Don't the border states casinos OK , La and such "encourage" Texas lawmakers to keep the state free of most legal casinos and rooms with "economic incentives" especially around election time? Don't be fooled by "bible thumpers" being the reason Texas is a non casino State. We have the same situation and the same lame excuses in Ky.

You are correct that there is a LOT of lobbying cash being expended by those with interests OUTSIDE of Texas.

The bible thumper excuse went by the wayside in the early 90's when lottery passed...I lived in one of those bible thumper Counties that was still dry. By 10AM on the first day of ticket sales, there was not a scratchoff to be had ANYWHERE in the County- sold out.

Lobbying by casinos in surrounding states is the primary reason casinos are not in TX but opposition by bible thumpers and groups like the NAACP are only making it less likely that TX gets casinos.

So the economics of Winstar vs. a timed room at the 1/2 level....

Let's say you win 2 hands per hour, and play for 8 hours.
$3 in rake is a fair average at 1/2, plus the dollar for the BBJ = $4 per pot plus a dollar for dealer tip = $5 total per hand on average.

That's $10 per hour at Winstar on average (lower end) for $80 total, probably more if you play bigger pots.....up to $14 an hour at max rake plus tips.

Winstar is a VERY easy 35 minute drive. Plano is around 50 with variable traffic.

If it were a little bit closer I would be all over it.

You must live out in the boonies because the drive to Winstar is neither short nor easy for most people in the metroplex given the largest highway construction project in the country occuring on I-35. What used to be a 1hr 15minute commute for me has regularly turned into a 2+hr drive the past couple years.

BTW, the $1 drop at winstar is not a jackpot drop. It would be more accurate to just consider that drop as rake.

I live about 2 min from the on ramp of 35N in Denton.

Your math is off. It's roughly 30 hands/hour live. We will keep your estimate of $5 rake/hand and say each player wins 3 pots/hour. That is $15/hour in rake. However, and this is very important, that $15/hour leaves the table. At these games with no rake, ALL money stays on the table and then you pay out of pocket when you leave. This is a huge advantage over a casino that is hard to quantify but definitely important.

Using your math(I'd say its close enough), after 8 hours of play, $1200 or 8 BI is taken out of a 1/2 table. That is f-ing massive! IMO, its more important for the winning player than the exact math in casino rake vs time rake debate.

Ofc, if losing player divides his money($150 for buy in + $50 in his pocket to pay the time after the session) than its the same but I doubt people are disciplinded enough to do it.

Correct. Governor Abbott is so opposed to gabling that he took a $10k donation from the companies running the Oklahoma casinos.

WRONG. Just ask all of the closed abortion clinics in Texas. The religiosity in Texas runs deeper than the oil and gas in the shale fields.

Texas is the gold standard for sending religious based policy to the steps of the Supreme Court.

The lottery is a tax for the poor and generates big profit.


Comparing it to legalized gambling is plain stupid.

The thumpers are not the reason we don't have legalized gambling in this State. And that was the only context being discussed here. Abortion is a far more divisive issue and is actually something that congregations can rile up their flock enough to contribute to...

Legalized gambling, for the masses, is just as much a 'tax' on the poor as the lottery...all you have to do is look at the popularity of -EV gaming combined with the number of Texas plates you will see at ANY casino in Louisiana or Oklahoma.

Poker (and gambling in general) would be best presented as a manner of revenue generation in times of economic distress (such as NOW, as evidenced by the recent budget discussions in the Lege).

100% this. The anti-casino lobby in Texas is nearly all from extra-Texas influential sources of a united Indian Gaming Group who collude to lobby the state legislature to make sure laws that would allow intra-Texas competition for their businesses remain in committee and never make it out for a vote much less have to bother with the Governor. Also don't think for a second that even the Indian Tribe which is officially within Texas, the Kickapoo, aren't in lock-step with these tribes from outside Texas in wanting to keep commercial casinos off the table. Even casinos that operate on the border like Sunland Park Racetrack these same groups collude to keep that casino, which is in New Mexico, a literal stones throw from El Paso & Juarez (about 2 Million combined population) from having any table gaming of any kind (they are horse track and slots only) to protect the casinos in Ruidoso & Albuquerque. Sunland park would be a great place for a poker room and possible other table games, but they are blocked from expanding by the same group. There is another group that wants to put a larger casino in Anthony, NM (border city, north side of El Paso) and it has also be thwarted, but they were proposing only a few thousand slot machines too. The Ysletta group in El Paso is cleared now, like the Alabama-Coushatta by the state for class II gaming (same as Kickapoo at Eagle Pass) but are still blocked by a federal injunction. Still their only plans are slot machines, even though Class II includes poker. Even still both of these are at best Edge Of Texas spots which still require most of the population to drive 2-5 hours to reach, which makes it not really much different than going to the larger, more established casinos in NM, OK, LA. Even from El Paso, Talking Stick or Wild Horse Pass in central Arizona is only 6 hours.

