FTP Discussion Thread (Everything but big new news goes here. Cliffs in OP)

[Howard Beale]

You are talking 'specifically' and he is talking 'generally'. Each has merit.

edit: @ hdemet

[yesright]

Originally Posted by Hdemet

Talk about false statements and fallacious arguments, drivel and wasted bandwidth......

The price FTP is currently being offered for is completely above what anyone wants to pay for it otherwise someone would have bought it.

In liquidation and with a bidding war for assets amongst a number of potential buyers the final bid and price for which assets get sold will be a lot less than the current asking price and ensure that the maximal amount is obtained for FTP as it currently stands.

...and thats how the REAL world works and not some hypothetical and dellusional world of some misguided individual.

Exactly, just ridiculous stuff being posted now.

I think people reading this thread are more than smart enough to see what is going on with some posters.

[explayer]

Originally Posted by yesright

I have to admit I am vastly more shocked by the reaction of FTP and all its "Pros" (post BF) than to its obvious mismanagement.

The fact they have all said virtually nothing is just mind blowing.

Leaving the players hanging is just really dirty.

Do they realize there were numerous grinders who made their living from FTP and now cant pay their bills?

The same FTP pros are still entering huge buy-in tournaments using the money they sucked out of FTP.

How could anyone do that in clear conscience?

I have thought about this, even if I was just paid to promote FTP and had no say in management decisions I would still feel incredibly guilty that my promoting the company led people to trust their money with FTP.

I know 100% I would not stand by and say nothing.

I certainly wouldnt be entering tournaments while players havnt been paid.

Waiting for one of these guys (or girl) to show some moral character.

these bitches just don't have the balls to say anything, they are already investing our money in new personal identities and security to protect their worthless lifes hiding away from public.

[Howard Beale]

Originally Posted by yesright

While I agree they have been told to say nothing by their lawyers, we all pretty much assume that, they COULD say something without incriminating themselves.
They could at least let the players know they are concerned by the situation.

What about those who are saying nothing but are still playing high buy-in tournaments as if nothing is wrong?

I cant see how anyone can defend that behaviour.

Pray that you never walk in their shoes. Unless you're akin to a sociopath the pressure is indescribable.

[Hdemet]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

You are talking 'specifically' and he is talking 'generally'. Each has merit.

edit: @ hdemet

I'll give you some credit but not him as he is talking hypothetically and completely illogically and without any merit IMHO

[Hdemet]

Originally Posted by yesright

Exactly, just ridiculous stuff being posted now.

I think people reading this thread are more than smart enough to see what is going on with some posters.

Alas it goes with the internet territory but I have never suffered fools gladly and you are right as they are best ignored completely and not worth responding to in any shape or form.

However they need to be slapped down from time to time but that just fuels their egos so its a lose-lose situation:-(

[yesright]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

Pray that you never walk in their shoes. Unless you're akin to a sociopath the pressure is indescribable.

So are you saying its OK to play these tournaments while players are owed?

If the pressure was "indescribable" why would you even be seen in public?

Interestingly if your conscience is clear why should you feel any "pressure"?

If you behave in an acceptable manner and are making what any reasonable person would describe as reasonable efforts to do the right thing then there would be no "pressure".

Are you telling me the grinders who earned a living from FTP and cant pay their bills have less pressure than some millionaire sitting in his mansion.

Or a millionaire poker player playing 10K and 25 K buy-in tournamments with money they shilled from FTP.

Reminds me of Ifrah telling everyone Ray Bitar was having a bad day.

Maybe the bad day was caused by himself.

The players did nothing wrong but play on FTP honestly and donate rake.

[Howard Beale]

@yesright:

Have HL or CF been in these tourneys you speak of? I don't follow the tourney news but maybe you mean Seidel? Are there others that I'm unaware of?

I think that I can confidently state that ppl like HL and CF are going over years of actions in their heads trying to recall what they may have done that can be used against them in a criminal case. They may be in physical luxury but not in mental.

[momo_the_kid]

Originally Posted by Howard Beale

@yesright:

Have HL or CF been in these tourneys you speak of? I don't follow the tourney news but maybe you mean Seidel? Are there others that I'm unaware of?

I think that I can confidently state that ppl like HL and CF are going over years of actions in their heads trying to recall what they may have done that can be used against them in a criminal case. They may be in physical luxury but not in mental.

yeah. To add insult to injury to all former FTP players who have a lot of money stuck, Seidel just played and final tabled some big tournament as if nothing happened.

[Hdemet]

Originally Posted by momo_the_kid

yeah. To add insult to injury to all former FTP players who have a lot of money stuck, Seidel just played and final tabled some big tournament as if nothing happened.

