I agree. The law against using credit cards and bank accounts to conduct illegal gambling transactions was on the books since 2006. ESPN (owned by Disney) and NBC (owned by GE at the time) were making millions off of showing people advertising internet poker on TV (on hats and shirts), even when they knew that Internet poker was technically illegal.

Then, all of a sudden on Black Friday, Obama's Dept of Justice decides to enforce the laws about credit card and bank account transactions for illegal Internet gambling and decides to shut down Internet access in the US to the offshore poker sites. Then later the Obama administration realizes that almost everyone actually wants Internet Poker, and that they will loose votes in 2012 election, so they try and wiggle their way out of the mess. Funny thing is that probably the vast majority of US Internet poker players voted for Obama, even though he is responsible for killing Internet Poker for those living in the US (at least for now).

Yeah but rather him than those right wing republican nutcases.

They all tried to stay out of the limelight and not discuss anything publicly until the cases were settled. I am sure that this was at the direction of their lawyers. If they had discussed the case publicly before it was settled with the US Government, then their lawyers would have resigned and told them to get new legal representation.

The reason why Howard Lederer is more in the limelight than Ferguson and the other two guys who ran FTP is because of Daniel Negreanu, not because of any other reason that I know of. Negreanu seems to have some sort of vendetta against Howard and his sister. Maybe Negreanu has some reason for his vendetta based on something that happened in the past, I don't really know. But I don't think that Negreanu is doing the poker world as a whole any good with his rants.

For the record I am an American who hates Howard Lederer and Chris Ferguson because they stole $ from poker players all across the world.

I would submit that the nutcases are the ones who voted the president into office who has killed Internet poker. The law was on the books since 2006, and Bush never tried to enforce it against Internet poker.

In addition to killing Internet poker, Obama seems think it is OK for the Department of Justice to spends tens of millions trying to put Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, etc behind bars for using steroids, instead of doing more important things.

true I hate the DOJ just as much as everyone but they also kind of did a good thing by exposing how scummy some of these poker sites were. It was republicans who created the UIGEA in first place.

No they didn't they took dividends from the company they owned until it was shut down by the DOJ the company was then sold and we got our money back, no theft has occurred.

Maybe they did, and maybe they didn't. What I want to know is what law did they violate (other than than using credit cards and bank accounts to conduct illegal gambling--just as guilty as everyone who played on online sites from the US), and if they did break the law where are the criminal charges? How come all FTP account holders will get their money back?

BTW, if every account holder at Bank or America, Citibank, JP Morgan, etc, etc went to those banks to cash out at the same time (or even in the same year), they would find out that the banks only have about 20% of the money in liquid assets, and that their deposits are not segregated into trust accounts. Is that a ponzi scheme also? Is Social Security a ponzi scheme?

That was completely by accident. They were just enforcing the law against using credit cards and bank accounts for illegal Internet gambling. The claims about ponzi schemes came later.

I guess you will have to explain to me why Bush never enforced it against online poker, but Obama did.

Another possibility is that you are a robot who just mimics whatever Daniel Negreanu tells you to think. I personally am withholding final judgment against each individual involved until I hear all the facts.

Hey Gus, are you enjoying my and the rest of the players' money that HL and the rest of the BODs gave you?
GFY

Actually i feel sorry for Lederer and Ferguson they had a legitimate business based in Ireland that was sabotaged and eventually closed by a foreign legal system. The business was sound (if it wasn't no one would have bought it) and should have made them 100's of millions of $. It was a pain in the arse having to wait to get my money but i blame the DOJ 's arrogant imperialism not them.

While Full Tilt was not a ponzi scheme (aka the claim that Lederer had direct motives and was stealing, which is obviously false), we do know for a fact that Lederer pushed forward Full Tilt taking ROW deposits when it knew that it could no longer pay players and was facing many other problems, financial and otherwise (read into phantom deposits).

I hate how people keep bringing up fractional reserve banking-- the site's liquidity and financial state is entirely separate from the fact that Lederer knew that he could not pay any players and honor Full Tilt's cash out guarantee, and yet he still took ROW deposits. That to me is very scummy, regardless of intent.

What's more, and what I think is far more important to people criticizing Lederer, was that he showed NO remorse for his actions. He saw himself in the right all the way through, and didn't even acknowledge the effect of his actions on those whose livelihoods were entirely changed by this. If you watch Lederer's apology, it is half-apologetic, and it doesn't even address why he should be apologizing, the people its affected dramatically, or any of that.

