So lets say we're down to about 75,000 left, and the new BBJ is starting at 25,000, leaving 50,000 that is "missing"

You then posted this
My first question is, did you put the "(the next)' part in there, or did they? If you did, then I'm sure my explanation will be correct, and even if you didn't, still a distinct possibility.

They probably took the 75K, figured how much they were estimating to need to cover those 150 and up daily prizes, taking into account that the BBJ could be hit again tomorrow, and knowing they need to be able to pay that other stuff from this fund, and decided that 55k would be enough.

Knowing this, they started the next BBJ off at 25k (15k more than the ten thousand minimum they advertise, this is a GOOD thing) and left the 55k in the reserve part.

The way to see if they really are screwing people, (and good luck getting to see any books with these numbers spelled out for the public) would be to see if they put all of the BBJ drop into the actual paid out amount until it is equal to the reserve, getting their 50% paid out numbers back in line, or if they just skim off the reserve instead.

sort of along the lines of what was said here

BBJ is really, really bad for poker - just another way for the sites and casinos to stiff their customers.

I will be boycotting any casino in london that offers a bad beat jackpot and would encourage others to do the same.

How much in admin fees?! thats absurd. What a rip off.

Bad beat jackpots

Their bad beats

I understand people are looking to give the benefit of the doubt.

I wanted to also, but have been stonewall for info. And I have just found out that at least 2 people who PM'd them on facebook the links and asking for a reply have been deleted from their facebook page.

There's probably a perfectly reasonable explanation for this too.

I wasn't going to post in this thread, but since I have played at Empire 5-10 (ages before bbj) a couple times, and know some of the people that work there I can say with near certainty that money has been stolen.

I stopped playing there because it is a dangerous casino with open entry and robberies every week outside, and the fact that three times I have caught three different dealers skimming pots. The dealers work out of trays to collect tokes and make change, and they were as brazen and unsophisticated as possible about stealing from the pot. They didn't fire any the dealers after I mentioned who, when, where, and for how much.

I did win a a few grand each time I played there (was by far softest game for a time), but too many negatives in playing there. When I found out they had a BBJ I laughed because I knew they could steal 5x as much now.

Admin fee 66600 £ ??? thats plain robbery imo

Indeed. That's the worse part about this jackpot drop, it's another cash cow for the Casino.

If you're a regular there, and believe me there are some guys that are there every single time I go, imagine how many pots of over £25 you could win in a year. Now, from every one of those pots you're donating £1 to the fund. If you're not lucky enough to catch big the loss runs astronomical.

£5-£10 at the Empire ? Nice level !

I completely agree. Yet some weeks I'm there 4-5 nights out of 7.

Yep, I've definitely seen a guy that looks like your avatar playing poker down there OFTEN.

Now Fox is just up the road, it's an easy enough decision to skip Empire.

There's a reason only 1-2 goes now, and I just told you it. This is why I never post truth because the tards come out always. I'm sure the money got stolen and nobody cares they have been robbed blind. So many sheep in the world. Sheesh.

Haha yup, I'm part of the big poker-playing Albatross community.

Depending on how people feel about the BBJ situation/the allegations of stealing/cheating/etc, that may indeed be the case. I know I'll still be playing at the Empire though...

£66k in admin fee's is scandal enough. God their is so much shady **** going on even with above board 'reputable' companies operating in the UK it makes me sick. Check the betfair stealing money from their customers just recently. This industry really is crooked at times.

If they actually took money from the BBJ fund to give WSOPE seats that is an utter utter disgrace. I will never set foot in that casino.

I asked questions on facebook, now i'm no longer a friend, i've not played there for a year either, at first because of this BBJ.

Staff I know think it can all be accounted for and have mentioned that the free seats to the WSOPE came out of this BBJ, was anyone aware of this at the time?

BBJ are bad for poker, when administered like this it's almost like the casino's want poker banned as a live game.

So bad for London poker on the back of the Palm Beach/WPT scandal, it's up to the Empire now if they want to do the right thing, and give something back to the poker community they have clearly stolen so much from.

Such BS that they can 'add seats' using money collected from the BBJ.

Even worse is their silence on the issue.

I've told a bunch of people about this and will not be returning there to play cash.

I first set foot on the Empire poker room in December 2008. At the time the action was VERY limited. Normally only one or two tables of £1-£2 going and a sad self-dealt game on the side. There was a "pro" playing there almost 24/7, wearing some sort of 80s tracksuit and oversize shades, who played more like a whale on a super heater ( and eventually ended up in poker hospital ). I hope that's not you LOL.

Kidding aside, the room became VERY popular in 2009, and I've seen some £2-£5 going on occasionally ( but back then it was very rare ) and even heard of a £5-£10 on once. Other than that your story does not add up. I would appreciate if you could keep the discussion civil. Ta.

Where would YOU recommend playing live cash games in London then ?

Don't think this has bee posted.

awesome video of the BBJ being won.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StfWM...layer_embedded

It's a shame because for low level cash, i.e £1/2 and £1/3, the empire had ridiculously soft games. Probably the softest in London.

Just play at the Vic now.

bbj isn't bad for poker. shady sites and casinos are bad for poker. bbj is the singular reason that a lot of casual players show up. whenever i go to the casino, its pretty much all anyone talks about, which is annoying, but definately not bad for the game. most places don't have too many problems with it, because most places don't steal or mislead their customers.

All of this aside, pretty sick that they give 50% rakeback to everybody through daily rewards and the jackpot.

It went every thursday for a bit, that's why I came to play in the first place. The 2-5 was the game when I played one night which then became a 5-10 as night went on. Don't try and discredit what you don't know when it might create doubt whether this money is stolen.

I know some employees at the Empire for a long time, I know what is up. I used to play the Vic monkey game in it's golden day downstairs so I know my way about London poker.

London poker used to be better (more lucrative) when it was monopolized by the vic, now the action is spread too thin and there are too many new unprofessional thieving people. The dealers at the vic used to be the best in the world and ran a tight ship in the big pl games. Now there are only horrible dealers across the spectrum of rooms, and they are put there by incompetent staff who are dishonest a lot of the time.

no

international or the vic