WellI sent this to The Epic Poker League Ethics committee (ethics@epicpoker.com) and am currently awaiting an answer.......

Dear Sirs

I note with interest and applaud your stance regarding David “Chino” Rheem after he won your inaugural event as poker needs to have a clean cut image and seen to be doing the right thing.

However I would like to know what your stance is on the involvement and participation of any Full Tilt Poker shareholders in your league either as players or within your organization itself?

They have obviously received dividends over the years that are now seen as having come from player deposits in one way or another (directly or indirectly) and as such have benefited financially to the detriment of completely innocent players who signed up to the site and who look likely to lose $100’s of millions between them.

Just find it very interesting that you have no public opinion/statement on this as the current Full Tilt Poker debacle and the missing player funds is to say the least a significant event that has brought poker into greater disrepute than anything else since the UB/AP controversy.

Your soonest response with your comments would be appreciated.

...and got this out of office reply earlier today so we will see if a full reply is forthcoming.

Thank you very much for contacting the Epic Poker Standards & Conduct Committee. We have established this committee to help the league ensure fair play, good character and integrity in every aspect of the league’s operations and further enhance the professionalism of poker. We take every communication that comes to the attention of the committee very seriously. Thank you again for taking the time to connect with the Committee and supporting the Epic Poker League in enhancing the professionalism of poker.

Stephen Martin
Independent Ethics Advisor
Chair, Standard & Conduct Committee
Epic Poker League

[momo_the_kid]

Originally Posted by Hdemet

WellI sent this to The Epic Poker League Ethics committee and am currently awaiting an answer.......

Dear Sirs

I note with interest and applaud your stance regarding David “Chino” Rheem after he won your inaugural event as poker needs to have a clean cut image and seen to be doing the right thing.

However I would like to know what your stance is on the involvement and participation of any Full Tilt Poker shareholders in your league either as players or within your organization itself?

They have obviously received dividends over the years that are now seen as having come from player deposits in one way or another (directly or indirectly) and as such have benefited financially to the detriment of completely innocent players who signed up to the site and who look likely to lose $100’s of millions between them.

Just find it very interesting that you have no public opinion/statement on this as the current Full Tilt Poker debacle and the missing player funds is to say the least a significant event that has brought poker into greater disrepute than anything else since the UB/AP controversy.

Your soonest response with your comments would be appreciated.

+100000000! well done! sir!

[Hdemet]

Originally Posted by momo_the_kid

+100000000! well done! sir!

I also included the out of hours reply I got this morning from them by editing it in if you go back to the previous post.

be interesting to see what they say or if they comment but reckon it will be something lame but we will see.

[WhoWhoOwl]

Harry, a while ago you talked about a deal that you said worked out in the best interest of everyone involved. Is that still ongoing?

[jhn_lundgren]

Originally Posted by Hdemet

WellI sent this to The Epic Poker League Ethics committee (ethics@epicpoker.com) and am currently awaiting an answer.......

Dear Sirs

I note with interest and applaud your stance regarding David “Chino” Rheem after he won your inaugural event as poker needs to have a clean cut image and seen to be doing the right thing.

However I would like to know what your stance is on the involvement and participation of any Full Tilt Poker shareholders in your league either as players or within your organization itself?

They have obviously received dividends over the years that are now seen as having come from player deposits in one way or another (directly or indirectly) and as such have benefited financially to the detriment of completely innocent players who signed up to the site and who look likely to lose $100’s of millions between them.

Just find it very interesting that you have no public opinion/statement on this as the current Full Tilt Poker debacle and the missing player funds is to say the least a significant event that has brought poker into greater disrepute than anything else since the UB/AP controversy.

Your soonest response with your comments would be appreciated.

...and got this out of office reply earlier today so we will see if a full reply is forthcoming.

Thank you very much for contacting the Epic Poker Standards & Conduct Committee. We have established this committee to help the league ensure fair play, good character and integrity in every aspect of the league’s operations and further enhance the professionalism of poker. We take every communication that comes to the attention of the committee very seriously. Thank you again for taking the time to connect with the Committee and supporting the Epic Poker League in enhancing the professionalism of poker.

Stephen Martin
Independent Ethics Advisor
Chair, Standard & Conduct Committee
Epic Poker League

Ask this joker Martin why Andy Bloch (a FT owner) is on the Standard and Ethics Committee and ask him if any FT shareholders are shareholders in the Epic Poker league.

[Hdemet]

Originally Posted by WhoWhoOwl

Harry, a while ago you talked about a deal that you said worked out in the best interest of everyone involved. Is that still ongoing?

Practically dead and almost no chance of success now :-(