how are there still people left without Sage on ignore list?

Because within what I say are certain things that are relevant and worth reading or considering. You should listen to all people's voices whether you agree with them or not and process everything to your own benefit. I have learned a massive amount from things posted on 2plus2 but would have learned a lot less had I been routinely blocking people because they disagreed with me or I did not like their writing style or their beliefs. You also never know what someone may write of great value or interest in the future.

The best way to shorten or stop my posts in a thread is to defeat me/prove my points wrong using logical debate.

Whether you agree with my conclusion or not that the video didn't work as a satire, I did at least flush out a confession from SrslySirius that a deep-seated dislike and perhaps resentment or jealousy of DNegs is a factor in some of Doug's anti DNegs output.

Sage, please write shorter posts

Better to be a WiseMule, or a SageDonkey, than a DumbAss.

Talking of which, SageAss, the so called unbalanced narrative may be due, just maybe, ever so possibly, due to the fact that the vid starts off with Doug PLAYING THE ROLE OF NEGREANU and giving NEGREANU'S viewpoint on the POY points system, and then at the END of the video DOUG POLK presents DOUG POLK'S view on the POY points system.

Sadly I doubt this will make it any clearer to you!

Incidentally, have you ever come across the word, "obtuse"?

how are there still fish left in poker?

lolhumans

Yes I get that he was playing the role of DNegs at the start, however, within that segment he gives clear evidence that DNegs' viewpoint on the POY points system is in fact correct.

This makes the whole basis of the vlog contradictory and therefore nonsense.

As an aside, this IMO should make people question who is the more genuine of the two vloggers. Many people keep saying how genuine and normal a guy Doug is and how he is natural, but I put it you that when push came to shove and he saw DNegs muscling in on his vlog space territory that he had no qualms about ordering a "Code Red".

Sage, the whole thing was a spoof until the end, so why should it be logical and consistent, as the root of lots of comedy is based on absurdity and nonsense.

The opposite ends of the debate were well presented, that it is cool for anyone to win, by winning massive fields with low buys in, or that it could be more balanced towards the high buy in events.

Negreanu's vlog is very helpful in showing the grind, with min cashes being a drag, as I guess he is up 20% on his buy ins, yet has cashed in around half his tournaments, which is a brilliant achievement, yet has not made much money, so it shows how hard it is to make money live, with total misses or near misses for major wins.

Both are giving back to the poker community, and getting back too, and they are even giving free comedy lessons to teach humour to those lacking it...

On the Eeyore side, Wikipedia helpful explains, "Eeyore (i/ˈiːɔːr/ EE-or) is a character in the Winnie-the-Pooh books by A. A. Milne. He is generally characterized as a pessimistic, gloomy, depressed, anhedonic, old grey stuffed donkey who is a friend of the title character, Winnie-the-Pooh".

Enough said!

Like a few others you are ignoring that Barry Greenstein was ranked 4th/5th. This is ample evidence that DNegs is correct and that Doug's attack on him, however well (or not so well) comedy crafted was gratuitous and a bit spiteful.

Yes you can indeed pass off the whole vlog as a spoof, however there were too many personalised attacks on DNegs' character and opinions for it to be passed off as a harmless spoof in this instance. Doug is basically suggesting that DNegs is some kind of moaning moron.

Make no mistake, these vlogs are big business for both of them, and it seems that Doug cracked first and resorted to a below the belt attack vlog, which is a move away from his usual more balanced and better thought through output.

It's a vlog-off!!!888

Greenstein being ranked 4th or 5th did in fact add a layer of complexity. If he was perhaps 11th, or maybe even 9th, the point would have been made more clear. As an extreme example to illustrate my point, imagine if he was 2nd place or even in the lead. In this scenario, the video makes close to almost no sense at all.

I think I can look past the erroneous mistake when it comes to Greenstein, but then it becomes crystal clear once he realizes that he is not near the lead, that the race does matter to him indeed.

The point that you bring up about Doug's relentless attack on Daniel is also critical in understanding the dynamic between the two. Both of these power players are making money hand over foot, besides the consistent stream of youtube money, but also with their respective businesses.

What is most eerie to me, is what is Polk's goal with these constant attacks? Surely he cannot think that repeatedly attacking others within the industry, looking for laughs at their expense, is something that we can be alright with? Are we going to have no standard as a community to stand up, and let the world know the fine points as to how the world should conduct itself?

