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Old 02-27-2017, 02:45 PM   #201
restorativejustice
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

^^^^
"... these safeguards are obviously sufficient too..."

LOL

The only safeguard is to not play the guy on the App or have any tech in any way involved in the bet.

Live, in a casino with a dealer, two men enter and one man leave. Period.
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Old 02-27-2017, 03:01 PM   #202
Rich Checkmaker
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

OP wont play live because he is a cheater. i can read between the lines. only way for OP to clear his name is to play really big live vs JM in bobby's room which he wont do he'll just keep saying yeah im willing to play live but lets play on the app instead. stop bringing up playing on your cheating/hacked app and accept the only way to clear your name is to play live. you wont because you are a cheater. until he does play big live he will remain in my eyes and the eyes of any reasonable person to be a cheater. Fernando Rosas aka relazursoul on OFC Pineapple app is a cheater.

this thread reminds me of the chinese DoN colluding ring cheaters who inadvertently outted themselves in an attempt to clear their names.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-stars-791760/

i could be wrong but unless and until Fernando Rosas agrees to play big live vs JM he is going to be seen as a cheater in my eyes. id bet money im right and such a match never takes place.
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Old 02-27-2017, 03:19 PM   #203
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

I am surprised the direction is going, challenging people to play live heads up has a long and cherished history of resulting in enthralling matches.
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Old 02-27-2017, 04:31 PM   #204
Maximose1
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Quote:
Originally Posted by restorativejustice View Post
^^^^
"... these safeguards are obviously sufficient too..."

LOL

The only safeguard is to not play the guy on the App or have any tech in any way involved in the bet.

Live, in a casino with a dealer, two men enter and one man leave. Period.
Haha not sure that's "the only safeguard" from these scary futuristic robot computer scammers!

But if that's the case OP said he'll play Jason live. Why is everyone ignoring that?
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Old 02-27-2017, 04:37 PM   #205
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Lol, acting like live in a casino with a dealer can't be gamed either

I wouldn't want to play in Bobbys if I couldn't reliably spot a marked card (intentional or not)

I don't think JM is shady but lets not act like Bobbys room is some pristine, unexploitable environment
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Old 02-27-2017, 04:47 PM   #206
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Lol, acting like live in a casino with a dealer can't be gamed either

I wouldn't want to play in Bobbys if I couldn't reliably spot a marked card (intentional or not)

I don't think JM is shady but lets not act like Bobbys room is some pristine, unexploitable environment
Lol so what do you suggest then? You could cook up hypothetical's all day that would challenge the security of any form of gambling but bottom line is playing live in a reputable casino is infinitely safer than playing on a 3rd party app that has been known for its cheating.
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Old 02-27-2017, 05:26 PM   #207
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by Maximose1 View Post
Um OP is clearly saying HE'LL PLAY JASON LIVE, but prefers the app and gave the reasons why, and safe guards for cheating. These safe guards are obviously sufficient too. People in the thread are acting like there are CIA level shenanigans going on in the Pineapple OFC App world.

I dont understand what the issue is now? Why hasn't Jason just said ok lets do the Live version of the challenge OP offered?

Also, using Occam's razor, I'm going to go out on a limb and say OP probably doesn't have an app developer mole "feeding him cards" and is probably just pretty good at this game.

Then again PotRipper so I get being careful, just play Live then, OP says he's down.
I love this site. You just can't make this stuff up.
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Old 02-27-2017, 05:35 PM   #208
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by relaxursoul View Post
The second challenge issued is in a live nonapp format.
Jason is waiting for you in Bobby's room. What's the holdup?
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Old 02-27-2017, 05:47 PM   #209
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

App stuff aside, it seems rather odd to demand a bunch of conditions be met before you'll play someone you perceive to be a huge fish.
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Old 02-27-2017, 06:18 PM   #210
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
App stuff aside, it seems rather odd to demand a bunch of conditions be met before you'll play someone you perceive to be a huge fish.
+1

This is what I don't understand for the most part. Why are Natasha and Jason willing to play on an app that can be so manipulated to induce near perfect play and cheating in the first place? It seems odd to me.