We know, with all the BF events having happened, that there was nothing stopping Lederer, Bitar, and Co from giving out public statements or explaining what was up. Can anyone explain this in a positive light?

Its pretty clear that Lederer was negligent and uncaring of the players, (not direct stealing like a ponzi) and every other view is pretty wrong

You're right that he doesn't have a clue but he's obviously never going to admit it to himself

A worthy question w the answer being both...

I usually enjoy fantasising about devouring Gusies freckled Danish knob as much as the next man, however he needs to lose his FTP sponsorship deal over this ridiculouslously delusional tweet

The thing about Lederer is he either is a criminal or was insanely negligent with massive responsibilities (the player's money). So whatever the case he is a complete scumbag.

Why? My money is in my account.

You seem to have more facts that I have seen made public. I personally will wait for all the facts to come out.

As to what stopped Lederer, Bitar, and Co from giving out public statements or explaining what was up, that should be obvious. No one who is under investigation by the US Justice department would be foolish enough to say anything during an ongoing investigation (just as the DOJ will not comment about on-going investigations). This is the advice any lawyer would give their client, and I don't know a single lawyer who wouldn't resign if their client didn't heed their advice to shut up until the all legal matters have been completely settled.

Some of the gang of four are still negotiating with the DOJ, but once that is settled (if it is settled) hopefully we will hear more facts about what really happened.

The DOJ(Not Obama or Bush) didn't have Daniel Tzvetzkoff revealing the inner workings of how they did their processing at that time, which made a sting operation much easier. Anyone who thinks the President personally selects every case the DOJ pursues is truly a moron, or more likely some childish ding bat ignorantly and stubbornly defending his political party like an 8 yr. old.

Really? And what makes you think you know more about the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act (UIGEA) than I do? You post (like your buddy) is short on facts, and long on cheap shots.

In fact, I quoted verbatim from the American Gambling Association website concerning the above law:

"In 2006, the U.S. Congress passed the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act (UIGEA) that would ban the use of credit cards and other financial instruments for the purpose of illegal Internet gambling. UIGEA was attached to federal legislation designed to increase the security of U.S. ports during the waning hours of the 109th Congress, and was signed into law by President Bush. Coupled with the 1961 Wire Act, these federal statutes have been in place to combat illegal Internet gambling."
http://www.americangaming.org/govern...nline-gambling

Those who think that it was a right-wing conspiracy should recall that the above law was passed by a 421-2 margin in the House of Representatives and by unanimous consent in the Senate. I wonder where Harry Reid, Democratic Senate Minority Leader from Nevada at the time (and now Senate Majority Leader), was when that happened?

Strangely enough, the Bush administration did not use UIGEA against Internet poker sites (maybe because it was primarily aimed at other forms of gambling, since not everyone agrees as to whether poker should be classified as gambling). But Obama did use the above law to shut down the US access to the Internet poker sites.

It was just a question from Gus. Just cause he doesn't agree with your point of view doesn't mean he's wrong or a bad person.

he gives this interview , just so he get back to live poker . he didn't even wait till American players was repaid before he went back to playing, no class. he kept the company running and deposits coming from row players , even after he knew there was no money to cover. The got shutdown by alderney, lmao you know how bad you have to screw up for that to happen. he never said I'm sorry or apology, instead we get aw shucks we didn't know what we was doing, or idk idk idk. the funny part out of 440 million in dividends , no one had 1 penny to return it was tied up lmao. its also a insult by gus to think poker players hate someone just because of what a pro says. I form my own based on what iv read and went thru during this fiasco. look at the facts gus , if you was a American who hasn't got paid yet , would you want that pos at your table.

The Attorney General (Holder) surely knew, and he was appointed by Obama, and is a close personal friend of Obama, and the Attorney General serves at the pleasure of the President and can be fired at any time (unlike FBI director which is supposed to be non-partisan appointment for 10 years).

Saying that Obama didn't know is a complete cop-out, and I find it hard to believe that the President of the US doesn't know about a major case undertaken by the Justice Department, especially when those laws were not previously applied to the online Poker sites during the Bush administration, and especially when the there was obviously going to be a lot of publicity about it. Maybe a re-evaluation as to which one is the moron is in order.

I don't think any of us has all the facts yet. You are just repeating rumors from the Internet.