On the pro-casino side is ... ?? a wild card of, as far as I know, uncoordinated groups, most of whom see the rest of this group as unwanted competition and so there is no united front to attempt to lobby the pro side of casino gaming in Texas.

90% of the population of the state is within a 3 hour drive to a casino in NM, OK, LA, or Eagle Pass. So you can imagine if you were able to put a commercial casino, using say, the Southwest Airlines model of Dallas, Houston and San Antonio, most of those driving out of state would switch to playing in state. The question on why to lobby against expansion for those other casinos is what % of your revenue comes from Texas players and can you afford to lose that? The real question for Texas is why do we insist on exporting all of this leisure spending money and potential tax revenue to our neighbors?

This cycle, the legislature is only seriously considering the bill to formally allow daily fantasy sports for money. What will 2019 hold? The race for that starts July 1 . . .

Yes we know. Zillions of players in Texas. The WSOP series stop in Durant Oklahoma at Choctaw Casino is the biggest series event they have consistently.

Texas law gets dictated by no outside influence. Hell, Texas doesn't heed the Fed or the Supreme Court even.

Texas is so rich with oil and gas it doesn't need the revenue.

75% of voters outside Austin voted for Rick Perry election atter election. Don't underestimate bible thumper conservatism (idiocy) in Texas.

Rick Perry never got anywhere close to 75% of the vote. In 2006 he won with just 39% of the vote.

Texas has one of the most diverse economies in the US now. By your logic if oil/gas fell then Texas would be desperate for gaming. Fact is oil prices recently plummeted and Dallas/Ft. Worth didn't even feel it.

So........

At the 1/2 and 2/5 level.....is it more economically beneficial to play at a casino with a $5 max rake plus bonus drops and dealer tips, or $9 per hour in seat rental.

Also.....are the people who own these timed rooms making good money? If they were, you would think there would be one in evey suburb in every metropolitan area.

Think of it this way, if a 1/2 or 2/5 game averages taking $3 a hand being removed from the table that would be roughly $120 an hour. 9 players at $9 an hour is $81 an hour. Which is less?

As for why there aren't a huge amount of these yet? First they are growing as more and more people hear about them. Second there is still some legal risk which I'm sure is discouraging more development.

Thanks for the info. Have they released the actual address yet? I don't see it on their website.

Haven't seen it or specific date yet

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

So I was down in Plano again this weekend for the Holiday. Pretty much the same review of the Plano room. I do now see the full value in tipping a dealer. Two of them this time were so concerned with a bowling conversation with a couple of other players that i don't think they delt 11 hands during their down at my table. I tried to make my displeasure known in a subtle way but to no avail. Next time that situation occurs I will be very direct and less than cordial about it.

how about $1 door and $1/half hr (no rake)
($20/month membership)

Just seeing if that would work for the players

That's exactly what I said dude. Texas doesn't need gaming revenue. Reread my post.

Rick Perry would have been te elected ad infinitum if he lept running by all the mindless bible thumping flock.

$9 an hour. These games are going to spring up like weeds unless one of them ****s up badly enough to shine too bright a light.

What's your rent. What are your expenses? Decent dealer us $20 an hour. Sounds way low.

don't worry on that end...would you play?...you know it will go up over time but only when it gets to 3-5 tables as a promo the low rate

I know the border states are doing everything they possibly can to prevent gambling being legalized in Texas. But, I still think things are changing. What have we seen just in the past few years?

-Riverboat in Corpus Cristi (no poker)
-Riverboat in Galveston (no poker)
-Casino in Eagle Pass that's been there forever (poker)
-Casino in Livingston (no poker)
-Card rooms in pretty much every major city (poker)

Most of these have all opened in the past few years aside from Eagle Pass. I don't know about you guys and gals, but I wonder how much longer Texas will be able to hold off. There isn't much they can do about the Casino's because of Indian land, and the riverboats go out into Federal waters so there is nothing they can do about those either. Finally, the card rooms now have ways to run legit games.

What is everybody's opinion about when it will finally be legalized? Tillman Fertita opening a Golden Nugget in Lake Charles 1-2 years ago had me thinking it was going to be a long time (I'm sure he knows law makers)..but all of these casinos popping up makes me think Texas may just legalize it soon because it's already here anyways..