Seems like the Mercier duo is doing some back-pedalling to make sure they don't lose their image? Also, if I was Jason and had informed Shaun Deeb there might be some cheating going on, I would pissed if he called them out as cheaters on my behalf, it doesn't seem like he cares that much either.
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Old 02-27-2017, 06:35 PM   #211
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by AEAB1105 View Post
+1

This is what I don't understand for the most part. Why are Natasha and Jason willing to play on an app that can be so manipulated to induce near perfect play and cheating in the first place? It seems odd to me.
lol I was actually talking about OP, but I suppose it can go both ways
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Old 02-27-2017, 06:49 PM   #212
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Ya that was one hell of a confusing post after the +1.
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Old 02-27-2017, 06:56 PM   #213
NoExit
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Does this sound like a:

1. World class OFCP player that's been crushing everyone seeking action
2. OFCP ambassador
3. Cheat

?







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Old 02-27-2017, 07:43 PM   #214
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

I am a little late to the party, but I just read the entire thread.

I will say that I am personal friends with everyone involved in here except Fernando. I don't know him at all and can't speak to that.

I believe that Jason has many reputable and solid points. I don't think he's just making anything up and he's obviously entitled to his opinion. If Jason doesn't want to play you on the app, then that should be respected.

I do know that Jacylnn works very hard on her game and after losing to me over about a 2k hand sample, she asked if I would be bothered if we quit our games. I didn't mind because I didnt think she was a spot at all. I've played with her live and online a decent amount and all I can really say is that I've been given zero evidence that she has cheated in any way.

I think she bum hunts pretty well and I think that people don't like losing to her. It is what it is.
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Old 02-27-2017, 07:47 PM   #215
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

The reasons why I am proposing the live(nonapp) challenge are the following:

1. The challenge establishes a minimum number of hands to be played. It also requires both parties agreeing to devote time and effort to play, as compared to just casual live play that can bring up unforeseen circumstances such as Jason deciding not to play that many hands, Jason seeking to play stakes outside my capabilities, Jason leaving to go to another location to play a tournament, etc. The agreement of a challenge ensures scheduling and time commitments from both parties.

2. Agreeing on a challenge makes it much easier for me to sell more action and potentially play higher than 100/pt. On the app the highest that I’ve played is 25/pt and it was only against one opponent.

The fact that I am extremely willing to play Jason live, does not mean I can just show up and play him at any stakes just because I perceive to have an edge. Calculating the Kelly Criterion for bets with more than one outcome (as such is the case in one hand of OFC) is extremely complex, but there is a very good method to approximate it. Edge/variance approximates the Kelly Criteron (% of bankroll to be bet to optimize growth). Supposing an edge of .2, the approximation would yield .2/18^2=.0617% of bankroll. That would mean that in one bet of one hand of OFC at 100/pt a bankroll that optimizes growth would be $162,000.

Last edited by relaxursoul; 02-27-2017 at 08:02 PM.
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Old 02-27-2017, 08:12 PM   #216
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Quote:
Originally Posted by relaxursoul View Post
The reasons why I am proposing the live(nonapp) challenge are the following:

1. The challenge establishes a minimum number of hands to be played. It also requires both parties agreeing to devote time and effort to play, as compared to just casual live play that can bring up unforeseen circumstances such as Jason deciding not to play that many hands, Jason seeking to play stakes outside my capabilities, Jason leaving to go to another location to play a tournament, etc. The agreement of a challenge ensures scheduling and time commitments from both parties.

2. Agreeing on a challenge makes it much easier for me to sell more action and potentially play higher than 100/pt. On the app the highest that I’ve played is 25/pt and it was only against one opponent.

The fact that I am extremely willing to play Jason live, does not mean I can just show up and play him at any stakes just because I perceive to have an edge. Calculating the Kelly Criterion for bets with more than one outcome (as such is the case in one hand of OFC) is extremely complex, but there is a very good method to approximate it. Edge/variance approximates the Kelly Criteron (% of bankroll to be bet to optimize growth). Supposing an edge of .2, the approximation would yield .2/18^2=.0617% of bankroll. That would mean that in one bet of one hand of OFC at 100/pt a bankroll that optimizes growth would be $162,000.
Take the mercier part out of this for a second. No matter who the person is in this situation, it's weird that you think this person owes you anything. This person doesn't owe you any action. This person doesn't owe you a challenge. If you can't play high enough it's plausible it's not even worth his time to play you whether you are bad or not. The fact that you keep pushing the app is weird. The fact that you constantly are badgering people on twitter/other sites to try to get action from people is weird. If you tried to get action less like a sketchy person than maybe you'd have less trouble finding action.
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Old 02-27-2017, 08:26 PM   #217
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by TheTyman9 View Post
Take the mercier part out of this for a second. No matter who the person is in this situation, it's weird that you think this person owes you anything.
Well said person has been running around telling people the OP is cheating without any proof whatsoever.

