DN v 2eazy/Negreanu bashes Hellmuth (upcoming PAD cash game) on Mediocre Poker radio - Page 11 - Poker News

DMoogle · 04-15-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cubicle

Why can nobody "buy" that playing 4 tables is different than playing 1? It absolutely is...especially for a live player that is used to no time bank and 30 hands/hr.

Yeah I can't believe for a second that anyone can, when playing their absolute best, play the same with 4 tables than they can with one. 2 tables probably, mayyyybe 3.

There's too much action to follow and completely analyze every single hand that takes place to determine the best possible play in upcoming hands.

I do believe that a lot of people often play better while playing four tables than they do playing one table simply because of the boredom that one table can cause (and thus cause the player to not pay as much attention as they could when playing their best).

noteye · 04-15-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRanch

Daniel for the most part is a losing gambler. He got crushed online when he used to play on Fullcontactpoker (Antonious and others heads up and he was always the fish in full ring high stakes nl)...he got crushed betting high stakes golf matches (doyle, dewey and company)....he got crushed for over a million one night in the Big Game....He has been publicly crushed repeatedly on High Stakes Poker....

Daniel is a great tournament player and has made the most of marketing himself. But if he had to make a living strictly as a cash game poker player, Daniel would be busto many times over ( and was in fact a busto poker player before his tournament success).

Not hating on Daniel (in fact I find him very entertaining), just stating the facts.

So where do you get you facts from? Oh wait there assumptions but close enough, right?

You see him lose on HSP with some sick bad beats that no one could get away from some of them, 3 times on HSP he got beat by quads, 3 and only 1 time did he have a weak hand, JJ and that was an over pair to board.

Don't you think he couldn't be a winner at 100/200+ limit games? That is what he played before the NL boom.

As for "busto", every top pro has been "busto" at some time in the early career but not all will admit it. Then about the gambling on the golf coarse, you only hear 1 story about him losing and boom you have him doing it every time he goes out to play.

No one knows how much he wins or loses but the one thing Daniel does is tell you when he loses but he is modest when he wins, unlike Phil H and a few others who only tell the stories of there big wins and never mention a losing session.

Gorgi24 · 04-15-2009, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Negreanu

Because my approach isn't traditional or robotic, mutli-tabling would take away from my strengths whether online or live. I don't ever want to learn how to mutli-table, because I don't want to ever play poker on auto-pilot. I just won't enjoy it as much.

Wait, are you saying Durrrr's aproach is traditional and robotic??

Gorgi24 · 04-15-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Negreanu

I'm just going to address a few things that were mentioned:

1) I'd be willing to make a substantial sized bet that I can play 10,000 hands of 10-20 NL online and be ahead after the 10,000th hand.

2) I made it very clear on that show and during PAD that I don't think I'm a favorite against Durr, Ivey, PA, and Gus at NL cash. They all play against each other on a regular basis, know each others games inside and out, and are all great players. I would never rule out the fact that if I dedicated myself to that game that I could improve in areas where I needed to and beat that game.

3) PH claims again and again to be the best NLH player in the world. I call him out on that, why not? I don't ever call out PA, or Durr, or Gus or any of those guys, do you know why? They never make such silly claims. Most people seem afraid to tell PH the truth- I'm not. He simply doesn't have the necessary tools to beat guys who play that game for a living on a regular basis. PH thinks he can, I don't think he has a shot, so I put my money where my mouth is.

4) I'm human, so is Phil Ivey although he's a lot less human than most. I have varying degrees of play, sometimes I play poorly, make awful decisions, pay off in spots when I know I'm beat. On HSP, I'm also a bit spooked too and I think that's pretty natural. I've had some really crazy, strange things happen to me on that show and as much as I'd like to think it has no effect on me, I'd have to say it obviously does. That set gives me the heebie jeebies!
I can also play well. I have an F game and an A game, and all the letters in between. Ted Forrest once said the following and I thought it was genius: most poker players compare their BEST game to their opponent's worst game. For example, if they see them play poorly in a session, they wrongly assume that the player is incapable of playing better. That's a mistake.
Ted made millions playing cash games because people always had a story about him, "Wow, did you see Ted call two bets on 3 with 8-5-2 rainbow? He's the worst." Ted often looks like a genius or a complete buffoon at a poker table. Assuming that he is "all buffoon" is a mistake people have made against him for years.
When judging a player's skill level, Ted taught me to not think in a vacuum. To not assume that if a guy is playing poorly, that he is always going to be an easy target. That mood, bankroll issues, life issues, luck, and fatigue all play a role in the ebb and flow of a player's skill level.

During HSP it should be obvious that I was pretty card dead, flop dead, and when I had a little something...I was beat. That alone makes it tough to be creative. Your table image is already shot and moves are to be expected so they become less effective. I made one move with K-9 against Barry G. and he shipped on me with A-K. Had I been winning in the game, it's much less likely that he would have made that play. When you are losing, and your opponents may think you are steaming, you just can't get away with nearly as much as you could if you were ahead.