I think its only a matter of time until we see everyone's true colors. I am excited to see this unfold, although I will admit that we all know my analysis is both fair and likely correct. I just hope we dont see more videos that are of this poor of contextual quality.

Worrying at all about POY is nonsense. Back in the day when there were far fewer events with a greater variety of events it was reasonable to play nearly all of them so it would make sense to maybe have a POY. Now that isn't remotely reasonable so any way of calculating POY is going to be absurd.

The POY is merely a marketing ploy, and the WSOP seems to want to steer it away from established pros. It makes sense.

Which is the point of the video:

1) The POY race is absurd and no system will accurately measure all-around play.
2) The WSOP is trying to excite recreational players by giving smaller buy in big field events more weight, and that is probably best for poker overall if those guys start to brag about being the 15th best all around player or something and decide to play higher stakes.
3) Daniel whining about it is absurd and deserves a level of mocking.

funny thing is, Doug's relentless mocking of DNegs might actually cost him his job. The way I see it, the only reason Stars are keeping him on board is because they can't afford to fire him - with his massive following among recreational players, him speaking out against Stars would cost them tons of money. However, the very second DNegs begins to lose his credibility in poker world, they will be looking to cut him loose.

Kinda lose-lose situation for DNegs, the more he shills for Stars, the more likely they are to fire him. Ofc, it wouldn't be the case if he was able to shill in a less obvious/******ed manner.

It is possible that Negreanu is correct about POY and that he is some kind of moaning moron.

It'd be funny if they were building a manufactured feud that gets both of them more views.

He'll never be fired. Come on. He's usually one of the few players at a table who attempts to inject some energy into it and give the appearance of having fun while winning money. That is very good for Stars and quite possibly his only redeeming quality. Maybe if he starts shunning everybody like a ****ing child like he did with Doug in One Drop, he'll be dropped. But that's not happening.

+1

Actually, your analysis of the Polk video is so skewed by your blatant dislike of Doug Polk, that you clearly wont see value in it, and will keep twisting it round and round until you can find something about it to complain about, even if, in reality, your cause for complaint is entirely imaginary.

So I think you are kind of alone in your interpretation, "Doug is basically suggesting that DNegs is some kind of moaning moron".

More a case of saying, "Doug is basically suggesting that DNegs is obsessed with winning the POY, even though DNegs has criticised the format of the POY that he is trying so hard to win, and Doug then suggests that a POY that gives lots of players a real shot at winning it, may be fairer than an elitist competition just aimed at a limited number playing high roller tournaments."

I say, I say, I say, Why did the chicken cross the road? To get to the other side. Something that the wisest donkey this side of the tracks can analyse for days. And then deconstruct for hundreds of pages online. To an amused or indifferent audience.

Can someone ban SageDonkey/WiseMule. It's getting ridiculous when he creates new accounts to reply to himself.

Well, I mean it's the same company that brought on Kevin Hart and possibly Tito Ortiz... I don't think they really care about poker credibility.

Lol, I am not WiseMule and mystified as to the identity of this kindred spirit. Hopefully their views are genuine and it isn't a level. I'd imagine a few lurkers agree with my viewpoint but for practical reasons don't want to declare it under their known user name. I'm sure many lurkers also think I'm an idiot.

I do have a second account which is the Mikey_D one which I created to parody Mike Dentale in the run up to his HU match with Cate Hall.

Cool name though, WiseMule, and I need all the support I can get. Hopefully CleverColt and BrainyBrumby can join the cause too.

Incidentally, I neither dislike or like Doug Polk, because I don't know him. But never fully trust any poker player unless you know them very, very well and always assume that they are always money motivated first and everything else is of lesser importance to them.

I had no idea he did that.

If it's true, it's really sad. Doug isn't some kind of internet bully... he is actually pretty respectful to some players who invite ridicule, like Dentale; but he always says exactly what he thinks when it comes to poker-related issues, like rake, angleshooting, people getting ripped off.

From what I've seen, it seems like DNegs feels he's being attacked and he's an innocent victim, but really he's just getting called out on his BS and any ridicule he's getting is entirely because of comments he made and a stance he deliberately took on rake.

Yes... so?

i had such high hopes after wisemules first post

A bit like vbloggers filming themselves approving their own actions...

Let's try to get him back into his cave.