Negreanu, Mercier, Selbst, Bouree, Seiver etc. The clique that's going to kill poker - Page 9 - Poker News

theplux · 08-14-2012, 01:55 AM

u mad bro?

Lucky LITE · 08-14-2012, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonafiedGreat

People talking about Hellmuth being a poor ambassador for the game have obviously never met or interacted with him.

He gets hounded by tons of people for autographs when he walks into the hall, and signs each and every one always. He might not be the most pleasant guy to deliver a bad beat to, but I have never seen him simply blow off a fan.

Never met any of the other ones your talking about. Glad though that Selbst is getting called out for being a miserable person. Thought I would never see the day where someone insulted her without getting verbally accosted by 20 people on here.

I disagree. I've met him and played against him many times. And I've seen him berate players on multiple occasions when it wasn't necessary at all. He doesn't respect his opponents to the point where he thinks it's ok to be rude to them.

In my opinion, the kids that I see becoming successful in the game today realize that they don't need to be rude to their opponents to win. In fact I think some of them can gain an even more "alpha-esque" advantage by not being rude simply because it shows their confidence in their game that they don't feel they have to cut angle-shooty type corners to win.

Phil Hellmuth is the merge between the very old school where they were serious thugs, to the current old school where they just bitched and moaned about everything. And now we have the new silent thinkers of today.

chip_defender · 08-14-2012, 02:05 AM

Seiver comes across as just an annoying goofball based on what I've seen of him on TV. Mercier seems really laid back and cool. DN's cult of personality/voice of poker gig is tilty to me. Boeree's status in the game seems disproportionate to her level of skill, IMO. She is uber popular and respected, but she hasn't cashed for more than 100k in a tourney since binking that EPT event in 2010. I doubt she will for a long time either. She's a cash game fish, too. Selbst is supremely confident and just seems to get angry at other players for not being as skilled as her. Great player but not a great ambassador for poker.

JustBruce · 08-14-2012, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilbury Twist

Bunch of funny stuff

OMG I was loling so hard my gf in the other room shouted me to be quiet (she is trying to sleep, its like 2 am over here)

again, lol

Polar Beard · 08-14-2012, 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheeprustler

[...]didn't once get annoyed by the constant attention.

I lol'ed! Almost a pleonasm right there

.

DN though.

Ramon Scott · 08-14-2012, 03:42 AM

Why would someone be critical and berate someone who plays a hand poorly? They should be buying them dinner and drinks and making sure theya re as comfortable as possible.

SprattFactor · 08-14-2012, 04:21 AM

This thread is stupid until OP provides examples.

therightdeal · 08-14-2012, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilbury Twist

In fairness, the OP admitted all of the above were nice to him. He just disapproved with said players' treatment of "new" or "weak" players.

On the flip side, the OP has made an open call to a Stars representative to curb "this behaviour" despite not giving any description as to what that behavior is. So it's sort of like this:

OP: Excuse me, PokerStars?
PS: Yes, I'm Mr. PokerStars.
OP: I need to speak with you about Negreanu, Mercier, Selbst, Boeree, Sevier, etc.
PS: Certainly. We are proud to have them all as Team Pro representatives.
OP: They are a clique that is killing poker.
PS: I don't know if they all hang out with each other enough to constitute a clique, but I'm listening.
OP: I need you to make them stop it.
PS: Stop what?
OP: I don't know. But I know I don't like it.
PS: Okay.
OP: You need to curb their behaviour.
PS: If you would provide me with some examples of their actions, I would be happy to help.
OP: They're being prima donnas and you have turned them into monsters.
PS: Again, I would like some examp-
OP: And their attitudes towards new players and poor players is atrocious.
PS: Have they acted improperly to you?
OP: No, they've been fine to me.
PS: I see...
OP: But I've been around for a while.
PS: Ah, I gotcha. But to players who haven't been around...
OP: Yes, they're terrible. Snide and self-important. The atmosphere at the WSOP is being destroyed by these individuals.
PS: I would argue the atmosphere at the WSOP is being destroyed by Caesars Entertainment, but...
OP: I doubt any new players will want to return.
PS: It's worth mentioning that the numbers at the WSOP have increased-
OP: I'd take Hellmuth over any of them.
PS: *spit take*
OP: He treats novices with respect.
PS: Are you sure you're talking about the same Phil Hellmuth?
OP: And he has the humility to know why he is who he is.
PS: Tall guy? Wears a black hat?
OP: And no one takes his rants seriously.
PS: Which is good, because a good portion of the players in this room are from Northern Europe.
OP: You have given too much power to Negreanu.
PS: Now, hang on...
OP: He will damage your site unless he calms down and behaves with some dignity.
PS: Okay, let me tell you what we're going to do.
OP: Good.
PS: I don't know what our current players have done, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that they're damaging our site.
OP: Thank you.
PS: We will fire Negreanu. And Liv Boeree. And Scott Seiver.
OP: And Mercier.
PS: Yes, of course. Mercier, too. And we shall replace them with someone who does a good job engaging players in conversation, despite their experience level.
OP: I appreciate that.
PS: In fact, we'll pick an ambassador who has experience in bringing new players to a site whose reputation has been, as you say, damaged.
OP: Exactly what you should be doing.
PS: Sound reasonable?
OP: Definitely.
PS: In that case, let me introduce you to our new Team Pro... HAL12000, this is Joe Sebok. Joe Sebok, this is HAL12000...

