__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________


Above quote from:

http://www.ultimatepoker.com/about-ultimate-poker/



I did an entity search at the following Nevada website:

http://nvsos.gov/sosentitysearch/



The result shows that the Managing Member of Station Casinos, LLC is STATION VOTECO LLC.

Another search shows that the managers of STATION VOTECO LLC are ROBERT A CASHELL, JR., LORENZO J FERTITTA, ROBERT E LEWIS, and JAMES E NAVE.

The registered agent for both Station Casinos, LLC and STATION VOTECO LLC. is RICHARD J HASKINS.



Please excuse the capitalization. Words that are all capitalized are words that I copied and pasted.

'Owns', not manages or is agent for.... That's essentially how Lederer and Ferguson got off scot free after stealing millions; layers of corporations in the ownership structure clouding who was, or should be held, responsible.

Now tell us what entity owns the UP software and who owns that company....

What we really need to know is which people utimately own and benefit from Ultimate Poker and Iovation, not what Voteco manages Opco, or who the registered agent is etc, etc.

BTW, my Norton still shows UltimatePoker.com as a malicious website so I have no idea what info is there.

Again, I ask why was a change in corporate ownership necessary to launch UP? And why does the organizational structure have to be so layered and obfuscated?

Bacardi, can you please take your noise somewhere else? NGCB will be reading this thread and the OT discussions make it less useful. Regardless of the Iovation issue UB and UP are not the same company. Your constant posting of the same flawed opinion does not change that.

OP asked
Seems on topic to me. Should I start a new thread? I got muzzled on the UP support thread!

I never said or intonated that UB and UP were the same company(s), nor do I believe that. But I would like everyone to do their own homework and decide who to trust (or not).

Let's suppose Fertitta Interactive LLC, which apparently relocated outside of Nevada in 2012, is controlled by Fertittal Acquisitionco, which it appears to be, and the beneficially owners of Acquisitionco, through layers or other corporations, turn out to be the same as Iovation, whose CEO (not necessarily a benefical owner) is commonly understood to have participated in, if not perpetrated, the UB superuser scam...

Do you suppose the NGCB would (or should) be interested? Even if the beneficial owners are not common, do you not believe that such information should be readily available to all concerned given what we've seen in the online poker world over the last two decades?

Seems I may be banned shortly peeps.

I'm not sure what else you would like to be posted in the thread if you don't approve of Bacardi's posts. It has been established that there is a (revolting) connection between Ultimate Poker and former UB operators through their age verification process. NGCB can find that easily in the first several posts IF they decide to look at this thread. That is the end of that issue as far as I can see. What other information concerning this could possibly be further damning or worth posting? Bacardi is continuing research into other questionable connections this company has, which is not only on topic but a service to the community. I hope he continues posting.

Thanks.

For a little dose of what big business gets away with, The Daily Show of May 7 2013 discusses US banks screwing homeowners by foreclosing on their homes in error and offering most of them a few hundred $ as compensation

http://www.ctv.ca/DailyShowwithJonSt...aspx?vp=134208

+1 ....

What about the emails Greg sent me with the god mode programs is that not proof he was involved

Travis, this is Dan Druff.

Post some of the most damning Greg-related info you have in this thread.

For those of you that don't know, Travis Makar was Russ Hamilton's assistant during the period of time when the UB cheating was going on. He holds lots of incriminating evidence against all involved, including Greg Pierson.

I just don't understand how the operators of Ultimate Poker can dismiss this as if it's no big deal, and continue using Iovation's services.

Show some respect to the community!

Also, Iovation's verification software sucks.

I was one of those people who had to send in his ID for proof, because the system either rejected me or gave a "Maybe".

Keep in mind that I've had my social security number since birth, entered all of my information correctly, have credit all over the place, and am over 40 years old.

The fact that Iovation couldn't auto-verify my identity is laughable.

I think most online betting companies use Iovation nowadays, primarily to avoid chargebacks. However it seems that companies don't reallt trust Iovation and do not ban flaggeed players but subject them to a more thorough security check(European market).

What makes you think that? Is there a source to corroborate this claim?

Not sure about Euro sites but I feel from my own personal experience that most/all offshore US facing sites use them. Not PS/FTP pre-BF, but it is used by many current US facing sites.

One would think the bad actor clause in NV would by itself keep them out but since they are two places removed from UP they do not seem to need a license. I hope this oversight is fixed.

I blew off the whole Iovation thing at first but the more I think about it the harder it is to comprehend why NV poker players are giving Iovation, a company that is associated with one of the biggest frauds in the history of online poker, their Social Security Number to play on a regulated site.

My article will be published on Legal Poker Sites shortly about my experience with Iovation and Scott Tom.

.


Lol we won't trust them with our software or into Any part of or network. All we send them is YOUR SSN, address, and personal info.

