before it was flipped over.

Here's what I don't understand :

Did Stuey actually predict the precise card including rank & suit ? This seems impossible to me. Well , not impossible , it could happen but there would be a good deal of luck involved.

Even if

(1) Ungar had total recall of the cards that came off so that he knew for say jacks that only the Jd Js were remaining

(2) Ungar accurately maintained an advanced high-low count , so that he knew the relative probabilities of a high ( KQJT ) vs a medium ( 98765 ) vs a low ( 432A ) card coming out next ,

(3) the 6-deck shoe originally was in factory order , and Ungar had accurately peformed an advanced shuffle-tracking technique so that he knew where clumps of various high/low/medium cards were likely to be present

it still seems impossible for him to have predicted 156 exact cards based on skill alone.

I suspect that what actually happenned indeed was mind-blowing , and indeed demonstrated that The Kid had total recall and also the ability to maintain a number of advanced counts simultaneously. However, some crucial details have been left out of the story.

I guess I'll go over to some blackjack forums and try to get this settled.

if i understand your post, then i think you misunderstand his post

stu ungar did not call out jack of diamonds, king of spades, 2 of diamonds..

it had somethign to do with card counting without messing up.

I think it was a good deal more than this.

I'm in the process of querying "the minds" in pro blackjack circles.

Back later.

still not clear to me what this 6-deck shoe counting is about.

This makes sense if he was counting a 6-deck shoe and knew what the last card would be.
http://www.zimbio.com/Gin+rummy+card.../119/Stu+Ungar
http://wapedia.mobi/en/Stu_Ungar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stu_Ungar

These I don't get:
http://www.blindbetpoker.com/profiles/stu-ungar.html


http://www.32redpoker.com/poker-scho...kid-unger.html

http://www.casinosviplounge.com/stuart-errol-ungar.html

Can you imagine the irony of posting this WHILE in the middle of posting the worst thing ever on 2p2?

Well, it's all based on the presumption that the books reporting of his early life and behavior is accurate, which is probably is.

Childhood things like obsessively (and not just "obsessively" - more like O-B-S-E-S-S-I-V-E-L-Y) collecting bottle caps, stamps, coins, going to race tracks and gathering up all the discarded tickets... making endless streams of lists and relentlessly analyzing data as a small child, not to mention that he has pursued one isolated thing for every waking minute of his entire life with a single-minded determination that is inhuman... When you contrast this against how his 'early life' behavior was reported, not to mention reports of his general style of communication both pre and post Dale Carnegie- when you put it all together, she seemed to think that is was a near certainty he would register and I'd probably agree, even though I'm a layperson going on casual understanding.

The notion that people with autism are '******s' is bullsht.
I would argue that at some point outside of our lifetimes, as society enlightens a bit, certain forms of Aspergers might be considered a gift, in spite of whatever social drawbacks they might carry. She works with these people every day and I've visited the office from time to time. The gifts I've seen amongst these folks- particularly the highest functioning ones- boggles the mind. At times, I've wished there was an "Aspergers Pill" I could take to get a dose of it myself. If I had to trade a bit of empathy and take on some social awkwardness to obtain the abilities/gifts I've seen these guys and gals display, I'd snap-call in an instant.

If there was a way to prove it (which sadly, there isn't) I'd wager that some of the greatest successes mankind has ever produced would probably be strong candidates for high functioning Aspergers.

[QUOTE=Watchmaker;12384632]

At times, I've wished there was an "Aspergers Pill" I could take to get a dose of it myself. If I had to trade a bit of empathy and take on some social awkwardness to obtain the abilities/gifts I've seen these guys and gals display, I'd snap-call in an instant.

QUOTE]

[ ] understands Aspergers

On a flight home from vegas I was really bored and decided to try and count down a deck of cards flipping them very fast with no break in between cards. Then the guy next to me got involved and we did a 50 dollar prop bet who could get the last card the most times out of 10 trys. Now this was completely spontnaeous and I had never even thought about counting cards so I had no clue of techniques or best ways to do it. In my head I just categorized them like you would set up a solitare game and had them all going down in a specific order(Spade,heart,Diamond,CLub) I only got it 2 times but ended up winning. I am sure there are techniques and ways to do it ike mentioned above. I am not saying it's easy but I am sure with pratice a lot of people could do it

Edit: I completely forgot that we stopped with 3 cards left to make it easier and if our guess was one of the cards that counted.

"This Amazon Room is red. I want to go back to the blue room."

very witty

i wanted you to know someone got the reference

Ok, I'm back from my visit with the blackjack minds and powers that be ...

Here's what supposedly happenned with Ungar/Stupak :

Yes, the bet involved counting down 3 decks of a 6-deck shoe , but what is meant by "counting down" is accurately recalling the discards in the order they were dealt.

So ,

(1) a 6-deck ( 312 card ) shoe was shuffled-up according to casino technique , while Ungar watched

(2) 3 decks worth of cards ( 156 cards ) were dealt ( flipped-over ) and placed in the discards rack in the order they came off , while Ungar watched

(3) the 3 decks ( 156 cards ) worth of discards were then dealt back ( flipped-over in same order originally dealt ) , while Ungar accurately predicted every single card before it was flipped over

so ... saying that "The Kid had total ****ing recall" is no exaggeration at all.


I'm currently waiting on word from Mike Sexton and/or Bob Stupak himself for confirmation of the veracity of the story ...

... but I hope this settles once and for all questions regarding Stuey's superhuman abilities , and silences once and for all all the clueless know-nothing haters on this forum ( on other threads ) who have questioned Ungar's amazing abilities -- despite most of them not knowing much about him at all.

Wow, you take the cake buddy.

You managed to create the most insulting post in a thread full of morons saying things such as "I think hes a ******".

Although widely speculated (especially in the Asperger's community), this has never been confirmed by Gates, and thus thread is re-opened.

[QUOTE=savant111;12387225] my son has an Asperger'd Diagnosis. beleive me, you don't want the good that comes with the bad.

where are those posts? I didn't see them.

Not all autistic persons have savant syndrome and not all persons with savant syndrome have autistic disorder. In fact, I'd wager that the majority of people with autism have no special, abnormal talent/gift/abilities.

So in effect, you're not asking for the autism as much as you're just asking for a unique and special ability.

DUCY?

I think this is the most grossly overstated generalization ever written on 2p2.

Do you really believe counting six decks to be that easy? I would allot you an entire year of practice and only then will you see how oversimplified your statement was.

Yeah, it's been diagnosed and been given a Hawaiian title: Msitua

That's what your have.

Yeah, I probably should've been more clear and said "At times, I wish there were an "Aspergers Syndrome Presuming That the Syndrome In Question Is Concomitant With Savant Qualities That Are Sometimes Found In People With Aspergers" pill..." but that seemed a bit too wordy, and I just kinda went with the hope that people would know what I meant.

Guess not.

wat? Isn't this incredibly easy? Or maybe I'm just an aspberger's genius ?

I can memorize a deck of cards (one deck only) and I can also take out a bunch of random cards (5 for example) and go through the deck without stopping and when i'm done I can tell you exactly which 5 cards were pulled out and their suits.

I learned to do this from a book. Can't remember what it was called, lol.

Har har har. I keed.

The Memory Book

The co-authors were Harry Lorayne and former NBA basketball player Jerry Lucas

Good book for anyone who likes to challenge their minds and learn interesting memory techniques.