[End scene.]

Wow, you really wasted time typing that ****?

FUrake · 08-14-2012, 06:08 AM

Mercier seems like a relaxed guy, never seen him get out of line on tv, can't understand the hate for him, boeree tho, I have to agree with previous comments in the thread about the remarks/comments she makes after losing a hand aswell as the stupid faces she pulls, she thinks she's someone important in poker for sure, don't really know why, she has some kind if sense of entitlement and as for negreanu have to agree with previous posts about him trying way too hard to be overly nice and frankly it gets annoying

Charlotte FatMan · 08-14-2012, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilbury Twist

In fairness, the OP admitted all of the above were nice to him. He just disapproved with said players' treatment of "new" or "weak" players.

On the flip side, the OP has made an open call to a Stars representative to curb "this behaviour" despite not giving any description as to what that behavior is. So it's sort of like this:

OP: Excuse me, PokerStars?
PS: Yes, I'm Mr. PokerStars.
OP: I need to speak with you about Negreanu, Mercier, Selbst, Boeree, Sevier, etc.
PS: Certainly. We are proud to have them all as Team Pro representatives.
OP: They are a clique that is killing poker.
PS: I don't know if they all hang out with each other enough to constitute a clique, but I'm listening.
OP: I need you to make them stop it.
PS: Stop what?
OP: I don't know. But I know I don't like it.
PS: Okay.
OP: You need to curb their behaviour.
PS: If you would provide me with some examples of their actions, I would be happy to help.
OP: They're being prima donnas and you have turned them into monsters.
PS: Again, I would like some examp-
OP: And their attitudes towards new players and poor players is atrocious.
PS: Have they acted improperly to you?
OP: No, they've been fine to me.
PS: I see...
OP: But I've been around for a while.
PS: Ah, I gotcha. But to players who haven't been around...
OP: Yes, they're terrible. Snide and self-important. The atmosphere at the WSOP is being destroyed by these individuals.
PS: I would argue the atmosphere at the WSOP is being destroyed by Caesars Entertainment, but...
OP: I doubt any new players will want to return.
PS: It's worth mentioning that the numbers at the WSOP have increased-
OP: I'd take Hellmuth over any of them.
PS: *spit take*
OP: He treats novices with respect.
PS: Are you sure you're talking about the same Phil Hellmuth?
OP: And he has the humility to know why he is who he is.
PS: Tall guy? Wears a black hat?
OP: And no one takes his rants seriously.
PS: Which is good, because a good portion of the players in this room are from Northern Europe.
OP: You have given too much power to Negreanu.
PS: Now, hang on...
OP: He will damage your site unless he calms down and behaves with some dignity.
PS: Okay, let me tell you what we're going to do.
OP: Good.
PS: I don't know what our current players have done, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that they're damaging our site.
OP: Thank you.
PS: We will fire Negreanu. And Liv Boeree. And Scott Seiver.
OP: And Mercier.
PS: Yes, of course. Mercier, too. And we shall replace them with someone who does a good job engaging players in conversation, despite their experience level.
OP: I appreciate that.
PS: In fact, we'll pick an ambassador who has experience in bringing new players to a site whose reputation has been, as you say, damaged.
OP: Exactly what you should be doing.
PS: Sound reasonable?
OP: Definitely.
PS: In that case, let me introduce you to our new Team Pro... HAL12000, this is Joe Sebok. Joe Sebok, this is HAL12000...

[End scene.]