5) I've been surfing online forums for over 10 years now. After 10 years, you develop some pretty thick skin! I love poker, I talk about poker, and read about poker. When I see a thread where I'm mentioned I'll usually pop in and see what the fuss is about. Then if I feel like adding my two cents, I will, as I just did.
Don't kid yourself, though, and think that random posts made by people I don't know will make me cry, lol :-) I can take it, and I don't mind at all. I like all kinds of humor and don't mind being made fun of from time to time. Whether it's my hairline (I'm not bald!), my sexual orientation (I'm not gay, you can safely abandon that fantasy now), and I'm not past my prime in poker (I plan on having a big WSOP this year).

don't get me wrong I don't think you suck or anything. I think you are a pretty good pro, but I would bet my roll that you cannot put 20k hands in a month and be up

Davino · 04-15-2009, 11:54 AM

Good luck Daniel!

Heisenb3rg · 04-15-2009, 12:18 PM

What negreanu says makes a lot of sense.

Im not the very best in my games, but I've crushed online limit up to 50/100 for a pretty substantial winrate throughout my career...

If you look at my play on two given days, It's so laughably bad that I have some people claiming I either

a) Suck
b) Medicore spazz monkey
c) Genious

99% of the people have no idea what it's like to run very very bad while playing in tough games and the psychological hurdle required to play well when losing. When you are in a game as indimidating as a TELEVISED show HSP against the best in the world it makes it even harder
I guarntee a lot of excellent excellent players would crumble in that environment.

So he's probabily not on the level of ivey, durrr, antonious... But... so?

He's obviously pretty sick at poker, and has unique insight into the game.

Hellmuth has some good things going for him but is also a joke in many ways (his behaviour is more childish than anyone ive seen)
DN just calling him out on it.

OnlineHandle · 04-15-2009, 12:28 PM

seems like DN is including terms like he has 3 years to complete the bet will ensure that it will never happen because no one is gonna want to escrow the money for 3 years.. wp Daniel

PinG · 04-15-2009, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1p0kerboy

Racist ban imo.

bwahahaha best one i read here in a while

the clêaner · 04-15-2009, 12:32 PM

Give D. Negreanu a break. He isn't among my favorite live players, but I think people saying that he isn't able to win at 10/20$ underestimate him alot, especialy if he 1tables. He will adapt pretty fast and exploit some of the weaker regulars at that level. If he only 1tables, it would also be pretty easy to game select really well and only sit at really good tables and take some fishes money. Remember, this is a guy that has survived a long time in this business and used to hustle pool for a living.

sircuddles · 04-15-2009, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnlineHandle

seems like DN is including terms like he has 3 years to complete the bet will ensure that it will never happen because no one is gonna want to escrow the money for 3 years.. wp Daniel

Or maybe it's because he only plays one table at a time and has better **** to do than spend 500 hours just to 'prove' he can beat 10/20 to a bunch of internet poker retards.

Even his own challenge to himself (the micro challenge) he has said will take more than a few years.

Vermillion · 04-15-2009, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the clêaner

Give D. Negreanu a break. He isn't among my favorite live players, but I think people saying that he isn't able to win at 10/20$ underestimate him alot, especialy if he 1tables. He will adapt pretty fast and exploit some of the weaker regulars at that level. If he only 1tables, it would also be pretty easy to game select really well and only sit at really good tables and take some fishes money. Remember, this is a guy that has survived a long time in this business and used to hustle pool for a living.

/thread

bulls_horn · 04-15-2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gorgi24

don't get me wrong I don't think you suck or anything. I think you are a pretty good pro, but I would bet my roll that you cannot put 20k hands in a month and be up

Did you LISTEN to what he said on the show? He readily admitted that he's only capable of focusing properly and focusing on one table. Assuming 50 hands/hr, so it would take 400 hours to play 20k hands. There's only 744hrs in a 31-day month.

The guy would crush you at any mix game live, who are you kidding? Please, enuff with the high-nosed attitude.

noteye · 04-15-2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2eazy

ok lets do 250k , but gotta be min 75k hands with no timeframe, 2 easy to run well in 10k hands. if you rinterested let me know where to post the 250k

Why not make it a 100k hands or a million? How about if we make it till the year 2015?

He offered the bet at 10k hands and $250k. I would guess the $250k could be negotiated but the hands I don't think so. Just look at how long PA and Durrrr have been playing and there just at 11k.

I know he is for real about this bet, are you?

PK123 · 04-15-2009, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the clêaner

Remember, this is a guy that used to hustle pool for a living.

Damn, that sounds pretty intimidating...

noteye · 04-15-2009, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcorbin16

2eazy i suggest mentioning this in HSNL for everyone to get a bit of action.

ill def throw some bones down if u up the minimum hand requirements. 10k hands is so dumb. takes one solid day to play 10k hands.

1 day? He said he ONLY plays 1 table. So if he averaged 100 hph, played 24 hrs straight, that would be 2400 hands. I am going to assume you are not a math guy.