Not depositing DUCY


This is like giving giving pot ripper all of our ssn's, Id's, and other personal info.. There isn't any other companies that can offer this service?

I'd like to no if you chose this, or had if you had no choice. Was it simply that any site in Nevada that wants a online poker room has to go through these People or no site. Or did you choose to hire these people from UB and this company?

This is insane to me. How the hell does Nevada allow this? They allow this but not pokerstars?

Seems to me that the article answers this question. It wasn't a change in ownership in order to be qualified for online poker. It was a change in ownership requested by the parties involved (Tom Breitling of Ultimate Gaming and the Fertitta Brothers of Station Casinos and Fertitta Interactive) in order to make a deal between them to run online poker.

NV regulations require any signifcant change in ownership percentages of licensed entities to be approved by the Gaming Commission. There wasn't something shady going on, like someone taken off ownership because they wouldn't qualify. Simply the deal to give Breitling part ownership of Fertitta Interactive was approved.

I am digging in now to pull the thread and see what's under the rug. I don't expect at this point to find any nefarious activity on the part of UltimatePoker (although I don't rule it out yet). It looks to me like they are just contracted with a NV licensed service provider (CAMS, LLC), who happens to have Iovation as a third-party supplier for age/identity verification. I think the NGCB simply needs to be alerted to this use of a company (Iovation) connected to the UB scandal, etc. I'll report again after I go through all the info and links provided here. Thanks for the posts.

The company I work for use them, and from the training I had and how the software works I got the distinct impression that most companies use it.

This is sickening

Greg Pierson needs to be punished and should not have been allowed to work in gaming ever again

Just amazing that he is getting a slice of the regulated american poker pie

Here is the letter I sent today to the Investigations division of the NGCB:

This thread has great history lessons that should be entirely rerad by the regulation officials.

The third listed is Molly O'Hearn VP, operations and CoFounder.
She was a large shareholder of Excapsa.

This is just a UB oldboys club

Couple notes;

We don't really know what services iovation are providing as a sub-contractor. Age verification is not their primary direction and they are only one of several vendors used by Verifi (sister/dba of Cams). In fact, Verifi uses at least two device reputation vendors, iovation and Kount. Kount sued iovation on patents a couple years back and lost. What is likely going on here is that Verifi deals with different industries. Kount and iovation have different customer bases. iovation locked up many (most?) of the online sports betting operations but more importantly had Full Tilt Poker as their biggest customer. Anyone who recalls the mysterious account closures at FTP was probably witnessing Greg calling the clock on someone's poker rig because it matched up with his nefarious cocktail algorithm for misbehavior.

So in the gambling industry, it is probably correct to call iovation the "leader" because their black-book database is probably the largest, although Pokerstars probably has something at least comparable inhouse. iovation is growing fast into other industries but it isn't Jamie Dimon level transactions. Instead, they tackled the online dating niche and as of late are going after online usury rackets like payday lenders.

This is all a pretty big part of the film we're working on. Perhaps the biggest irony/issue is that most of the original founders of UB are financial participants in iovation. And iovation got off the ground owing directly to both UltimateBet and (as we will show) the Russ Hamilton dirty-work in handing vicious beatdowns to degenerates and sharks alike. It's pretty typical that coders allowed an error message to exposure their backdoor infiltration of the software, they were never the sharpest tools. The appearance is they never expected to be exposed and people would never know that Mr. Pierson and all his cronies would be helping make the final determination if the average joe is allowed to play poker online when the government finally opened the toll roads.

One of the biggest disappointments is that some original UB investors, including technologists who want to be cleared because they never actually "cheated", remain silent as they hope Pierson doesn't pull the rug with some new Andy Fastow-styled spreadsheeting leaving them wondering where the value went, once again.

Holy **** this company has links to Ultimate Bet? I thought the name was just a coincidence. This should throw up a million red flags. At least the Nevada Gaming Commission is real, unlike the Kahwanake Gaming Commission which is just a shill for the site operators.

Why do you need to know who owns UP? I'm not going to spend my time trying to figure it out. Have at it if you want.

I can't name you all of the owners of the Coca-Cola Company either (would probably take up a ton of paper), but you can probably look up the Board of Directors and the CEO fairly easily.

Good luck with that.

Impossible to say without any even basic details, including even what the change was.

Organizational structures are often "layered". Some reasons may be tax reasons or liability reasons, including separating different assets and having them owned by different companies.

I, of course, don't know what the reasoning is in this particular case for why they are setting it up as they are.





It seems that Iovation being hired by a third party that was hired by UP (from reading this thread I think this seems to be what occured) is not desirable though. PokerXanadu wrote a nice letter to the Gaming Commission (posted above). Hopefully, they do look into this part.

I thought it was pretty clear Ultimate Poker is ultimately owned and benefits go to the Fertitta brothers. The billionaires who own Zuffa, UFC, Station Casinos and whatever else they might have bought recently.