YES!! BRAVO! BRAVISSIMO!!

raidalot · 08-14-2012, 09:35 AM

Some of the comments itt are unfair imo. These are mostly excellent players who feed a huge amount of energy into playing well. It isn’t surprising that they feel some pain when things don’t go according to plan and sometimes that expresses itself in annoyance. I have played against all of them to a greater or lesser degree and, okay, they’re not exactly Chip Reese or Barry Greenstein but I wouldn’t put them on any list of bad ambassadors for the game. Fwiw, perhaps these comments might help to explain some of their actions:

Daniel
Very outgoing personality and big ego but somehow deeply insecure. Loves attention from poker fans (especially if they compliment him) and craves approval of ‘the crowd’. Plays up to the cameras. Likes to be the centre of attention at the table. He is conscious of the importance/value of his public image and so avoids being deliberately offensive to players in a way which might leave him open to criticism. However, he sometimes inadvertently offends people because he doesn’t realise the impact his goofing around can have (teasing, doing impressions etc). In a big tourney his mood swings (more than most top pros) with his stack size, even though he tries to mask it. imo his winning tilt is worse than his losing tilt as he starts to banter incessantly and becomes increasingly bubbly/flippant with little regard to the feelings of players who are not doing so well. He can be very condescending/patronising at times without realising how it can come across – its not necessarily malicious intent. However, he can be openly insulting (and even racist) to other pros such as Matusow and Scotty.

Seiver
I haven’t played with him many times but haven’t seen him act unfairly to anyone. He seems pleasant both on and off the tables. He isn’t pleased if he takes a bad beat but nor is anyone. He does have an intense look when he plays a hand but its not hostile.

Liv
Wants to be seen as part of, and have the respect of, the top pro community which may be why some have said she joins in with the clique at the table. Feels she needs to justify her play to those around her which may be why she sometimes criticises other players. Is this a consequence of being a woman player at a table full of (sometimes misogynistic) men?

Mercier
Quiet, concentrating player at the table. Pleasant, popular and friendly person off the table. I don’t really see why his name is mentioned itt. He has a deep understanding of the mathematics and theory of the game and understands beats are part of the variance so he takes them well relative to most others. His laid back personality is in stark contrast to his fierce concentration in the game.

Selbst
She doesn’t like losing! Most of all she doesn’t like losing if she knows she made a mistake. Her anger with herself manifests itself in attacks on other players. That passion and drive, combined with a powerful intellect, makes her a formidable opponent (and would make her successful at almost whatever pursuit she dedicates herself to). Mixed with that is the fact that she doesn’t suffer fools gladly (and there are a lot of fools who sit at poker tables). So, basically, whether its her mistake or theirs, they are going to get an earful! She has a short fuse and seems to have a need to let her feelings out immediately.

Helmuth
If he wasn’t so funny I guess he would be a bad ambassador. He puts 100% of himself into each moment in a hand and there is no way that intensity comes without occasional explosions! But everyone knows its Helmuth and he gets a pass.

holdyourbreath · 08-14-2012, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raidalot

Daniel
Very outgoing personality and big ego but somehow deeply insecure. Loves attention from poker fans (especially if they compliment him) and craves approval of ‘the crowd’. Plays up to the cameras. Likes to be the centre of attention at the table. He is conscious of the importance/value of his public image and so avoids being deliberately offensive to players in a way which might leave him open to criticism. However, he sometimes inadvertently offends people because he doesn’t realise the impact his goofing around can have (teasing, doing impressions etc). In a big tourney his mood swings (more than most top pros) with his stack size, even though he tries to mask it. imo his winning tilt is worse than his losing tilt as he starts to banter incessantly and becomes increasingly bubbly/flippant with little regard to the feelings of players who are not doing so well. He can be very condescending/patronising at times without realising how it can come across – its not necessarily malicious intent. However, he can be openly insulting (and even racist) to other pros such as Matusow and Scotty.

I have the same impression.

Mercier always looks like a huge dbag to me judging by his appearance but apparently he's a decent guy, after all. That's fine.
Selbst always seemed like an angry dyke to me but she has skills, so meh.
Liv Boeree is good for the game because she's good looking and intelligent. That should help get women into the game who think they are hot **** and the nerds will fawn over her. If she is bitchy and has a sense of entitlement that should only help her image so people can put her on a pedestal even more.
Hellmuth used to be very entertaining, don't know about his new zen self. Entertainers are definitely good for the game, though, so go Hellmuth.

superior_45 · 08-14-2012, 09:57 AM

Seems to me the OP is/has/or tried to get in that main stream and rubbed them the wrong way..

People rub others the wrong way when talking in person and that causes them to show intentions of disrespect or disinterest in them.

Deal with it and do not worry about who is the ambassador for poker. It seems to me that poker has become bigger than the people who represent it.

New ambassadors come along all the time and the current ones mentioned will be an afterthought for the most part. IMO

Divided By Zero · 08-14-2012, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grip997

If Selsbt is throwing her weight around at the table just say something like...

"Listen, honey, I hope you're enjoying your Vegas vacation and it's nice of your boyfriend to buy you into the tournament, but this is a serious game of cards. You're gonna have much more fun at the roulette tables. It's a great party atmosphere around there and the ladies just love it."

<3

Sweedy · 08-14-2012, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simonsayscall

Live and online the only people u should ever berate for bad plays are solid regs

I`ll bear that in mind.......