That's the scummiest thing you can do in the poker community, so, I'd say that at the very least Jason owes an opportunity to the OP to clear his name.

A heads up live match without the app would solve that - would it not?
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Old 02-27-2017, 08:31 PM   #218
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Well said person has been running around telling people the OP is cheating without any proof whatsoever.

That's the scummiest thing you can do in the poker community, so, I'd say that at the very least Jason owes an opportunity to the OP to clear his name.

A heads up live match without the app would solve that - would it not?
He hasn't been running around telling people the guy is a cheater (according to what has been posted by both sides in this thread anyways). People have asked his opinion, he gave them his opinion. Reasonable and normal thing, whether his opinion is correct or not. If Mercier had made a public post about it or went out of his way to spread a false rumor sure, but that's clearly not what happened. OP isn't owed anything. And certainly isn't owed a challenge at 10% of the usual stakes of the other party.
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:01 PM   #219
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by TheTyman9 View Post
He hasn't been running around telling people the guy is a cheater (according to what has been posted by both sides in this thread anyways). People have asked his opinion, he gave them his opinion. Reasonable and normal thing, whether his opinion is correct or not. If Mercier had made a public post about it or went out of his way to spread a false rumor sure, but that's clearly not what happened. OP isn't owed anything. And certainly isn't owed a challenge at 10% of the usual stakes of the other party.
According to Mercier the app (Pineapple) is compromised (but he can't explain how) and his assumption is that this is how the OP is crushing it?

What kind of sense does it make to continue playing on an app that you suspect is compromised?

The OP already said he'd play Mercier heads up live without the app. Mercier already said that would be the only way they would ever play. Anything else is bull****.
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:16 PM   #220
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

Jason Mercier reminds me of the rigged thread. Everyone is whining that it is rigged and all that, yet every single one of them continues to keep playing. Saying the app is compromised and then continue to play is the same behavior that can be found in the tinfoil hat thread.
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:19 PM   #221
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

You can suspect the app to be compromised in one way (by one player) and not other ways (by other players) and assess the reward to be worth more than the risk of others compromising it. Is that a serious question J.Far?
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:21 PM   #222
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

If you knew an app to be compromised but not enough to keep you from making money, would you stop using it?
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:33 PM   #223
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

I certainly wouldn't be expressing my opinion on 2+2 that I have no shred of evidence for that can only result in people playing less due to being afraid of it being rigged or encourage them to actually find a way to exploit it themselves. On top of that it would make me look like Timmy.
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:41 PM   #224
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by WCGRider View Post
I am surprised the direction is going, challenging people to play live heads up has a long and cherished history of resulting in enthralling matches.
This will obviously happen - in December 2020.
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Old 02-27-2017, 09:48 PM   #225
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Re: Jason Mercier spreads unfounded cheating accusations

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Originally Posted by pghduilaw View Post
Actually, DO's go through the same residency programs as MD's (meaning that they are training together with MD's ). They are actual "doctors" and practice in just about every specialty. You may have even been treated by a DO and not even know it.

So, while some believe that osteopathic schools are inferior to allopathic schools the truth is that they receive the same training and experience before being board certified in their specialty.

However, Your post makes your ignorance of the medical profession very clear.
Just cosigning this.

It is true that people who get DOs usually have trouble getting into MD programs, that doesn't make DO programs quackery. Just easier to get into. All DOs/MDs to the same post-doctoral training required to practice (residency, fellowship, etc.).

Dr. Moskow has plenty of personality flaws on display, such as her need to refer to herself as Dr. in the poker community. But attacking the legitimacy of DOs just shows your ignorance.
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